Illegal Aliens rallying across US today

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It's wasy to say "build a fence" but doing it is another. There are ecological impacts a fence will have on an evironment and one case is that of the jaguar. The jaguar migrates across the souther border and the fence would prohibit this. I say screw them, they'll find a way over but other tree huggers I know think this is reason enough to not build the fence/wall.
 
It's wasy to say "build a fence" but doing it is another. There are ecological impacts a fence will have on an evironment and one case is that of the jaguar. The jaguar migrates across the souther border and the fence would prohibit this. I say screw them, they'll find a way over but other tree huggers I know think this is reason enough to not build the fence/wall.
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Well, that and the fact that it wouldn't work anyway. It's a long border, and they sell both shovels and ladders in Mexico. So gigantic waste of money.

More effective would be increased BP presence and more equipment (increased use of thermal sights, motion detectors, etc.).

And, of course, as was suggested increase enforcement against their prospective employers. Make employing illegals a risky enough proposition that the savings simply isn't worth it. No jobs, much less reason to risk death wandering across the desert. This would be by far the most effective method of reducing the flow of people across the border.

At that point the only remaining reason to attempt a crossing would be to have a baby here. (Somewhat) easily fixed. Deport mom, give her the option of taking the baby or not. If the baby stays, it goes in the system (though I'd want to see some improvement in the foster/adoption system before I'd accept this). If it goes, it keeps citizenship and can come back when it hits 18 (no questions asked). But then permanently disallow any child from sponsoring family members for citizenship if they were born in such a situation.

In other words, I firmly believe that if you're born here you should be a citizen. But I see no reason your parents should get to tag along.
 
Unfortunately bob, one can find doom and gloom videos like yours anywhere one cares to look...not very thought provoking, nor unbiased in their attempts to create mass hysteria...bad propoganda, I'm afraid...I'm not worried.
 
In theory, there should be. For instance, on my Montana voter registration form I have to provide either a valid MT driver's license or a Social Security Number.
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Neither an SSN or a drivers license have anything to do with citizenship status. Illegals often obtain one or both.
 
In theory, there should be. For instance, on my Montana voter registration form I have to provide either a valid MT driver's license or a Social Security Number.
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Neither an SSN or a drivers license have anything to do with citizenship status. Illegals often obtain one or both.
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Yes, and they're often forged/invalid ones. If they do obtain valid ones, it's with forged documents...at which point we're just talking about general voter fraud which is an entirely different issue. Or if the election departments in various states aren't bothering to actually punch DLs/SSNs into the computer to ensure they're valid, then that's a general election security issue...which ought to be fixed.

And assuming they have the documents necessary to obtain a valid DL/SSN, why would they take on the extra risk that committing voter fraud would entail? If the folks in this thread are to be believed, they have no interest in being Americans...they're here to work and send money home. We don't get paid for voting. Registering/showing up to vote is just one more chance to get pinched by la migra.
 
If the folks in this thread are to be believed, they have no interest in being Americans...they're here to work and send money home

"Being" an American and getting the benefits of being in America are 2 different things, as far as bennies go, showing up to vote and keep the gravy train rolling is a way of ensuring the benefits of being in America.

Aaron,

Long time no chat, good to see you here.
 
JuanCarlos....

While it's true that a SS card and a DL have little to do with citizenship, those are qualifying documents on the I-9 form that we're all supposed to fill out when we take a job, so they're relevant to this discussion.

As to the validity of those documents, few seem to realize that there was a (free) way for employers to validate SS numbers up until GWB took office. Clinton/Gore set that up as part of Al Gore's "reinventing government" project in the late 1990's. IIRC, the Clinton administration wanted to make use of that service mandatory for all employers, but it never got that far. Shutting down that (purely voluntary, with no penalties for not using it) program was the US Chamber of Commerce's first request and #1 priority for the incoming Bush adminstration. If memory serves, it was Bush 2.0's first executive order. This is nothing more than preserving "plausible deniability." "What? Those documents were fakes? How was I supposed to know?"

