The "whats your life worth" stuff needs to end

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I agree with you completely except I believe that if someone can reasonable afford a better gun they should. For instance if someone were thinking about a cheap unreliable gun but could even afford a better used gun I would be less likely to condone the cheaper gun because to be honest, especially with some first time buyers, like MANY in my family, They know guns from movies, no military, no police. Some of my family was way behind on the computer age and did not know how to research for a gun. They did not even know guns jammed. They purchased "very" cheap used guns that were treated poorly and are underreliable. They are better than nothing and will work for at least the first shot.

If someone comes to me that I know has no idea about a gun, and they want a cheap, and I mean cheap as in poorly made gun; I will ask if they can afford better. To be honest I would not want to advise someone to get a gun I would not trust my own life on. I would however help them get the best gun in their budget. Heck all of my close friends who have wanted a firearm and dont have one, I have thrown them $50 of my own just because I think it is important if they believe it is... and I'm a broke college student.

Marine I do believe overall we are on the same page. I also completely agree if someones budget is in the $400-$500 range, there are so many good hanguns out there to suit their needs rather than save for a sig or h&k... unless they NEED it.

I appreciate you posting this however as we all sometimes need a reality check and shouldn't suggest our favorites and safe queens because anything less will be inadequate. If they trust it, it is all that matters.
 
I have to agree with the Marine. It is the person not the gun that make the difference between life and death. A determined person with cheep gun that works, has abetter chance of surviving than one with a hi dollar gun if they do not have the right mind set or ability.

I too have seen (what is your life worth) used when some one is knocking a brand of gun. Buy the best equipment you can afford and learn how to use it but equipment alone is not enough. :D
 
Good points, marine6680.....

Quality does not always equal price. If someone has a sub-$200 gun budget & needs a reliable SD weapon, I'd recommend a Hi-Point or a Tokarev over a Cobra or Jimenez any day.....but I'd probably recommend a used Rossi or Charter Arms revolver first (no extra mags to buy). And I'd recommend these over what is currently coming out of the Taurus, HK, & SIG factories these days, esp. with the poor customer service they've been offering.
 
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I grew up a lot like you did except it was in the 50s and 60s. However, we had a choice at meal time. We could choose beans and taters or taters and beans. We could sometimes choose between cornbread or cold biscuits left over from the mandatory biscuits and gravy we had for breakfast. Growing up that way also made us more aware of value. Why spend more for an expensive brand name product when there is a cheaper alternative that will get the job done?

I'm cheap and proud of it. I started out with nothing, retired debt free 9 1/2 years ago with enough assets to buy the toys I wanted. I buy based on price and value but I never buy anything without doing my homework. I own a Hi-Point C9 and a Phoenix HP-22A because they both always go bang everytime I pull the trigger and they both hit what I aim at. I don't know what else I could gain from spending more other than the pretty factor and snob appeal.

How is a gun snob any different than a car snob? I have friends who insist on driving BMWs and other high end cars because they insist they are safer and more durable than the cars us common folks drive. They do perform better in many aspects than my lowly 2011 Kia Optima but they don't do any better in crash tests andmy car has a better reliability record. They have the snob appeal of their expensive cars and I have my car and the $25,000 + and my car that has never failed me and gets 10 MPG better fuel mileage.
 
I have owned manny lesser made firearms over the years .Started in 1972 with HAUSE SA 357 MAG .RG M12 22LR to well over 80 plus firearms in my life time.You make decisions as life goes on.You up grade as your money sees fit. I am down to a few calibers 22lr,32acp 357 mag & 40 sw.
 
You don't have to pay $800 for a reliable gun. $150 may not get you a reliable gun either.

I understand that $150 might fit into budgets much easier than $800 but nonetheless I wouldn't encourage someone to buy a gun simply because it fits in their budget. Not all guns, regardless of price, are created equal.

To be honest, and I'm in exactly this situation with a non gun owning friend, I'll always encourage people to skip cheap simply because they can afford it. My buddy's house was recently broken into and he woke up a thief stand right next to him. As he jumped out of bed and chased the theif down the hall he ran into a second thief trying to take his TV off the wall. Thankfully both guys elected to flee rather than attack.

