why gas is high

Honda civic DX and Geo Metro both hit the 50 mpg mark I believe. Americans just didn't want to buy them, I don't think there was a conspiracy or anything.

In this day and age, if someone released information on how to do it with a 200hp car, the internet is the equivalent of opening pandora's box in regards to information.
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The cars and means are and have been out there but what you need is a small motor with a turbo and a light car. And light traffic, so you can run at some optimum speed (not necessarily 55 mph) for the vehicles.

When my three kids were growing up, I needed a Suburban. They are out of the house now, so I don't. I have a Yukon of 9 years age, which I drive enough to keep healthy, but otherwise I drive my WRX, an 02. Selling the Yukon would net me little, and occasionally, I need the capacity and have to tow things. So this is wrong?

Some people at some times need SUV's and the prejudice against them is just that.

In LA, since government has not built enough roads, traffic congestion is high, and that kills mileage for every car type. Gray Davis announced eight years ago to cheers that "we have built the last freeway in CA". Now we reap the consequences.

Ethanol also reduces mileage, under all conditions. Fuel in AZ and NM is not mixed with ethanol, and both my cars get 2-3 mpg more when I drive through there.

I would like to live differently than some others, who are happy riding a bike to work and have a job they can get away with arriving sweaty. Great on them. Is that the only lifestyle that should carry any respect? Shall we all be the same?
 
I'd prefer we spend money on research of alternative energy (man, I am stoked about things like the Tesla Roadster!) and give the collective finger to OPEC.
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The technology to produce electric cars is already here. I suggest everyone rent the movie "Who Killed the Electric Car?". There is plenty of blame to go around, but GM, big oil, and government are high on the list.

The EV-1, even with old battery technology, was a plug-in electric car made by General Motors and leased by Saturn starting in the 1990s. When it became obvious that there was a demand for them, and that car company profits would go down because of the low cost of service, together with zero demand for gas, GM called every one of them off lease and destroyed all the cars.
 
We seem happy to pay far more for bottled water than we do for a gallon of gasoline, yet no one complains about that. If you don't like the price of gas, drive less often, drive slower when you do drive, walk or take the bus or train or carpool when you can ... there are alternatives. But blaming the Dems is silly, especially with an oil man in the White House the past eight years. If you don't want to point fingers at China or India (China alone is adding 1,000 cars each and every day, seven days a week, to its roads, and has been for more than a year ... and all of those cars need to be filled with gasoline), blame the U.S. auto industry, which has fought increased mileage standards for 40-plus years. Blame GM, which killed the electric car with malice a few years back. Blame the idiots who still drive their SUVs 75 mph up and down the interstate without a single passenger aboard. Just don't blame yourself. Couldn't have any of that.
 
We seem happy to pay far more for bottled water than we do for a gallon of gasoline,...
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A flat of 32 half-liter bottles is $3.85 at Sam's club, gasoline is $4.19/gallon. I have two questions: where do you buy your bottled water, and where do you buy your gasoline?
 
The technology to produce electric cars is already here. I suggest everyone rent the movie "Who Killed the Electric Car?". There is plenty of blame to go around, but GM, big oil, and government are high on the list.

The EV-1, even with old battery technology, was a plug-in electric car made by General Motors and leased by Saturn starting in the 1990s. When it became obvious that there was a demand for them, and that car company profits would go down because of the low cost of service, together with zero demand for gas, GM called every one of them off lease and destroyed all the cars.
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The "problem" of electric cars having motors that will last longer will mean that we will need to rely on small companies to break into the market. The Chevy Volt is an anomaly but then, it isn't on the market yet.

PBS noted the other day that there is an interesting pushback against electric cars by the gov in CA... apparently there would be a problem of not being able to provide a "gallon of gas" to get cars off the road when they run out of juice. Thus a preference for hydrogen fuel cells and gas hybrid. All electric is still a more efficient way of converting potential energy into motion than those, though.

Standardize batteries and plugs and we will be on the way to more efficient vehicles. Having full torque at 0 rpm is just icing. Standardization requires either govt intervention or a standards body, though.
 
I have been dreaming up some way of a solar car. All it has to do is drive 20 miles. It can then sit all damn day at work in the sun recharging. Then it has to make the trip back home. It can still get a few hours of charging done before the sun goes down for the evening. Hopefully enough to get to work the next morning.
Anyhow. Roads are built with the 18 cent per gallon fuel tax. Government wouldnt want to lose that.

