Riot defense senario

In "theory" I agree that the best place to defend your family is in your home, I am not going to arm my neighborhood, nor consort with my neighbors about a defensive strategy. I will close and lock all doors, close curtains, assemble my weapons, and WAIT. As long as they stay outside, and away from me then they may riot to their hearts content. If they enter my home, or attempt to harm me, or my family, THEN I will defend them with NECESSARY force.

If you assemble a makeshift militia of your neighbors I would venture to guess that If LEOs show up, you will probably be taking a ride to the crossbar hotel and, not be around to defend anything.

Riots can be diffused, an Idiot on his roof with a rifle, or a band of neighbors armed to the teeth and on patrol is an invitation for SWAT to show up and let you see what a bad day in the neighborhood really is.
 
an Idiot on his roof with a rifle, or a band of neighbors armed to the teeth and on patrol
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Well then, I guess all those Korean shop owners who successfully defended their shops durring the 92' riots here, while everything was destroyed all around them, were complete idiots. If so, thats the kind of idiot I want to be.
 
I was in a riot here in Tampa in the mid 80's. A police officer placed a choke hold on a man and he died later in jail. The minority community errupted in violence despite this guys fighting police like a madman. Anyway as the rioters burned their ghetto, I drove to my grangparents house, which bordered the danger zone. My grandparents refused to leave and my mother was going to go, so I told her I would go in her place. My grandfather and I sat on their porch with my mini-14, shotgun, and pistol. Several neighbors also armed were sitting on thier porches. Riot ended no problemo.

Now I have a family including 2 boys. Now I have a better sense of reality, mortality, ect. I would run if it was an option. I hope that doesn't translate as cowardly because it isn't. If the option to run was not availible, I would prepare to get real nasty. I would setup some makeshift cover and eliminate any threats to my home and family. I wouldn't arm my neighbors except for my dad who is my neighbor and knows how to handle my weapons. My wife and 9 year old can kick some butt also.

My only suggestion is to remain mobile. Getting on the roof gives you visual superiority but you are also exposed. In my community the extra height gives little advantage. I would remain mobile on the ground. Then just use the appropriate weapon as the ranges change.
 
I would give them some lemonaide or water. I live about 25 miles from town, out in the country. That would be one hell of a walk to get here.

Hey, thats one of the reasons I moved out here, so I wouldn't have to deal with those kinds of scenerios.
 
My opinion has been, and always will be, to organize yourself and your neighbors - now. Don't wait for SHTF. Only having 20 to 30 minutes to figure out what to do is really short changing yourself when you, yours, and your neighbors have had years to organize and become an active community.

As I'm fond of saying - take Neighborhood Watch about 10 steps further and get organized now for whatever may happen in the future...don't wait.

It's your neighborhood, keep it. One person alone can't be a neighborhood.
 
I believe there is a line that the looting/mob/riot scenario must deal with.

On one side is giving up all possessions, everything you've worked hard for. On the other side is losing what is not fixable (people, pets, etc.). You have to mix both; you can't just leave your life (your home); but you can't let go of real lives.

But, back to the line thing: There is a point where a riot, etc. becomes so out of hand that it is no longer safe to be traveling (remember the coca cola driver who got the **** beat out of him in the Rodney King riots?). When I can't get out, I'll bunker in. It makes no sense to be walking the streets doing patrols; but just bunker in. Don't leave your house, don't let anyone who shows malicious intent near it.

It's all about getting out alive.
 
OK grab m40, load it up, have one person shine a light on the mob, fire a round over their head. If that dosent stop them start picking off the people that seem to be leading the volience. Get my neighbors to guard the streets and back yards. have my m4 loaded if they get to close.
 
My opinion has been, and always will be, to organize yourself and your neighbors - now. Don't wait for SHTF. Only having 20 to 30 minutes to figure out what to do is really short changing yourself when you, yours, and your neighbors have had years to organize and become an active community.

As I'm fond of saying - take Neighborhood Watch about 10 steps further and get organized now for whatever may happen in the future...don't wait.

It's your neighborhood, keep it. One person alone can't be a neighborhood.
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GREAT point CMGTSM!!
Plan ahead. That way when the neighborhood Paul Revere on the phone calls you and and says "turn out your militia the rioters are coming!" everyone will know what to do.
It might also be a good idea, in addition to working with police when they arrive to keep in touch with the police 911 dispatcher during events to let the police know where y'all are foritfied and where you have neighbors stationed. Keep in touch with them.

You're right, no one person can be a neighborhood.
 
I would really like for some LEOs to weigh in on this, I don't know about the areas that some of you are in ( I'm in a Nashville TN suburb) but I can see it now..........

911 : What is your emergency ?
Joe Citizen: Yes, we hear the riots are getting close to our neighborhood and I just wanted you to know that our street is armed, and protecting ourselves, I am patrolling with my AR-15, along with Hank, Dale and Boomhower, we have shut off the cul-de-sac with our SUVs, and have Billy-Ray-Joe-Bob on the roof with a sniper rifle, just want to let you LE officers know we are trying to help out.