While my buddy lost some of his electronics, he was otherwise unharmed but he also understands how badly this could have ended. He also has decided that he now needs a gun but doesn't have $800 to spend on one. He'd prefer to buy a $150 gun, the cheaper the better.

With that said, I won't let him buy a gun because it fits into his budget. I will help him find and buy a gun however that is both reliable and fits his budget.

His life is worth more than simply buying the first gun he can afford. Hiis life is worth the time and effort that it will take to find a gun that is both reliable and affordable. He doesn't know much about guns so the task of finding one that fits the bill comes down to me.

I understand your rant about "what's your life worth" but the price paid for a gun isn't always the only way to measure its overall cost.

I think that the "what's your life worth" statement is most often directed at people who simply buy cheap because it is cheap. Price is what you pay, value is what you get. Buying cheap isn't always the cheapest in the long run. This is true regardless of the amount of money you have in the bank. Maybe even more so with a limited budget. If you can only afford one gun, you want to make sure that you buy the right one the first time.

Budget or no, buy the best, most reliable gun you can afford. That's what I think most of those life worth comments refer to.
 
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Too bad this topic is in the Pistol/revolver section because it applies to rifles also.

I'm not talking defense, but over all, like hunting for example.

You can buy a $2000 rifle, add a $1500 scope and go deer hunting or you can take your $100 Mosin, run out and get your deer after you get off work in the afternoon. Both folks get their deer but which one cost the most.

A tad off topic but kind of related.

I was hunting one day and drove down a logging road to find a little beat up import car. Off to the right up the hill a bit was two you ladies looking some what confused.

I stopped to see if they needed help and they did. Apparently these two ladies were both single mothers trying to make ends meet.

They pooled their resources and bought a deer tag. Borrowed a gun a few shells and went hunting. Shot a deer and had no ideal what to do with it.

I dressed the deer for them and stuffed it in the back seat of their car. Kind of gave them an ideal how to cut it up. (Didn't have the heart to tell them they were also suppose to have a conservation stamp and hunter's safety card, none of my business) but they did call me later that night to thank me and tell me they got home alright.

I've thought back about how much money I've spent on some of my hunts and I would have bet none of my deer ever tasted as good and the deer those young lady's got.

Made me go fondle my unknown brand single barreled 16 gage that my grandfather used to feed his family during the depression and the only gun he used (or had) in his part time deputy job where he transported prisoners from Perryville AR to Little Rock in a wagon.

Also killed my first deer with that shotgun. Don't shoot it now, it was made for black powder and has been shot loose because none of us knew you weren't suppose to use modern smokeless shells.
 
Kreyzhorse: since longuns have been brought up, your friend may be better served with a good shotgun. Reliable used 20ga & .410 pumps can be found closer to the $150 mark than the $800 mark....
 
I think you missed the point...

I was poor, so I understand what they go through, but thats not the main point.

The point is that some of the people that use the "whats your life worth" statement... use it in a judgmental manner... like they are superior due to their more expensive guns, or that the person with the cheap gun is inferior due to the choice in a cheaper gun. They equate money spent with not only "quality" as a direct relationship... the more money you spend the more quality you get, always... I.G. A $1000 Sig is always better than a $500 Glock... But it also seems to often come off as more money spent means better quality person as well.
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Naw, I didn't miss your point. You gave a sob story about being poor because you don't like people trash talking your cheap guns. It makes you feel bad and you don't like it. Got it. Your guns don't care.

As for the expensive gun equalling equality, you are very late to the party in making this claim. I have done so several times on various gun boards over the last 10 years or so, mostly starting with the shooting of Blazer ammo, BION. Did you know that you should not shoot cheap ammo? Yep, that is right. I heard it for years and how it was damaging my guns.

Not always though, many are just uninformed... and just don't/can't understand the situation of not being able to afford better.
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Yeah, probably because if you can afford a computer, internet connection, etc., you can probably afford a decent gun of the likes folks are talking about such as a Ruger or a Glock, or you could save up for one. This kind of reminds me of the guy with the the iPhone at the grocery store using food stamps to pay for his food while he Skyped with some female about why he didn't get everything on the list.