Electric cars use no fuel. Petrol companies would hate that.

Electric cars have few moving parts, fluids, and the like. Auto companies would not be able to sell you a new radiator, Crankshaft , or oil pan for a electric car. They would break much less and would only need batteries replaced every 5 years or so.

Electric cars would likely make shooting much more expensive because of lead going up by the way!!
 
I have been dreaming up some way of a solar car. All it has to do is drive 20 miles. It can then sit all damn day at work in the sun recharging. Then it has to make the trip back home. It can still get a few hours of charging done before the sun goes down for the evening. Hopefully enough to get to work the next morning.
Anyhow. Roads are built with the 18 cent per gallon fuel tax. Government wouldnt want to lose that.

Electric cars use no fuel. Petrol companies would hate that.

Electric cars have few moving parts, fluids, and the like. Auto companies would not be able to sell you a new radiator, Crankshaft , or oil pan for a electric car. They would break much less and would only need batteries replaced every 5 years or so.

Electric cars would likely make shooting much more expensive because of lead going up by the way!!
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Okay, there is a lot of solar automotive technology and engineering that has been done. There is an annual race held for solar powered vehicles. I don't have a cite but I will look. I get car magazines and the SAE journal so I have a little expertise. Some observations:
+unless you can get the locals to allow it, you will not be able to run your car on the street. It has to pass crash tests and other regulatory barriers which will have to be waived.
+Forget air conditioning and other amenities if you want to keep the battery load down to something solar power can handle. If you can arrive at work and shower, change clothes...good on you. and it really helps if you live where there is a lot of sun, like Mexico or AZ or Australia. Maine might not work out so good. The fact that it works for you should not dictate we all need to live like you. I realize the ego value to you, bending the world to your view, but perhaps you can realize not every person should or wants to live as you do. It's called freedom, and no, I am resisting assimilation, futile if the effort may be.
+Electric cars (unless solar powered) use fossil fuels to the same extent you do to light your house. Anybody pulling power off the grid is using fossil fuels. Is that a good choice? Maybe, if you can get better use of the BTU's from the grid to charge your batteries than you could using gasoline to move your vehicle from A to B. This is not likely under current technology, but might come to pass. Adding ethanol to gasoline does not change this equation.
+We agree that the Taxman will figure out how to make up some new rules to fund politicians. Actually, it is not IRS but Congress and state governments who make the rules to keep the trough full. How sad that they may not sup quite enough and go hungry. However would they get re-elected?
+one of the issues about the GM EV-1 was battery replacement (cost and disposal...disposal being a nasty issue...lead is the next big trial lawyer piggy bank). In CA, lead ammo may become extinct, however, so at least there is good news for you there. Lead-acid batteries are not the state of the art, either...much more expensive ideas have come to pass.
 
Standardize batteries and plugs and we will be on the way to more efficient vehicles. Having full torque at 0 rpm is just icing. Standardization requires either govt intervention or a standards body, though.
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Right, just another mandate about how to live. Unless the market defines it, as in the Bluray and HD format, I resist.

And you likely have never heard a Ferrari, or even my lowly WRX, in full song. Well, yah, I am one of those Neanderthals who can hear music in a IC engine...and sorry you can't. But we are all different, so can we live together and each to his own ideals?
 
Right, just another mandate about how to live. Unless the market defines it, as in the Bluray and HD format, I resist.

And you likely have never heard a Ferrari, or even my lowly WRX, in full song. Well, yah, I am one of those Neanderthals who can hear music in a IC engine...and sorry you can't. But we are all different, so can we live together and each to his own ideals?
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Resist a standards body? That's ridiculous.

Of course I've heard a Ferrari, a Lambo, you name it. Have you ever driven an electric vehicle? Full torque at 0 rpm is fantastic.. a much better experience as judged by the seat of your pants, and ears. Ever had a conversation while under full acceleration?

Guess which would be better as a daily driver?
 
Electric cars are more diversion than solution. It takes more energy to get the same thing out of an electric car. Why? Conservation of energy. First you burn fuel to make the electricity, then you send energy to some other location in the form of electricity, then you charge a battery, then you use electricity from the battery to turn an armature which is connected to the axel. There are losses at every step.


