U.S. pays for care of illegal aliens

", I want the people who live in my country to want to be American. The folks south of the border can take their campesino crap back to the barrio hellhole they crawled out of. "


thats what pisses me off more than anything, they dont WANT to become Americans, they want to be mexicans living in America, getting everything they can for free. my proof? the countless cars i see on the streets with mexican flags plastered on them, no American flags in sight.


hey INS, where are you? start doing your damn jobs.
 
Preventing illegal immigrants from coming will do zero to stop infectious disease. Only treating everyone who sits on your territory and confining when necessary will suffice. Since you're all pro-legal immigration, and, I assume, pro-foreign travel, any disease that can spread in mexico will spread here. The point is that if you deny healthcare to some populations here, they will spread the disease more efficiently than it otherwise might've gone.
 
I do agree on the wanting to become an American part. I don't see many of them from the typical illegal alien wanting to be an American. I do see better educated immigrants coming here and really diving into American society, but the post-hole diggers just don't. They don't care if their kids are educated either which is beyond me.
 
"I do see better educated immigrants coming here and really diving into American society, but the post-hole diggers just don't. They don't care if their kids are educated either which is beyond me."


i dont think very many of the better educated mexicans are coming here,no need to. your right that they dont even care if thier kids are educated, nor do alot of them care if they are out running the streets and commiting crimes.
 
shootinstudent said:
Refusing treatment to illegals
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shootinstudent said:
The point is that if you deny healthcare to some populations here
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Why do you keep saying that? They're not being refused treatment, they're getting it for FREE--and I'm footing the bill. What part of that don't you understand?

Once illegal aliens are here, the vast majority doesn't want them to die or suffer, but since our society and our government have decided to take care of them, it's only fair that our society and government pay for it. As opposed to what's happening now with the people in border states bearing the brunt of it in the form of increased healthcare costs.

It's also worth noting that Mexican often travel legally to the U.S. to receive free healthcare because they can get better quality care here than there. Pretty common for pregnancies that begin in Mexico to culminate in the U.S. Pretty smart of them, actually--but again, if we are going to say that it's our obligation to take care of them, it's not fair for a few to bear the brunt of the cost.
 
JohnKsa,

Yes, you are paying some of the bill, and so am I. But that's because they do not have the funds to pay the bill. Hospitals will grab any money they possibly can.

What I am arguing here is that the cost to you and me is beside the point, because the risk of you and me not paying when others can't is enormous.
 
So, how many of Mexico's problems are you willing to fork over your hard-earned cash to solve?

See, you keep pretending that this is a U.S. problem. It's not. It's a Mexican problem. The fact that we are a compassionate and generous people doesn't make it our problem, it just means that we're paying to solve their problems.

Furthermore, you're ignoring the fact that the benefits enjoyed by and the lenient treatment given to illegal aliens in the U.S. is actually causing MORE illegals to come. So our compassion and generosity are actually contributing to the problem.
 
JohnKsa,

Please read above. My point entirely is that disease is an American problem. If an infectious disease goes hog wild in mexico, it will come here too. Now do you want the first cases to be wandering around without health care, or do you want everyone, poor or not, going to the doctor when sick to get checked?
 
shootinstudent said:
Now do you want the first cases to be wandering around without health care
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I KNOW you're not trying to imply that illegals here aren't ALREADY receiving free healthcare because we've pretty well established that they are. So I'm assuming that you're just talking hypothetically here.

Hypothetically then--providing free health care to Northern Mexico is not the only way to prevent a plague from spreading to the U.S. Hypothetically--executing anyone caught crossing the border illegally would be just as effective.
 
JohnKSa,

Illegal crossings spread disease less efficiently than air travel, so no, it would not be effective. People travel into and out of the US all the time. The only way to even attempt to stop the spread of disease is to be able to check every case you find in the US quickly and quarantine or treat where necessary.
 
By that logic we would have to provide free healthcare to any country which has air travel connections to our country.

Besides, it's pretty ridiculous to assume that the fear of plague has driven us to execute illegal border crossers but we're just letting folks come in on airplanes without even checking them for sniffles. (We're still talking hypothetically, right? ;) )

Anytime you'd like to stop this hypothetical BS'ing and come back to reality, feel free. Unfortunately that will prevent you from talking about all the problems caused by not providing free healthcare to people who are already receiving it. :D
 
JohnKSa,

You are not reading my posts. What I am saying is that the best way to deal with the problem and threat is by having healthcare facilities that take anyone who is in the US. Disease is spread in the US by bodies wandering in the US. Doesn't matter if they're american, foreign, rich or poor. If you discourage them from going to the hospital for illness, they're more likely to wander around and infect more people.

But yes, spending money on prevention of disease in other countries is smart too. I'm all for spending the money required to find and distribute a vaccine for avian flu in asia, for example.

Please explain to me how infectious disease is "hypothetical bs." The flu has killed millions already. Where's the "hypothetical" part of this discussion?
 
What I am saying is that the best way to deal with the problem and threat is by having healthcare facilities that take anyone who is in the US.
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Just like they do now.
If you discourage them from going to the hospital for illness
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Nobody is.
Where's the "hypothetical" part of this discussion?
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The part where you keep talking like illegals are not already getting free healthcare.
 
JohnKsa,

Please quote the part of my text where I am claiming that illegals do not get free health care so that I may correct it.

thank you.
 
JohnKsa,

Yes...did you read the beginning of the thread? I was explaining why it's a good thing to let illegals visit the emergency room. That's the discussion.

Are you faulting me for arguing the point by examining what would happen if they were barred? How else exactly would people go about discussing the issue of allowing illegals access to emergency care?

I think perhaps you might be a little heated with the subject matter. I want to make clear to you that I don't have any personal problem with you or anyone else who disagrees with my views, and I don't think you're playing a "silly game" by arguing against those views.
 
I did read the beginning of the thread--apparently you didn't. It isn't about whether or not illegals should be allowed to visit the emergency room. It is about funding being allocated by the federal government to pay for those services.
Are you faulting me for arguing the point by examining what would happen if they were barred?
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No, because that's not what the thread is about either.
How else exactly would people go about discussing the issue of allowing illegals access to emergency care?
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Any number of ways--if that were the topic of the discussion. This thread is about FUNDING the care that illegals ALREADY have access to.
 
Illegal crossings spread disease less efficiently than air travel, so no, it would not be effective.
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What a bunch of bloody nonsense.

By definition people traveling here legally by air must pass through Customs. During that process (should it become necessary) the passengers can be screened by doctors and other authorities who could then assign prophylactic treatment, immediate medical treatment, quarantine, deportation, and/or a myriad of other possibilities to limit/curtail/eliminate communicable disease.

BY DEFINITION ILLEGAL IMMIGRATION not only takes place surreptitiously, but is most often participated in by people who are impoverished and who to a much greater degree have occasion to be exposed to, and suffering from, diseases that are untreated and ignored.

Americans travel by air more often, and to more places than just about any other people the world has ever seen, and yet we don't have outbreaks of cholera, dysentery, hepatitis A (except on rare occasions when the food supply is contaminated by some dirtbag - quite often an illegal alien BTW), tuberculosis, dengue fever, or a PDR full of other communicable diseases. The reason for this is that as a nation we are not only vigilant about such things, but we have in fact led the world in techniques to ERADICATE such diseases.

Try an argument that makes a little bit of sense next time. That one is as phony as an illegal alien's work papers. :rolleyes:
 
Fred Hansen,

That's a fine point. Americans travel all over, and the reason we don't have a resurgence in all those diseases is that the average American who travels has access to healthcare. If there were something that discouraged the travelling folk from going to the doctor, this would not be so. Don't kid yourself into thinking people don't go abroad and catch these diseases; they most certainly do. You have to be pretty much dead to get checked at customs by a doctor, and all the people you just infected on the flight won't have symptoms at all. Immigration checkpoints are not an efficient method of preventing the spread. In contrast, someone walking through open desert is not likely to infect large numbers of people in the same way that an infected air passenger will.

This argument is far from silly. We've had flus kill millions of people. Avian flu is the one everyone knows about right now....if someone caught a new and more infectious strain in Mexico, and then came to the US illegally, would you want that person staying out the emergency room to save your taxpayer dollars? My whole point in this thread is that, compared to having that illegal with bird flu wandering around because he's afraid to go to the hospital, we should be happy to have him come in to be diagnosed and confined, just as would happen with an American traveller who returned home sick.
 
This argument is far from silly.
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Yeah, it's way down below silly to the point of being right off the absurdity scale.

Some day you may even come to understand why. For now it's just a waste of keystrokes to explain it to you. :rolleyes:
 
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