People will "budget" for that which they think is important and for many, a decent quality firearm falls far behind the iPhones, flat screens, and new rims.
 
Kreyzhorse: since longuns have been brought up, your friend may be better served with a good shotgun. Reliable used 20ga & .410 pumps can be found closer to the $150 mark than the $800 mark....
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That's a good point Seeker Two. He wants a snub nose revolver and I've found some decent 4" used S&W but he's still favoring a snub. I've not even thought about a shotgun but it's worth bringing up.
 
People will "budget" for that which they think is important and for many, a decent quality firearm falls far behind the iPhones, flat screens, and new rims.
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But you again completely missed the point. You may be able to budget enough with sacrificing some things to buy a more costly firearm, but for some people those sacrifices are made in the budget in order to save just the buck and a half for an inexpensive gun.
 
I don't know what else I could gain from spending more other than the pretty factor and snob appeal.

How is a gun snob any different than a car snob?
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Just because a person bought a "pretty" gun or a high performance car doesn't make him a "snob". I've come to understand that there is such a thing as "reverse-snobbery"-and I find it to be just as offensive as snobbery.
 
But you again completely missed the point. You may be able to budget enough with sacrificing some things to buy a more costly firearm, but for some people those sacrifices are made in the budget in order to save just the buck and a half for an inexpensive gun.
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A comedy of errors is what I think of this thread....you are right cheapshooter, but I don't think that was doublenaughtspy's point. He was implying that sometimes someone is poor, because they got an unlucky hand in life, and other times "poor" because they budget money foolishly. The person that doesn't know how to manage money comes off as poor, when really, their inability to make wise choices made them poorer than they had to be. Some people are "poor" but they find money to go out and drink with and then they come out with this idea of getting a trustworthy carry piece for cheap, which shows me that person has an inability to appropriately priortize in their life.

If someone has to buy a budget firearm, occasionally they need to look back and figure out why they are in that situation. Some cases of a hardship are legitimate, and other times its because someone was a fool with money. No one wants to be told that doing something differently than they do can be smarter, but sometimes the truth hurts.

The moral of my post and double naught's - many people are not genuinely poor / actual poor people are the rarer type. In my life I have met more bad money managers than I have poor.
 
Reference a Snub nose, IE say a Chief Special. More expensive, normally, than say a Mod 65 S&W 4" Gives you .357, if you want, .38 Spl, hundreds of ammo choices.

Having had 10 of those Revolvers, I used in my classes, for 20 plus years, they had very few trips to the Smith, and just got smoother, Rubber grips, white paint (fridge white) on front sight, grind bottom off Cylinder release.

The new models with Beryllium Copper firing pin, in frame, the one problem they had, solved.

Speed loaders! Done.
 
Lots of replies...

Maybe I made my point in the wrong manner... I came off from the wrong side. It was late, I got a little rant'y and sidetracked. :p

Some are under the impression that I am upset and defending my own gun purchases because I buy cheap and I can't buy better, or can but don't.

Thats far from the truth of my situation. I can't say I do not own a hi-point... I do own the carbine. I got it just for the heck of it, to see what the fuss was about and a range toy I didn't have to worry about banging around. I actually wanted the Kel Tek for that purpose as I felt it was better overall, but at the time, I could not find one in stock anywhere that wasn't at least $150+ more than normal price. Usually $500+, it wasn't worth that much.

I have and are willing to spend $1000+ on a firearm, I'm just not going to do so just because I can... thats poor money management. If all I want is a simple hunting rifle, the $600 bolt gun will serve the same as a $2000 bolt gun.

The difference is... do I want the more expensive gun enough to matter...

I will admit I have bought something just because I wanted it when something cheaper fit the bill just fine. But I, like many, have felt the sting of the poor economy, so I analyze my purchases a bit more than before. Do I really need the $2000 Noveske AR, when I can get a similar AR from Colt for $1300? Depends... intangible factors always apply, but in the end both are quality firearms.

Someone thought I meant that Sigs are always better than glock... I said that as an example of false reasoning in which someone equates higher price with better gun.