Now do you see where the problem lies?

--Shannon
 
If memory serves, it was Bush 2.0's first executive order.
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Not sure about the history of that order, but the free Basic Pilot Program is out there for all employers to use. It simply works. Dunkin Doughnuts was one the first to use this program. The sin of the Bush administration is that while they provide this program they do not force it's use. Some cities are requiring it's use, but the irony is that ICE claims to want to stop illegals, but the Fed's will not force the use of the very program that will do this. Just to show how little this program sees the light of day you here it said all the time that it would be good to have a program to check legal status....it's here already!

https://www.vis-dhs.com/EmployerRegistration/StartPage.aspx?JS=YES

If you make employers use this program then you will not have illegals working at that company. This program already has a reputation among illegals. If they know a company is using this program then they don't even bother to apply.
 
I think this is relevant to this thread. CNN just said that three of the five terrorist that planned an attack on Ft. Dix were illegal Aliens. I feel this points to the security side of the illegal problem. We discussed mostly here the issues about jobs and social services, but we should not forget the security side of illegal immigration. I don't mean most illegals are trying to do harm to this Country, just that we need to understand & control who enters this Country.
 
JuanCarlos,

Yes, and they're often forged/invalid ones. If they do obtain valid ones, it's with forged documents...at which point we're just talking about general voter fraud which is an entirely different issue.
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Uh, I’m not sure what point you’re making here, but it certainly isn't a different issue. The issue is whether or not illegals vote, which in and of itself is fraudulent. If their validating documents are fraudulent, or obtained by fraudulent means, they’re still capable of voting. Bringing us back to the original point; illegal aliens can and do vote in elections.

And assuming they have the documents necessary to obtain a valid DL/SSN, why would they take on the extra risk that committing voter fraud would entail?
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Again, obtaining a valid state ID or DL has absolutely nothing to do with an individuals citizenship status. Obtaining one is relatively easy, and is only intended to verify identity not legal status. Once a state ID is acquired, registering to vote merely consists of filling out a form, ensuring you check the box stating you are a U.S. Citizen and mailing it to the state. Simple logic suggests that a person willing to fraudulently obtain a state ID would also be willing to fraudulently register to vote.



How's it going glock glockler?
 
Tennessee gives out DL to ileagles that have no ID. If you are a citizen, then you have to have an ID. They get started on a one year permit, not many questions asked. Nashville is over 24% Hispanic and growing.
 
Tennessee gives out DL to ileagles that have no ID. If you are a citizen, then you have to have an ID. They get started on a one year permit, not many questions asked. Nashville is over 24% Hispanic and growing.
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As far as I know Montana does not give out DL's to illegals. I'm saying so because according to the DMV, proof of legal residency is required to get a DL...but I could be wrong, and there could be exceptions. That sounds like something you guys should be leaning on the state to fix.

I'd be interested to see a cite on that 24% number, too. I've got this one and this one that make that seem pretty unrealistic. The numbers I linked are a bit older, obviously...but to see a growth from less than 10% to 24% in seven years in a city that size is pretty extreme, and unfortunately I'm not going to buy it unless you've got a quasi-respectable source on it.
 
The numbers I linked are a bit older, obviously...but to see a growth from less than 10% to 24% in seven years in a city that size is pretty extreme, and unfortunately I'm not going to buy it unless you've got a quasi-respectable source on it.
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Well it's not like they didn't have any kids in these past seven years. And it has been statistically proven that genetically latino women are more fertile than any other ethnic group. (covered that in biology)
 
Here's a general article on the fertility issue...

http://www.city-journal.org/html/16_4_hispanic_family_values.html

I also located one (Hispanic) source that listed the Hispanic population of the Nashville area as around 200k(?). I'm looking for something more in-depth.

EDIT: I think this gives fertility data. Still reading it...

http://family.jrank.org/pages/774/H...tino-Families-Demographic-Social-Indices.html

Ahhh, here's something...

http://www.acf.hhs.gov/healthymarriage/about/talking_points_en.htm
 
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