Taurus Quality: Objective Opinions...?

Dr. Strangelove said:
I've owned a PT101P for about two months now, and been very pleased.

There a lots of things to like about Taurus. I said before, my PT945 was about perfect for features, and very reliable to boot. It's typical of mechanical devices to have most of the failure rates in early use. If your PT101 stays good for a high number of rounds, then you will probably have a good long term experience.....I hope that's the case for you.

But the total picture still makes me cautious of owning another Taurus.

Now to jump back to the other side. It is apparent that some people do unfairly criticize Taurus. It's a fact of life that it bothers some people that can get a good pistol at a low price.
 
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I've owned 2 Tauri. One is one of the most maligned in Taurus history; a PT-22. I find mine almost perfectly made, with beautiful finishing and crisp attention to detail. It also has never failed, even though it has had nearly a steady diet of truncated cone type ammo, (Remington Yellow-Jackets) something Taurus soundly cautions against using, due to feeding problems. I definitely rate it 5 for 5. On the other hand, I also owned a PT-111, which I bought on a whim after inspecting a friend's. Only thing I liked about it after I bought it was the size. It has long been replaced. I generally give Taurus a 50/50 chance, as it's been my experience with them.
 
Brazilian quality control is not to be trusted; it's not just Taurus.

Putting some doughy American in the CEO chair is not going to change the industrial practices of an entire nation.
 
First I would like to say that I myself do not own a Taurus; however, we run appx. fifty students a month through classes and I have had oportunity to witness an unusually high percentage of Taurus' break in comparison to other manufacturer's firearms.
 
B. Lahey said:
Brazilian quality control is not to be trusted; it's not just Taurus.

Wait, Springfield 1911's look OK to me.

Anyway, I worked in manufacturing involving the US, Mexico, Asia, Europe, etc. You can have good quality control anywhere, it just has to be installed and maintained. Now I admit that the Germans, Swiss, and such do have a built in history and training for quality control, so this makes things easier in their case.
 
Taurus Quality

In the early 80's I was looking for a Beretta 92 and happened into a shop that had a Taurus 92 in stainless. Good by logic, hello emotions. Had to have it and bought it on the spot with a bunch of hi cap mags. First time out I couldn't hit a thing. Thinking it was me, I had two friends try it with the same results. Called Taurus and they sent the return shipping label and off it went. 3 weeks later it arrived with the same issue. I called back and politely but assertively complained. Back to Taurus on their dime and 3 weeks later back with among other things a new barrel. To this day it has been reliable but not a bulls eye gun. Then I got the hots for the little Beretta flip top 22. I couldn't find one anywhere but low and behold a Taurus PT22 is looking at me in a shop. Ditto for logic and emotions and I bought it. It has been perfect. By the way I am still spontaneous but not "quite" as bad.;)
 
I owned a new PT 92 worked great, put lots of rounds down range, no serious problems.

I bought a used Taurus SS .357 MAG. Vent Rib bar. (Forgot Mod. #), worked great, trigger and finish was not as nice as my used S&W 586,
{I made 4 targets on a sheet of 8X11 graph paper then photo copied a bunch of em off and this is what I shot at 25 yrds with both guns the Taurus was just behind my S&W in accuracy, neither of their rounds would stray off of which ever of the 4 targets on the 1 sheet I aimed the gun at.

I eventually sold off the 92 (small hands) as it was too bulky for me and not quite accurate enough (trigger weight/reach).
I sold off the Taurus .357 as it didn't look or feel as good as the S&W did, that probably could have been fixed by a new set of grips but I still had the S&W (W new grips of coarse), to cover the .357 MAG. slot and well . . times were hard after all.
I later got a PT92C for CC and the barrel was almost touching 1 side of the slide bore (extremely off center, very inaccurate) sold it off as well.

Recently I have been very curious about the new 24/7 though, I wonder if they make that in a .357 SIG Compact. . .

I have read many bad things on the various net forums (true or not?) about Taurus so I would be very careful about getting another 1 though.

N.D.
 
Unless Taurus gets ISO 9000 certified I am not buying their products.
Some exceptions for range only guns that are knock offs of "cassic" firearms. 1911, M9, etc.

A lot of people can't get past the fact that the pistols designs aren't the problem. It is QC, so if you get one that was made well you are set. If you get one made on Friday afternoon or something you are screwed. It also doesn't help that there seems to be an abnormally high number of stories about people sending guns back to the factory only to have it returned not fixed at all, or with some other problem which is very blatant.
 
I have a stainless PT-145 Millennium Pro. 11 shots of .45 ACP, mine is 100% reliable with any ammo I've put through it. :cool:

Had a Kahr PM-45, which had to go back to the factory before it would feed one of it's tiny 5-round magazines without jamming. When it got back, was reliable with premium defense loads, but still jammed with hardball. Traded it for a Kel-Tec PF-9 and a Ruger LCP.

