Negligent Discharge at Gun Show
- Thread starter LewSchiller
- Start date
Personally, if I was at a gun show and someone realized I was carrying my CCW, it would mean I had not taken adequate steps for proper concealment. Concealed is concealed, period. It should not come out of its holster at a gun show unless you are defending your life. In terms of the "carrying a CCW" at a gun show, the issue should be a moot point because IT SHOULD NOT COME OUT! The person who might pull their CCW gun and try holsters at a gun show is someone who doesn't have the common sense to be carrying.
But just because others aren't safe and responsible with firearms doesn't mean the 99% of us that are should be completely disarmed at a gun show just because there's an abundance of guns.
FWIW, in my state, only federal and state buildings are no-no's for concealed carry. If a property owner has it posted, and they discover you're carrying, you must leave when asked, but you won't be met by police at the door.
But just because others aren't safe and responsible with firearms doesn't mean the 99% of us that are should be completely disarmed at a gun show just because there's an abundance of guns.
FWIW, in my state, only federal and state buildings are no-no's for concealed carry. If a property owner has it posted, and they discover you're carrying, you must leave when asked, but you won't be met by police at the door.
Aguila Blanca
Staff
It is not a moot point in many jurisdictions, because if the show has been posted and you choose to ignore the sign and walk in with a loaded pistol you would be guilty of criminal trespass. If caught (it can happen) this is a felony charge in some states.ryan3465 said:
That's not a "moot" point. That's a potentially life-changing consequence.
Why can't we just follow the rules? If you don't like the rule -- don't go to the show.
Moreover, I thought one of the rules for this site is that we don't advocate illegal actions. Yet it looks to me as though a number of people in this thread ARE advocating carrying into gun shows and shops even when the show or shop is posted. That's simply not legal in many places.
I actually don't disagree with this as long as it is legal where you are.
And most of the shops with signs that say "no carry", "no loaded weapons", or "all guns must be loaded and cased" simply don't want to be surprised by someone walking into the store with a loaded shotgun in a ready position, or some dipstick whipping out a loaded handgun without warning. They don't want people (people they don't know) handling loaded guns in the store. They don't want to get robbed or shot, and they want to know when it's going to happen. I'm honestly surprised that more dumb customers don't get shot, or get guns pulled on them.
I pulled in front of one of the local shops one day and put my gun in the glovebox. The owner saw what I did and asked me when I got into the store. Told him I put away my CCW, because of the sign. He told me "The sign's not for you, it's for the idiots."
Gun shows ought to be a similar situation. That's why they have someone checking you at the door.
Brian Pfleuger
Moderator Emeritus
I have not seen any suggestion that anyone should carry past these signs, specifically when it would be illegal. If there is such a post that we may have missed, please use the report post button.
zincwarrior
New member
In Texas I know many CHLers who won't go to shows if there is a posted 30.06 sign.
I just can't stand the shows in the first place.
I just can't stand the shows in the first place.
zincwarrior
New member
Its not inside the show thats the issue.
1. People have been robbed outside of gunshows.
2. Some people carry 24/7. I myself don't but I won't go into a place thats posted, ever.
Its not the CHLers that are causing the problems.
1. People have been robbed outside of gunshows.
2. Some people carry 24/7. I myself don't but I won't go into a place thats posted, ever.
Its not the CHLers that are causing the problems.
I live north of Colorado Springs and OP comments about what happened at gunshow which was held Colorado Springs.
Vendor was setting up his table prior to show opening when pistol was fired and lucky no one was hurt and show opens 9AM.
http://www.kktv.com/home/headlines/Shot-Accidentally-Fired-At-Gun-Show-253043301.html
It's not very big show that you see table after table of pistol/firearms and I'm sure if someone had CC and pulled a pistol in that show he be in serious trouble. I'm guess maybe 10% of tables if that have some sort of firearm for sale.
Tell you the truth ones you got to watch is the Vendors. This is from Tanner guns show 3yrs ago and who caused it "The vendor whose gun was used in the accidental shooting is 68-year-old James Peterschmidt from Aurora."
Vendor was setting up his table prior to show opening when pistol was fired and lucky no one was hurt and show opens 9AM.
http://www.kktv.com/home/headlines/Shot-Accidentally-Fired-At-Gun-Show-253043301.html
It's not very big show that you see table after table of pistol/firearms and I'm sure if someone had CC and pulled a pistol in that show he be in serious trouble. I'm guess maybe 10% of tables if that have some sort of firearm for sale.
