what would i get if i wanted something like a revolver but more like a glock

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its not the rounds or the look of them i dont like,its the fact you have to load them 1 shell at a time.in a situation for something like self defense if someone would happen to break into your house or apartment or something.it just seems like it would be faster to just reload something like a 9mm handgun then a shotgun

or is that why they make shotguns with magazines now? i know mossberg has a shotgun that has a 20 round magazine with it
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I posted a link to a number of shotguns for you. These could give you some ideas.

I just found your lack of respect for the shotgun interesting.

With a shotgun as the primary and the handgun as a backup, most folks would feel exceptionally well armed for home defense and about most other things as well. With just the shotgun alone I'd feel pretty good. You don't have to wait till it's empty to reload. You know that right?

But I'm not trying to sell you a shot gun. You didn't come here looking for that.

Folks have pointed out that you can get close to what you were looking for when you started this thread. You were starting with caliber and load and that's not always the best place to start. Let me ask something else.

You said you were interested in a handgun for self defense. But what type gun for what task? What are your self defense needs? These differ and sometimes require different type handguns.

For home defense: a full size service sidearm works very well and size or weight, as long as you can shoot the gun well, need not matter.

For concealed carry personal defense compact and sub compact are the best for ease of carry and concealment. These needs may also help decide on caliber. They effect caliber.

So it helps when looking for a gun to decide what you want to do with it first and go from there. You haven't said much about that though.

tipoc
 
Rock Island Arsenal has a 1911 in 10mm with a 16 round capacity.
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Another one!

So we're up to 4 manufacturers with high-cap 10mms.

Glock, EAA Witness (Tanfoglio), Springfield XD (HS Produkt) and Rock Island Armory (Armscor).
 
The OP should just go take some of the standard introductory gun usage classes before all this speculation. It's fun to talk about the 10 mm guns or shotguns.

Go try them with some instruction and THEN decide.
 
The problem John is that apparently not enough folks seem to want a handgun in 10 mm with the power of a 357 mag with heavier loads or the 44 Mag and with +14 rounds. It's a puzzler!

We can get a 357 Sig that matches the power of the 125 gr. defensive loads of the 357 Mag. That does well up to about the 147 gr. loads matching the 357 Mag. Has plenty of boolits.

We can get a Desert Eagle in 50 AE though for a couple of grand. Maybe that'll work?

Maybe the op needs to get a 9mm and learn to shoot and study along the way? I think that'll be more fun than worrying about a shotgun with 10 rounds not being enough.

tipoc
 
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Also, shotguns for beginners is an Internet cliche. The beginner should take or get some experience with a 12 gauge in a SD mode in a class or competition. Moving, racking (if pump), reloading isn't child's play under stress. You can miss - OH, NO!
 
My reply post was meant to be humorous... getting a dog is not for the inexperienced either, unless they are willing to put in the effort, reading, and classes to have a happy healthy good dog.

Glenn, you are absolutely right about overstressing hardware and understressing tactics.

As a sport shooter, the current state of the sport seems fairly dismal.

The marketing of firearms seems to be “get a gun, all men are born knowing how to shoot” without the least attention to what I think the most important skill is: knowing how to avoid situations where someone needs to shoot. But you can’t learn that without a lot of thinking, learning, and maturity.

I may not be a “master” but my Kung-fu is strong. I was talking to Yoda the other day and he said (translated):
“You can’t tell kids anything these days because
Kids are people
And people simply don’t listen.”

I mean, that’s what he meant. He actually said “listen not, they do” then he took a nap.
 
Jason92,

Handguns that fire magnum style loads have quite a few disadvantages for self-defense against humans. They are generally lower capacity, slower to get follow up shots, are more prone to excessive flash (giving the shooter partial night blindness for a couple minutes), are more difficult to train with, and are also generally more expensive.

There are very good reasons to use a 9x19mm handgun. The FBI is headed back toward 9mm after decades of using the .40S&W. Most of the top special operations guys are using a 9mm sidearm (be it a Glock 17/19, Sig, or M9).

For home defense, I'd actually recommend an AR-15, but if you want a handgun, get a full-size, "carry" (Sig), or compact double stack 9mm. If you want to carry concealed, get a compact or subcompact (double or single stack).

Get the pistol, a few mags, and a thousand rounds of 9mm. Then go to an introductory handgun class. Practice what you learn there, until you run through that ammo. Then, get another thousand and go to an intermediate-level class. After the class, run through another thousand or two. Once you are comfortable with those skills, buy more ammo and take the next class...etc, etc.
You'll quickly learn why 9mm is the preferred service and carry caliber, and will have spent your money on skills rather than equipment mismatched to your goals.

(Big caliber handguns can be fun, and are of use against large predators, but they are actually not the best for defense against evil people.)
 
