CCW with a single action

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Who's talking about the average shooter??????? Where and when did anyone espouse the SA for the average shooter? Nowhere in this discussion. I'm not talking about the average shooter or that SA's are a good idea in general. They are not. The average person who walks into a gun shop looking for something to defend hisself with would be better served with something else. That is painfully obvious. We're talking about individuals here. Individuals who might possess more skill with an SA than anything else, simply because it's what they enjoy shooting. I know guys who carry and shoot an SA every day but probably couldn't find the safety on a Glock (tongue in cheek), much less shoot one accurately with that crappy trigger. Sorry but you can't change the context to fit your argument.

Yes, a single action revolver is quicker to draw from leather. The grip design is quicker and easier to grab. Since the hammer should be cocked while it's coming up, that doesn't affect the time to draw and fire the first shot. So yes, in response to the nonsense that it is a greater challenge to draw a single action from concealment, I say horse hockey. Or did you miss the comment I was responding to? No, I don't think it's the most important thing but it is important and I would arbitrarily dismiss any "trainer" who didn't think it was important to practice from concealment. Are you serious with that crap?

...you have ridiculed people who use other weapons with your spray and pray comment.
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Wrong, read it again. I've ridiculed no one. I was responding to a specific comment.

There is one simple fact. You are only one person, you may have become proficient with the system that you chose, but that doesn't prove that your choice is the best one. I am not fond of saying that the majority is right, but it is. For about a century, shooters all around the entire world have found that it is easier to gain proficiency with, and perform well with any of the other semiautomatic or double action platforms. This doesn't prove anything, but it does clearly show that those other systems are preferred, and obviously work better for the average shooter. If the sa was the better system, the 1911 would be stuck on the bottom corner of the case.
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Again, all that nonsense is taking my comments out of context. I see that reading comprehension is a lost art.
 
For about a century, shooters all around the entire world have found that it is easier to gain proficiency with, and perform well with any of the other semiautomatic or double action platforms.
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That's about the size of it.

The revolver started out as a cavalry weapon. In the beginning, almost all were single action. It was the best they had.

Around six score and, say seven years ago or more, cavalry armorers started moving away from the single action revolver. For the US, the Colt DA came first, but finding a suitable semiautomatic pistol became a priority. Yes, the 1911 started out primarily as a cavalry pistol. Single action revolvers were kept in reserve or issued to second-line troops in most armies.

By the end of the nineteenth century, American manufacturers were concentrating on making double action revolvers with swing-out cylinders and simultaneous ejection. By the turn of the century, there were a number of semi-automatic pistol designs for pocket use in Europe, and they became popular here.

I can see how a single action revolver might offer some tangible advantages to a civilian who rides a horse. And there is no real disadvantage to using a big single action rather than a big double action for the taking of game. But for most uses, they were replaced, either en masse or a few at a time.

The venerable Colt went out of production.

But then something happened. The entertainment world gave us fantasies of men carrying big revolvers in purpose built custom holsters. Randolph Scott Alan Ladd, Jack Palance, John Wayne, and later James Arness and the likes of James Garner carried heavy belt rigs into our movie houses and living rooms. there was nothing historically authentic about it , but it made for great entertainment.

The even showed us an absurd fictional dance in which two men faced each other at high noon with their hands held over the grips of their revolvers waiting for the director's signal to draw.

The result was a great resurgence in demand for the hitherto obsolescent guns. Great Western and Ruger brought them back. Colt even came back into the game.

Competitions and skill demonstrations became popular. Most represented, in the words of Coway Twitty, what was only make believe.

That is not to say that it isn't fun.
 
So yes, in response to the nonsense that it is a greater challenge to draw a single action from concealment, I say horse hockey.
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I cannot understand how anyone could seriously contend that the kinds of hammers with which single action revolvers are equipped--even the old Bisley competition revolvers--do not present a risk of snagging when drawn from concealment.

Even DA revolvers carried concealed are often designed with internal hammers, equipped with shrouds, or have the hammer spurs removed. Mine meat those descriptions.

"The hammer is a hook".

I do occasionally carry a .45 semiautomatic pistol concealed. It is much easier to carry concealed than anything the size of a Modal P.

The hammer? I keep it cocked.
 
CCW with a single action

OK, I know all the reasons to NOT use a single action revolver as your concealed carry. So please don't go there. I'd like to hear success stories about ccw with a single action. How do you carry, what kind of holster, where did you get the holster, how do you manage reloads? Etc. I know some of you open carry a single action, and that's cool. But only looking for concealed carry ideas right now. Thanks.
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Some should start their own thread about why NOT to carry a concealed single action. We are so intent on attacking the premise here that there is no room for discussing how and why some do carry a single action (concealed). As has been stated, the typical single action is a pretty big gun, while the Model P Jr. clones are actually quite viable as a carry gun in modern dress and with skill in handling the gun.
 
What would constitute "success stories"?
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The ability to conceal, to draw, and to fire. There is nothing there about comparison to alternatives, only self defense. There is nothing there requiring one to defend their choice against someone trying to bully the premise.
 
The ability to conceal, to draw, and to fire.
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Nothing about effectiveness (rapidity of shots with combat accuracy, and possibly draw speed from different positions)? No need to compare alternatives to discuss that.
 
Maybe it's just me, but if I see or know someone concealed carrying a single action revolver, I'm going to assume immediately that they know how to use it and use it well.

With that said, the only single action I carry is an NAA PUG as a backup in most cases (rarely as a primary) and thats for sized based reasons. I did toy with carrying a Bond Arms derringer for a bit, but that was more because I simply loved that silly thing.

When practicality calls, its a J frame or G43 or maybe a .380 if I have to hover in the middle somewhere size wise.
 
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Some should start their own thread about why NOT to carry a concealed single action. We are so intent on attacking the premise here that there is no room for discussing how and why some do carry a single action (concealed). As has been stated, the typical single action is a pretty big gun, while the Model P Jr. clones are actually quite viable as a carry gun in modern dress and with skill in handling the gun.
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Well said.

Maybe it's just me, but if I see or know someone concealed carrying a single action revolver, I'm going to assume immediately that they know how to use it and use it well.
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Probably a safe assumption.
 
What would constitute "success stories"?
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In the original post I wrote
How do you carry, what kind of holster, where did you get the holster, how do you manage reloads?
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In post #19 I wrote
by "success stories" I meant in just the carrying and concealing, not the use of the gun in a fight.
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So, experience and ideas that demonstrate the feasibility of carrying a single action revolver concealed.

Thanks again, Real Gun.
 
Maybe it's just me, but if I see or know someone concealed carrying a single action revolver, I'm going to assume immediately that they know how to use it and use it well.
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If by "use it well" you mean that they would be able to draw from concealment quickly while moving and put several shots into the upper chest area of a fast moving assailant in a second or two at close range, might I ask why you would assume that?

That's what defensive shooting with a handgun is about.

Have you ever seen anyone try to do it in a realistic defensive training scenario?

Now, that question would apply to any kind of firearm--a derringer, a five shot light alloy snubby revolver, a little NAA .22, a very small compact semiautomatic with poor sights and a grip too small to support one's pinky....

One cannot confidently make any assumption whatsoever about a defender's ability on the basis of what he or she carries.

One can, whoever, be fairly confident that if the carrier is trained and has practiced, he will do better if he has selected and trained with something that has a reasonably good sized grip, fairly low recoil, and a good trigger pull; that does not require a separate motion to disengage a safety; that does not require a separate motion between shots; that presents a low risk of hanging up on his clothing; and that has a fairly high round capacity.

It is probably unlikely that any serious practitioners of concealed carry will be altogether happy with their first choice. I have an officer size steel ,45 single action automatic, but capacity and the impact of retail on rapidity if fire put it on reserve statue. I divested a compact 9mm that hurt my hand and replaced it with another model that I could shoot better, but then I found through experience, and unexpectedly. that the separate safety switch presented possible risks. I ended up with a compact double column 9 without a separate safety, after a lot of soul searching.