Internal combustion is inherently more efficient because you burn the fuel to turn the "armature" directly. Also, internal combustion engines are lighter per horsepower.


The potential benefit of electric cars is that you don't necessarily have to burn fuel to make electricity. You can use nuclear fission, geothermal, even wind and solar power. But making the cars electric wouldn't do any good all by itself. Unless you change the way we make our electricity, you'd probably be better off just making wimpy little gas-powered cars that would get lots of miles per gallon.
 
Electric cars are more diversion than solution. It takes more energy to get the same thing out of an electric car. Why? Conservation of energy. First you burn fuel to make the electricity, then you send energy to some other location in the form of electricity, then you charge a battery, then you use electricity from the battery to turn an armature which is connected to the axel. There are losses at every step.


Internal combustion is inherently more efficient because you burn the fuel to turn the "armature" directly. Also, internal combustion engines are lighter per horsepower.


The potential benefit of electric cars is that you don't necessarily have to burn fuel to make electricity. You can use nuclear fission, geothermal, even wind and solar power. But making the cars electric wouldn't do any good all by itself. Unless you change the way we make our electricity, you'd probably be better off just making wimpy little gas-powered cars that would get lots of miles per gallon.
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Your logic is only correct if your power company generates electricity using gasoline. Luckily that's not even remotely true.

Internal combustion is not very efficient. It is also much easier to create a more efficient large fuel->electricity process that doesn't exists on four wheels.

Yes, just by using electric cars by themselves, you are making gains.
 
Just a comment...

How does the argument over electric autos, serve to answer the question, "Why is gas high?"

Can we get back to the topic, or are we done with it?
 
How does the argument over electric autos, serve to answer the question, "Why is gas high?"

Can we get back to the topic, or are we done with it?
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In a roundabout way, it is an answer to the original question.

If electric cars were more widely used, then the demand, and the price, for gasoline would go down. If electric cars ever become more than just an oddity they may be a partial answer to our dependence on foreign oil.
 
So where does the electricity come from that these electric cars run on? Can you say “oil”? At least to some extent, it’s oil, coal, and to a lesser percentage, hydroelectric. Just because it’s an “Eee-lectric” car doesn’t mean you aren’t using oil. It’s a bit like the meat you buy at the grocery store. I comes in nice neat shrink-wrapped packaging all pristine and pretty but it still starts life as a butchered cow with its blood and guts all over the floor. No different with your electric car. Electricity doesn’t just materialize out of thin air (lightning is not a viable energy source)
 
If electric cars ever become more than just an oddity they may be a partial answer to our dependence on foreign oil.
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As another poster said the electricity has to come from somewhere and most of it is produced by oil, coal or natural gas. If we had more nuke plants, wind and hydro that would help a lot. Once the environmental lobby realizes that electric cars just shift carbon emissions from cars to carbon emissions from power plants, even electric cars won't be acceptable.
 
As another poster said the electricity has to come from somewhere and most of it is produced by oil, coal or natural gas. If we had more nuke plants, wind and hydro that would help a lot. Once the environmental lobby realizes that electric cars just shift carbon emissions from cars to carbon emissions from power plants, even electric cars won't be acceptable.
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The three main sources for electrical power in the US are coal, natural gas and nuclear. Together these three combine for 90% of our electricity.
Even the "environmental lobby" uses electricity, and whether they like it or not, these three sources will remain at the top of the list for many years to come.
 
The three main sources for electrical power in the US are coal, natural gas and nuclear. Together these three combine for 90% of our electricity.
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If electricity demand increases, where is that coming from? Domestic natural gas fills about 99% of our demand right now but is declining. How do we fill the gap? Buy it from Russia? Right back where we were. Coal plants produce "greenhouse gases" and other pollutants on a massive scale and are unlikely to be ramped up. The only other option is to build more nuclear, and we know how easy that is to get approved and built.
 
The three main sources for electrical power in the US are coal, natural gas and nuclear. Together these three combine for 90% of our electricity.
Even the "environmental lobby" uses electricity, and whether they like it or not, these three sources will remain at the top of the list for many years to come.
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Actually, Nuke and Natural Gas are almost even at around 20%. Nevertheless, my point was that most of our electricity, around 70%, comes from fossil fuels which create carbon emissions. So we are shifting the emissions from cars to power plants.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Sources_of_electricity_in_the_USA_2006.png
 
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