There are those that are being cheap simply for the sake of being cheap... and those people do need to be asked if they can truly afford to spend more. If they can... then yes, why buy cheap just to do it. They can afford better, lets help them get better within reason. If they can afford a good Glock or XD, then that may be a good option, even if they could afford a HK or Sig, does not mean they must or should.

There are those that can not afford better, I have had friends that could not afford internet, they borrowed mine when they came to my house.

I took a friend of mine to the gun store with me once. Single mom, no cable or internet in her apt, she struggled with bills. I bought a gun that day and spent over a grand. She made the comment that she could never see spending so much on something she didn't need.

For someone like her, smart practical spending is the most important thing.


So, my point may not have come across properly... thats my fault.

Basically... if someone is being cheap just to be cheap, then yes steer them to something better and reasonable. If they are truly incapable of spending more, then we need to help, not condemn or condescend.

There is a difference between snobbery and giving practical advice... I just feel I see snobbery a little too much. (not saying anyone in this thread are guilty of it... just I seen the comment, and was reminded of the other times I seen it used)
 
Marine I got what you were saying from the start. I have often posted that it seems like some people think that just because you can't afford XYZ gun you don't deserve to own one. And I also reply with so people who can't afford the guns you have they have no right to protect themselves and their families. I fall in to the group that can not afford the high priced guns. I paid less than $600 for both my guns. Do I worry what people think ?Would I like to own higher priced guns? Yes I would. I would love to own a Baby Eagle, Coonan Classic, Wilson Combat, Ed Brown and many others that cost more that what I own. But do I regret what I have because they did not cost more? No I got what I could afford . I like many to have the ability to save up for more costly firearms. But I even though they did not cost as much as many others firearms they do go bang and I trust them with mine and my families life.
 
The "whats your life worth" stuff needs to end
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$160 handgun will wear out way faster than a $500 gun.

Cheaper guns are likely to fail/break, firing pins break/brittle on cheap.
 
johnbt said:
...I'm going to spend nearly a grand and buy the tires I want. Circumstances change, but knowing the 'net, somebody is going to tell me I'm an idiot for spending that much.
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I certainly won't. That's exactly what's on my wife's Enclave. And on my Bonneville and Park Avenue I pick through the guy's turn ins because I'm a cheap (insert favorite expletive here).

My wife won't drive my car. I buy her new cars, and I won't buy myself a car with fewer than 75K miles. All in one household.

Different choices for different mindsets. I refuse to say that either is wrong.

When I was in my '20s raising a family I had one pitiful Llama automatic that jammed if you looked at it cross-eyed, but there was food on the table. (I know some folks like Llama; no offense intended.) Food and diapers came first. Period.

Today there's really too many guns. I ought to get rid of some, but I just bought another one. (I know, I've only got two hands.)

MB
 
Buying an expensive gun over a cheaper one is no guarantee of quality. Of the four 1911 Colts I have owned, only one was shipped that did not have to be adjusted, parts changed, etc. to get past stoppages. So, when buying the perceived "best", you do not always get what you pay for.
 
Basically... if someone is being cheap just to be cheap, then yes steer them to something better and reasonable. If they are truly incapable of spending more, then we need to help, not condemn or condescend.

There is a difference between snobbery and giving practical advice... I just feel I see snobbery a little too much.
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I tend to agree Marine. I see no reason for someone to take the food outta their hungry kid's mouth to buy Corbon ammo when in reality, Wally World WWB will kill just as fast, but........ cutting corners and taking more risk than necessary just to save a few bucks to buy cigarettes is another story. When it comes to SD/HD, I feel that a person should use what they are comfortable with, proficient with and have confidence in, regardless of what it costs. Other folks should do the same, and not belittle or be condescending to others with opinions and needs different than their own. Awareness, preparedness and proficiency are much more important when it comes to SD/HD than cost of equipment. But as others have said, if one can afford a computer with internet access, and has the spare time to sit at a keyboard and surf internet gun forums, they certainly should be able to afford a new S&W .38 J-Frame @ $350. No concerns about reliability and accuracy from those, with any problems covered under the Lifetime Warranty.
 
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