For home defense, I'd actually recommend an AR-15,
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i guess i just assumed that something like a 9mm handgun would be better in terms of worrying about over penetration

because ive looked at ar 15's and ak 47's before and that was my main concern
 
Jason92 said:
i guess i just assumed that something like a 9mm handgun would be better in terms of worrying about over penetration

because ive looked at ar 15's and ak 47's before and that was my main concern
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With .223, penetration is VERY dependent on what bullet is used. 55grain FMJ, for example, tends to tumble after hitting something, and then loses energy very quickly. It will go through fewer walls than most 9mm handgun rounds. (It's not the best fight-stopper though.). Some .223 bullets penetrate a lot, while others disintegrate quickly. That said, any bullet that will stop an attacker reliably will also go through several walls, so misses are VERY dangerous. (Every bullet you fire in a defense situation might have a lawyer with a multi-million dollar lawsuit attached.)
 
Pardon me, but it seems evident you have no idea what shooting most of the guns you're talking about is like. You seem to be shopping based on the specifications and pictures on the Internet and you mention things like power and capacity without any evidence that you know what you're talking about. You will need more personal experience shooting different guns before you can answer a lot of the questions you have for yourself because other people's answers won't be the same. But you can avoid the most difficult problems by adopting "conventional wisdom" or accepting general consensus.

For example, you'll see that there is a general consensus that Desert Eagles and double-stack 10mm handguns aren't the best for most people's purposes. We could list the reasons why, but if you're more concerned with finding a gun that does suit your purpose, exploring obscure niches is only good for spending more time and money doing it.

I will say that the general consensus of a given age is subject to trends or fads. Those trends tend to form around valid options identified by what I would call "conventional wisdom", but they sometimes exclude good alternatives that might have trended in the past or will do so in the future but which aren't in fashion at the time.

For example, conventional wisdom has identified at various times the 1911, the S&W Model 19, and Glock striker-fired automatics like the G19 as suitable for the purposes of many people. But when revolvers were trending, automatics were irrationally disfavored and vice-versa. So while the general consensus nowadays favors the G19, conventional wisdom holds that the 1911 and Model 19 are still valid alternatives. What consensus and conventional wisdom preclude are obscure alternatives like a .44 Magnum Desert Eagle, the FN FiveSeven, Taurus Judge, BFR, the Keltec PMR30 and so on. That is to say they are precluded from being good and practical carry guns for most people. They could be a good fit for unusual circumstances, but if you don't want to waste time and money exploring their quirks, just defer to conventional wisdom.

So what are some options conventional wisdom has identified? Here's some I would mention, but I wouldn't exclude guns of other brands or models that are similar.

1911
S&W Model 19, 66 or 686
DA/SA autos (Beretta 92, CZ75, Sig P226)
Striker-fired autos (Glock, M&P)

Accepting conventional wisdom means that you implicitly agree to the rationale that is behind the decisions that formed the consensus. Another way of saying this is, "if it was good enough for them, it's good enough for me." That isn't to say you shouldn't recognize differences in your mission from the mission the consensus formed around and adapt to your own individual needs. What it does mean is that if conventional wisdom doesn't insist on magnum-power or high-capacity, there's a reason for it. Almost everything comes with trade-offs. There are tradeoffs between weight, power, capacity, size, shootability, concealability, reliability, safety, and holstering options. If power and capacity were really the chief criteria, you would carry a rifle. Conventional wisdom gives the other criteria much more importance and indeed an overwhelming majority choose 9mm despite it being the weakest of the popular handgun cartridges. Indeed there are also many professionals and experts that will unapologetically choose to fight with a 1911 despite not having more capacity than a revolver. In both cases, it is all the other criteria that are given precedence.

It is especially true when you lack experience, training and possess only marginal skills that power and capacity are inferior criteria. Don't be so foolish as to think of your skill level and lack of training as a reason to forgo shootability, reliability, and safety. Don't hinder your acquisition of skills, experience and your participation in training by trying to shoot something stupid.
 
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With .223, penetration is VERY dependent on what bullet is used.
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so if i wanted something for the purpose of home/small apartment defense.what bullet would i use

because honestly? id rather just buy a 9mm glock and an ak 47 or an ar 15 but i guess ive always just assumed that over penetration wise.shotguns and handguns were better then an assault rifle
 
Pardon me, but it seems evident you have no idea what shooting most of the guns you're talking about is like
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honestly,the only reason i made this post is because im just lookin for what caliber,brand,etc to get.ill admit,ive never shot any of the guns people have said in this thread.but in terms of guns im interested in,ill say glock 9mm and ar 15's and ak 47's are probably what im most interested in.with that being said,befor i seriously think about buying anything,im going to find a gun range and rent something and actually shoot it before i think about buying it
 
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