Tell you the truth ones you got to watch is the Vendors. This is from Tanner guns show 3yrs ago and who caused it "The vendor whose gun was used in the accidental shooting is 68-year-old James Peterschmidt from Aurora."
Brian Pfleuger
Moderator Emeritus
One of the differences, it seems, that may lead to different opinions on this issue is the police presence (or absence) at your local gun shows.
In the story linked in the previous post, it indicates that "police were called..." Well, at shows around here, we have half the police force in attendance, on duty. At the big shows, they're e-v-ry-where. Uniformed, plain clothes, at the entrances, patrolling the parking lots, sitting at tables in the corner, wandering the aisles. Everywhere.
I've never heard of anyone getting robbed/mugged at/leaving a gunshow around here. Of course, people getting robbed/mugged around here (even in Syracuse where the big shows are) in broad-daylight is about the same as getting struck by lightning anyway.
In the story linked in the previous post, it indicates that "police were called..." Well, at shows around here, we have half the police force in attendance, on duty. At the big shows, they're e-v-ry-where. Uniformed, plain clothes, at the entrances, patrolling the parking lots, sitting at tables in the corner, wandering the aisles. Everywhere.
I've never heard of anyone getting robbed/mugged at/leaving a gunshow around here. Of course, people getting robbed/mugged around here (even in Syracuse where the big shows are) in broad-daylight is about the same as getting struck by lightning anyway.
zincwarrior
New member
As the Brits would say...bullocks!
Very few firearm stores are posted here, yet CHLers manage to keep their act together. Any proof these are actually CHLers? Or are you falling for the usual anti gun argument? It could be dangerous, so it must be banned.
zincwarrior
New member
Where I live few shows are posted. Those are usually scorned by CHLers.
A fellow Texan. You can attest then. I've not seen any gun store with a legal 30.06 sign (a required no gun sign that is applicable for CHLers). The closest was Gander Mountain, and even they are focused on firearms that are going to be handled.
Last edited:
Pond James Pond
New member
Oh, come on...
If you want to suggest that the likelihood of some wanting to take their gun out of its holster at a gun show is no more than it would be at a Mall/restaurant then it is my turn to say Male Bovine Beasts of Burden.
There could be countless things on sale that a firearms enthusiast might see and think "Would that fit my gun?", "Would my EDC be more comfortable in that?".
How else will they know other than trying them out?
Even if only 10% of CCW fancy trying something out, that will be 10% more than are likely to unholster in other public arenas...
zincwarrior
New member
Same argument as the antigun crowd. Hey its just reasonable regulation.
It would be helpful to your case to use data to support that CHLers are the ones actually doing this. So far the only ones noted have been vendors.
Further you're argument that 10% of the CHL are that stupid is amazing. What kind of CHLers do you have where you live?
It would be helpful to your case to use data to support that CHLers are the ones actually doing this. So far the only ones noted have been vendors.
Further you're argument that 10% of the CHL are that stupid is amazing. What kind of CHLers do you have where you live?
Last edited:
Pond James Pond
New member
Who said anything about stupid? Not me.
I just state that guns in hands means more chances of mishaps.
Still if you contend that CHL are never stupid, feel free to provide case data of your own...
Unless you have some metric proving that CHL/CCW holders are more intelligent than the public at large, I'd say that's probably pretty accurate. Heck, it might even be very generous. Basic grade school math would tell you that 50% of all CHL holders are below average intelligence.
I just had to pay for a background check and provide proof of prior military service, there was no IQ or aptitude test involved.
zincwarrior
New member
Again, please cite stats of actual incidents involving CHLers.
That's a strawman. Work in the business for one week. You'll have more loaded guns pointed at you than anywhere else. And guess what? They're folks with permits much of the time.
We are not the general public. Most of us are reasonably well trained and conscientious. We're a bit above normal. The average CHL holder just isn't. I've lost count of how many folks get prickly over safety reprimands, then throw "I'm licensed" in my face by way of rebuttal.
It's not an anti-gun thing. In those cases, my first priority is to make sure nobody gets hurt. If someone's threatening me, intentionally or not, rights are not the first matter on my mind.
Furthermore, which helps the antis more: policing our own or letting a tragedy happen?
Pond James Pond
New member
No.
I don't feel I need to.
The "Even if..." in post 92 should make it clear my point was a hypothetical number to illustrate what I was trying to communicate.
No hypotheticals in your responses, so perhaps the burden of proof that a concealed weapon holder will not make mistakes in a crowded show lies with you.
Last edited: