Advice for a HS teacher who can now carry in class

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Worry less about the gun and the carry method, and more about your ability to effectively defend yourself and others.

If I had your budget and were in your shoes, I'd be content with the Colt Mustang for now, and would spend my energy and concern on filling the other gaps in my plans.

pax
 
Sevens said:
As an aside, I think the idea that your wardrobe is "NON-NEGOTIABLE" is irrationally limiting and unless that is set and enforced by the school board it is the WRONG attitude and it sends the message that your style of clothing is more important to you than carrying a concealed handgun.

Which is certainly fine, if that is how your priorities lie...
Perhaps there is a high fashion clothing forum that can make more effective gun & holster suggestions.
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I just had this argument on here a couple days ago. My life does not revolve around concealed carry and I refuse to let it. I care about my appearance, call me vain all you want, but that doesn't mean I care any less about concealed carry. I still carry a 8+1 capacity 9mm day in and day out, but I refuse to wear clothes that are too big for me or even ugly just so I can carry a full size or large capacity handgun. I can just as easily make the argument that if you are letting concealed carry take over every aspect of your life, than that sounds like a pretty sad way to live.

JohnKSa put it better than I could have

JohnKSa said:
My carry gun is not a god that I serve. My carry gun is there to serve me, not the other way around. That means I decide how much convenience/discomfort/appearance I'm willing to trade away in return for having a firearm always at hand.
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I refuse to wear clothes that are too big for me or even ugly just so I can carry a full size or large capacity handgun.
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As Ive said before, since youre bring it up here again, you dont have to, and I have to assume that you really havent tried anything but what you want to do, to know that you can.

I wear my normal size clothes, and what Id normally wear if I werent carrying a gun, I dont dress like a slob, and the gun and its accessories, have never been a problem.

My carry gun(s) are there to serve me, and Im not a slave to them, they are just part of my daily accouterments, and like my wallet, watch, pocket knife, etc, I dont even know they are there, until I need them. No bother at all.
 
You are attaching emotion to my statement where none was intended.

This ends up being quite clear if you can take a step back and look at it:

--choosing a handgun that MUST remain concealed
--not willing to alter the dress at all, in any way

Thus...
Yes. The handgun is of some importance, but obviously, the clothing is more important.

That's fine if that's where your priorities lie. You certainly aren't alone... otherwise .380 and .32 Auto would be nothing more than relic calibers from pistols made before WWII and not this incredibly popular, awe-inspiring wave of low-buck pocket pistols that took the market by storm.
 
As Ive said before, since youre bring it up here again, you dont have to, and I have to assume that you really havent tried anything but what you want to do, to know that you can.
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You can assume all you want, but if you go back to the other thread I said I have tried quality IWB holsters from Crossbreed and Raven for my Glock 17 and Beretta with quality gun belts, and they print like crazy and just leave a huge massive buldge on my hip. I even tried my buddies Glock 19 in my Crossbreed holster and it still wasn't much better. I am barely pushing 5'9 and am very muscular, and could probably stand to lose 15lbs, so I am relatively short and stocky. My body type cannot accommodate full size handguns. All that aside, a full size handgun IWB with holster and properly fitting pants is beyond uncomfortable, and I would have to wear a shirt a size larger to cover up the full size handgun which I refuse to do. I also live in a state where printing can land you in hot water. You cant just assume because something works for you it works for everyone.
 
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Im 5'6", and currently 155 pounds, and with a muscular/athletic build. Ive also been as fat as 215 pounds for a short while, and still had no troubles carrying anything I wanted.

Ive carried pretty much every day of my adult life in NPE's, where at the very least, Id be fired, and in many cases, likely go to jail if I were found to have a gun on me. So far, Im still working and not in jail. That didnt happen because I was wearing a photographers vest, or a Hawaian shirt, or anything else that stood out as out of place. I wear my normal, appropriate attire, in the sizes I would wear, gun or not.

Im not saying you have to do anything I do at all, Im just saying it can be done, and easily, if youre of a mind to do it. One of us appears not to be of that mind.
 
How many school shootings occur where the shooter is wearing body armor? I can't think of any. If so, I'd forget about carrying anything chambered for the Tokarev.

With cowboy boots as your daily attire, consider carrying you Colt .380 in an ankle holster.

And, don't shrug off pocket carry. As I recall, Dockers pockets don't retain contents as well as jeans pockets. But, a sticky-surfaced pocket holster should stay put, even if you have to stand on your head to break up a fight. My Remora "3-in-1" pocket/ankle/IWB holster works well in my pockets, and it has a nylon/velcro retention strap.

If you need further assurance that your Colt will stay in your pocket until you deliberately draw it, you can have a tailor rebuild your pocket to be deeper, and sew in a patch of velcro to match up with a patch on your pocket holster. You can modify a lot of Dockers this way for the price of a new gun.

Enjoy Utah.
 
Falcon,

A Glock 43 would be my pick with DPX ammo.

Add a NY-1/3.5 lb connector for a bit heavier pull and one of those Saf-T-Blok trigger blocks so if you do lose your gun it will take them a bit to figure it out, and hopefully you take it back from them.

Deaf
 
small 9mm in a shoulder rig. buttons rip easily if needed to draw. shield or similar sized would be great, i carry a pt111 with a tucked 3-button polo with a versa-carry

i used to wear tucked full button up polos at work, took work shirts to drycleaner/tailor and they installed zipper up the middle of shirt and put faux buttons on the outside, couldn't tell at all. still had buttons at top and bottom. perfect for shoulder carry.
 
There's only one choice that fits your criteria. Pocket carry. Tuckable IWB holsters will get noticed at some point. High school halls are crowded. Ankle carry could work, but I've never found it comfortable. Just feels odd having a weight on one leg and not the other.

If you want some advice, I'm a retired cop and I have been teaching high school for 10 years. I know you have the new teacher "I'm gonna change the world" feeling, but that will wear off by Christmas. And I can tell you that unless a kid is literally being beaten to death, that I am not putting my hands on one of them. The schools will not back you, especially if you are not tenured. I've seen way too many teachers get jammed up even though the bad the best intentions. "Did you have to push him back so hard?" " You're a grown man and he's a child". Then they sue the school and the school always settles.

As for me, if they allowed me to carry I doubt I would. First they'd have to pay me more to take on the responsibility and liability. But also, I doubt I could keep it a secret. Somebody would find out. And the first kid I threw out would pull the "I was afraid he was going to shoot me".
 
Thanks for the many replies. Guess I should clarify a couple of things.

1. Dress. The district I will be working for has a dress code, but even if it didn't I would wear the same thing. I've been teaching for 6 years and I can tell you that what the teacher wears has a big impact on the behavior of the class. I have alot less discipline problems when I'm in slacks and a nice shirt than when I am in jeans and a polo.

2. My objection to pocket carry is based on my experiences pocket carrying my Mustang in slacks. The pockets of my slacks are alot bigger than my jeans pockets, so my Mustang slips around more in the pocket of my slacks. When I'm in the car, I've had my Mustang fall out of my pocket while driving. That's what I don't want to happen at work. I like the idea of velcro on my pocket holster, might try that first.

3. Caliber - I admit I'm conjuring the worst case scenario in my head but I don't think there is much wrong with that. I'm trying to prepare for an Aurora like shooter, with an AR-15 or shotgun, lots of ammo and possible some soft body armor. Perhaps the odds of that are low, but the odds of a school shooting EVER happening at the school I work at are very low to begin with.

Finally I promise this isn't hero lusting on my part. I've done active shooter simulations with local police in various scenarios. I know from those simulations when you are going up against an active shooter with a rifle with just your concealed pistol, it doesn't go well for you.
 
If you seriously believe you may be involved in physical altercations, you need to change the way you dress and carry a security holster like the safariland ALS.

There are very few concealed carry holster, if any, that would provide a real level of security.

If you insist on pocket carry, have a tab of Velcro sewn across the top of the pocket you will carry in and carry a Kahr PM9 or something in a pocket holster.

Learn to shoot at the head and pelvic girdle with a good 9..357...40 etc rather than worry about penetrating body armor. The odds of you running into someone with body armor is remote. The odds of shooting and missing the target is higher. I would not want a pistol round with extreme penetration potential in a school setting. That and relying on any pistol round to penetrate body armor is pretty low. All he needs to do is add a trauma plate and it will defeat any (normal) handgun ammo.

Just be very proficient in what you carry. I train SRO's. you. Cannot. Miss. Period. And, honestly look at the ranges you might have to take a shot in a school. An average classroom is huge. A cafeteria is enormous. A hallway might require a 75-100 yard shot. Very few shooters can do that under perfect conditions. Add 2-3 hundred screaming, moving, bobbing, weaving no shoot targets, it becomes impossible unless you are willing to close with the target and engage.

Good luck to you. Its tough.
 
A few months ago, some Utah teacher was fired because her gun went off in the bathroom. Nobody but her injured (minor). No kids even in the room. 16 years as a teacher and it's all gone now.

And this is a district that allows armed staff? They threw her right under the bus.

No thanks. But I like the Velcro idea in the pockets.
 
Homerboy said:
A few months ago, some Utah teacher was fired because her gun went off in the bathroom. Nobody but her injured (minor). No kids even in the room. 16 years as a teacher and it's all gone now.

And this is a district that allows armed staff? They threw her right under the bus.
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Wait a second, are you taking the stand that she shouldn't have been fired? Her gun didn't "go off", she almost certainly pulled the trigger or allowed it to become snagged on her clothing. Either way, she proved she was completely incompetent with firearms and managed to fire her carry gun in the bathroom of a school.

I fully support concealed carry, but I also support punishing people who are dangerously negligent when they concealed carry. That teacher is lucky that she didn't do jail time.
 
I have an 8 y/o in school. If any of the staff had a gun "go off", she/he had better be fired immediately. I have never had a gun go off in puvlic, and never one that I was lling the trigger. I'm all for being allowed to carry, but if you prove yourself incompetent with a firearm, then you shouldn't have carried in the first place.

I agree with the above poster about penetration. Something that will penetrate body armor will also penetrate non body armor and create an unnecessary risk.
 
There now is a compromise. I cannot remember the brand of 9mm ammo but I saw the ballistic testing just a few days ago. The bullets were CNC machined and the penetration through gel was something like 40 inches. If I was worried about an active shooter with soft body armor I would carry one magazine of these bullets and the mag would be brightly marked so to be sure which mag you were loading to prevent over penetration except when needed.

Since you like slacks and a nice shirt add a vest to that ensamble and you will be able to carry in a shoulder holster unnoticed.
 
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