Everyone is ga-ga over Kahr quality, but after detail stripping mine and cleaning out dozens of pinhead-sized metal shavings from the machining process, and darn near cutting myself on the sharp edges, IMHO it's far, far inferior to the quality of the Taurus. :eek:
 
B. Lahey said:
Sure, they look ok... until they break. Just my experience, I may just be bitter.

Ok, my experience with Springfield is with the XD made in Croatia. You had a bad experience, but I think the Springfield 1911's seem to fair well on most forums.

BTW, my 1966 Colt 1911 failed on me once, so none are immune to failure.
 
I see a few accuracy complaints here, which are normally over shadowed by complaints of reliability or quality.

I have to ask.... Did you slug the bore on these previously owned, or currently owned firearms?


I had some wicked wear marks in the bore of the .380 mentioned in my first post. To see what was going on, I decided to slug it. It was supposed to be .355" in the grooves.

What popped out was not expected. The bore was oval. It measured .357" by .359". In order to get any kind of performance out of the P.O.S., I would have to stick .358" diameter projectiles in it. ...The handloaders here know what that means. Have you ever priced custom-sized 90-100gr lead and jacketed bullets? It's not exactly affordable.


Slug your bores. Taurus doesn't believe in standard specs or round bores.
 
FrankenMauser said:
Slug your bores. Taurus doesn't believe in standard specs or round bores.

That could have been my problem with my PT945. I am a fairly good combat shot, but I had a hard time keeping rounds on the paper...much less center of mass. I could do better using my Smith 36 or Colt Det. special snubs than I could with my 4.25" PT945. Shame, the PT945 was reliable and had great controls.

Anyway I traded it on a Glock 36. No problem with the Glock, I hit the target just fine.:)

Added: It's all about profits. I read about a year ago that Taurus had a great year for world wide sales. Their sales beat S&W and many others by a large amount. As long as their sales remain strong they will probably not change their QC practices.
 
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Taurus

I had a Taurus 380 auto some years ago. One day at the range had sudden FTF. Inspection of cartridge shoed no primer strike. Disassembly revealed that the bar designed to depress the firing pin block had fractured. Repair was about 8 weeks. Second time out to the range after repair I had the same problem. Another 8 weeks for repair. I traded it in as I had no confidence in its reliability. Have never bought Taurus since.
 
i have a pt92afs, pt101p, and a rossi 462. (owned by taurus.)

the pt92 had a couple stovepipes in the first 100 rounds fired through it, and one FTE since, all with the crappy monarch steel 115gr fmj. also, i didn't fully clean all that gunk from shipping off of the locking block. it's gone about 1500 rounds since with no stovepipe, FTF, or FTE at all, and that's including the monarch steel, monarch brass, winchester and remington 115gr fmj, some aluminum casings i found (don't remember the brand), WWB NATO, and hornady TAP. i have 100% confidence in it as long as the ammo is anything but monarch FMJ, and even then it's 99% confidence, with the 1% owed to the rounds. super accurate, super reliable, very light relative recoil compared to most other 9mm pistols, and has a decent trigger. only complaint is that it's a little big for concealed carry, but with the regular mags having 17rd capacity and the easy to find 20rd mags (which i keep in it) it's become the bedside piece.

the pt101p is excellent. 250 rounds in and no FTE or stovepipe. no hiccup of any kind whatsoever. monarch brass 155gr and 180gr FMJ mostly, with some hornady TAP rounds to see how they fire. IMO the monarch rounds are the least reliable rounds i could put through it and it didn't even have a break-in jam. i was impressed, considering the break-in my pt92 required. the adjustable sights were dead on from the factory, so i have no need to touch them. it's one of two complaints about the gun... it's accurate enough as-is that i don't need the added height of the sights that tore up a felt-lined holster, and the other complaint is that the front sight could have used a better paint job. it's a deep bore hole that didn't have much paint, but that was easily solved with a bottle of white out and some day-glo yellow paint. i put some on the back sights too just to make it look cool. (edit) also, the pt101p is just as accurate as the pt92, and they're both as accurate as i am. if i miss, it's because i missed, not the gun. also, the pt101p has 16 round magazines. that's alot of .40 at your disposal. the gun's drawback is again the size and weight, but precisely because of the size and weight it shoots great. i value that more than size.