For backup, I have a six shot concealed hammer steel revolver with an excellent trigger pull.

I did not make those changes just to spend money. I did so after having availed myself of quality defensive training, listening to the insructor, and observing others with their choices.
 
In post #19 I wrote "by "success stories" I meant in just the carrying and concealing, not the use of the gun in a fight."

So, experience and ideas that demonstrate the feasibility of carrying a single action revolver concealed.
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Gotcha!

Now, if I may respectfully ask, what would that bit of knowledge provide?
 
If by "use it well" you mean that they would be able to draw from concealment quickly while moving and put several shots into the upper chest area of a fast moving assailant in a second or two at close range, might I ask why you would assume that?
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And you think this is hard to do?

One can, whoever, be fairly confident that if the carrier is trained and has practiced, he will do better if he has selected and trained with something that has a reasonably good sized grip, fairly low recoil, and a good trigger pull; that does not require a separate motion to disengage a safety; that does not require a separate motion between shots; that presents a low risk of hanging up on his clothing; and that has a fairly high round capacity.
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Far as I'm concerned, the underlined parts are the only valid points. Sure, IF that's what he chooses to train with. I'm sorry but the difference between platforms is just not as significant as you seem to think.

One cannot confidently make any assumption whatsoever about a defender's ability on the basis of what he or she carries.
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Really, you don't say??? You don't see the irony in that statement????
 
Maybe it's just me, but if I see or know someone concealed carrying a single action revolver, I'm going to assume immediately that they know how to use it and use it well.
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It's just you. I'd assume he's a Fudd out to make a fashion statement.
 
One assumption that seems to have been made several times on this topic is that SA shooters are more accomplished than others with different types of handguns.
That's a pretty big assumption to make.
 
And you think this[(to draw from concealment quickly while moving and put several shots into the upper chest area of a fast moving assailant in a second or two at close range)] is hard to do?
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In comparison with other designs, yes. The extra step required between shots is one issue. The popularity of the single action revolver fell very rapidly when better choices became available.

The hammer configuration mitigates against a smooth draw from concealment.

The heyday of the single action revolver as we know it today preceded the common practice of concealed carry by a very long time. Single action revolvers that were carried concealed, such as the S&W tip-ups, may have been the best they had at the time, but they did not long endure in the marketplace.
 
OldMarksman said:
If by "use it well" you mean that they would be able to draw from concealment quickly while moving and put several shots into the upper chest area of a fast moving assailant in a second or two at close range, might I ask why you would assume that?
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Good morning all! My assumption is based on the fact that any reasonable shooter knows there are better options than a single action. If I DO happen to see a person concealed carrying a single action (which for the record I never have), I'm going to assume probably one of three things:

1. They are clueless or just showing off - Possible...but those types usually carry the really elaborate >$1000 setups. So unless they just got through watching their favorite western I would think this the least likely case. In this case I think they would be the 'Fudd' mentioned in this thread. Which makes me realize how much I miss the old Saturday morning cartoons. :)

2. They are carrying the only handgun they own, in which case I would presume they know how to use it. - Maybe...remember the old saying "beware the man with one gun, he probably knows how to use it"

3. They have reviewed their options and alternatives and came to the conclusion that even with all the better options available they can STILL use the single action better than any other alternative they have. - I consider this the most likely option. They probably are well versed on how to draw and shoot it, have practiced with it, etc. This is a decision that only the carrying person can make. At the end of the day, there is a remote possibility they are betting their life on this decision. So again, anyone of sound mind that makes this decision possibly betting their life on it...well I'm going to assume they are darn good with that single action.

So that's how I draw my assumptions, basically a hypothesis so to speak. Always better to err on the side of caution.

Again...this is all just my humble opinion. Not something I pushed on anyone, just a casual statement I made and my reply when inquired.

Have a great day all!
 
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