the rossi 462 is excellent as well. the first box or two it had a slight feel of a catch in between the 5th and 6th shots (weird, didn't matter where the cylinder was. i checked.) but that went away quickly. it's had about 1000 rounds through it, probably 700 .38spl and 300 .357mag, with the catching-hiccup gone, and it's as accurate as you could expect from a 2" revolver. it's currently broken through my own fault. i let it get dry-fired way too much trying to show my friend how to use it before actually firing any rounds and the firing pin broke. waiting on some extra cash to roll in before i get the part replaced. i didn't buy it, it was a gift, and the person who bought it didn't send in the card in the box that is required to activate the warranty, so repairs are on my dime. again, not the fault of taurus. if the card was sent in, the rossi would already be in the mail and i'd probably be getting her back before i miss her.

those are subjective opinions of my own experience. sorry if they're a bit lengthy, but it's relevant info.

here's the objective side. as for the 24/7 or millenium lines, i have no personal experience besides shooting one a time or two. there seem to be lemons from just about every major gun manufacturer, including the big mainstays like colt and s&w. no one craps on those guns because of a few bad apples, but taurus gets a bad rep for guns made 20 years ago or a few bad guns today. i see a taurus or two at the range every time i go, and everyone seems happy. they're affordable, which is the draw. if you're worried about quality, you should shoot the gun a little first. all guns have the possibility of breaking at any point. seems like many of the taurus horror stories happen within the break-in period, which sucks, true, but here's where the warranty kicks in. most tauruses don't break immediately, like other gun companies, but if they do, the other companies don't offer that kind of warranty. to me, waiting a 2-3 months for a free repair beats paying yourself and waiting a month anyway.

also, all the "the gunsmith says ______" stories should come with a reminder that he's a gunsmith, and most people with working guns don't have a need for his services. taurus also sells a LOT of guns. i buy my ammo at academy because it's the cheapest around, and i'd say 2/3 of the times i go in there a guy is filling out paperwork for a taurus. higher volume = more guns brought in.
 
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One point. Many of us here do a lot of shooting, but the fact is that there are lots of people that buy a handgun for SD, then shoot about 30 rounds and put the gun in their dresser without shooting it for years.

These same low use buyers go to a gun store and find pistol with a good price that feels good. Then they only shoot a few rounds. So, from their standpoint they have a good pistol they can depend on. Flawed thinking perhaps, but there are a lot of gun owners that fit that mold.
 
Wouldn't recommend

No actual experience but they don't get recommendations from any of the gun guys at the Gander counter. They say they see a lot of them come back through their shop. They are all covered by the good warranty coverage (a strong point) but it's no fun having to keep bringing in your new pistol when you should be firing it instead. I agree, it's exactly what you expect a CEO to say ... I wouldn't put weight on his comments one way or the other. A CEO's only goal is to sell a company, apply a positive spin to every situation. You might check with your trusted gun dealers and see what they see come back in for the new Tauruses. I know I looked at the Taurus 92 but am oh so glad I went with the Beretta. I'll admit they have some cool looking guns and some good prices but their reputation has steered me clear. madmag has a really good point. Funny thing is, if your going to do that, all the more reason to pony up the money for something really good. If your going to place your life on something that has set in a drawer for long periods unused ... you better be really sure it's going to still work. I know I'd trust my life and my family to my Beretta 92 ... after 10 rounds or after 1000.
 
I'll chime in,,,

I have purchased 2 new taurus revolvers in the past year,,,
One has been a great shooter since day one,,,
One was a "bad out of the box" specimen.

Taurus did fix the problem with the defective revolver,,,
They got the fix right on the first time out,,,
They did not "hassle" me in any way,,,
It was just a drag to have to wait.

Since the revolver was in the first year of ownership,,
They covered the cost of shipping both ways.

It is nice to know that no matter how long I own the handguns,,,
Taurus' lifetime warranty will repair them free of charge.

I don't think I will buy any more Taurus handguns though,,,
I see too many of my acquaintances having the same problems,,,
I'm not comfortable buying from a company who has a 50/50 track record.

It seems if you get a good one,,,
It's good forever.

It's just that I have seen too high a percentage,,,
That were faulty straight from the factory.
 
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Never owned a Taurus until recently, purchased a TCP because I preferred it over the Ruger LCP, so far no complaints, accurate, recoil easy to control, function good, keeping fingers crossed, I believe the TCP is made in USA.
 
Yes any gun can have a failure! Humans build them! It would just be nice if they acted like they cared when you called. I had a 85SSUL that the cylinder binded out of the box. I called CS & I almost felt like I should appologize for calling! I called back to speak with a CS mgr, to inform him of how I had been treated & what that did for my opinion of the company. He didn't act like he cared much either! It took them 2 days to log my gun into thier system. The online repair status finally showed they recieved my gun. Then it went to "work has began". Now it has went back to gun recieved!? They have had it for two weeks now! So I guess i have about what, 8 weeks to go? I think a good gunsmith could whittle a good revolver out of aluminum in 8 weeks!!
 
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