911: Please hold sir (sounds of SWAT team being dispatched)

You get the Idea !
I cannot believe that anyone on this forum who professes to be a responsible firearm owner would even think that you can just form a "Neighborhood Posse" and expect LE to think "Hey thats great, they are defending themselves".

It may fly where you live, but would likely wind up in a lot of arrests here.
 
OK Blackwater, so are you telling me (your feelings aside) that your Chief/Commissioner/whatever... is going to endorse armed citizens "patrolling" or "Locking Down" a neighborhood.

A CCW holder would be brandishing Here (with a Handgun) But walking down the street with a locked and loaded AR would assure you a ride in the BACK of a black and white.
 
Open carry is perfectly legal where I am. Then again, riots are pretty much never going to happen here unless some pretty messed up things happen...

Open carry is also perfectly legal in many other places, BTW.
 
You are correct,open carry is legal in many states, it is legal here for a CCW holder HOWEVER.... This only applies to HANDGUNS, not Rifles or Shotguns.

This would fall under the "intent to go armed" catagory.

In other words, walking around, or taking up a position of defense OUTSIDE your home is considered "looking for a fight".

Unless I am mistaken, this kind of action would also put you in the "premeditation" catagory. if you shoot someone (or several someones) after walking around armed for a spell could be spinned by a first year asst. DA as a murder looking for a victim.

I am not saying I disagree with wanting to protect what is mine, and using lethal force if necessary. Merely pointing out that the "Neighborhood Watch' with weapons is likely Illegal. If it were not then I would guess that more gang and drug infested urban neighborhoods would be doing it. Heck, if it were legal we could save our cities Billions of tax dollars because law enforcement would be moot.

Further, I will challenge any of you who live in urban, or suburban areas to load your favorite rifle, chuck it on your shoulder, and do a patrol thru your neighborhood, (be sure you call and tell your local PD you are doing it to help them out) and post your results.
 
Outcast,
The area is having a major riot. The police are tied up with that. Which is why the neighborhood men are setting up a defense because the police can't come. (See original post)
If they can send the swat team then they can send it to protect the neighborhood from rioters.
 
Doug,

(respectfully) I did read the original post, and understand the tactical situation, Major riot, LEOs otherwise occupied, etc.

My point is this, IF this plays out as written, then your only LEGAL option is to hunker down in YOUR home and protect yourself and family.

You have NO legal right to organize a "Posse" and try and protect your neighborhood. nor do you have a legal right to camp out on the roof and start shooting into a mob just because they passed the line in the sand in your yard (some states may vary)

Yes I have read the constitution, yes I know what the 2nd ammendment says, that does not mean that in the end you will prevail in court.

and please do not give me the standard "Judged by 12/Carried by 6 answer.
 
Well, I think a riot is an unusual circumstance that leaves people open to gather together in defense of their homes as a whole. I don't think a court would convict us or (minus self righteous DAs etc. that just don't like people having guns) even bring us to trail.

Those Korean guys during the RK riots in LA were within their rights to do what they did.

I think everyone would understand that there is no time to go through formal paperwork, deputizing oaths etc. involved in making a posse and all and drawing boundarylines at property and house.

I'm not even sure what I am talking about is a posse (law enforcement appointed officers out to make arrest and chase criminals). It's just some men around the neighborhood on the lookout for multiple intruders or a mob.

It's all about common sense. If your neighborhood is attacked and your neighbors should respond.

Bottling up yourself in your house is not the best tactical solution in my opinion. They can burn the house down around you or overwhelm you as a mob if you are just an individual in a house.

At least one LEO Blackwater OPS seems to agree by and large with me as do many other posters.

If nothing else, I don't think police would have much to say about the matter since they don't have the means to break us up...and if they did, like I said we wouldn't need to be doing what we were doing.


If you REEEALLY want to get technical, since most of your problem is with people walking around openly with guns, I suppose you could keep rifles and shotguns inside the vehicles at the barricade until needed by men stationed at the barricade and just walk up and down the street checking each other's houses with concealed handguns. Technically that is within the law in normal everyday circumstances in most states (minus barricades). Men stationed on the roof with rifles can't be seen by anyone, and are on their property with the guns hidden on the roof.



In addition, I think, as far as family safety goes, it would be prudent to put all familys up in one house at the center of the street or neighborhood farthest away from where a confrontation with rioters might take place.
 
You have NO legal right to organize a "Posse" and try and protect your neighborhood. nor do you have a legal right to camp out on the roof and start shooting into a mob just because they passed the line in the sand in your yard (some states may vary)
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As a police officer, outcast, I have to agree with you, but Doug has a point too. No "judged by 12" here, but I will give you a "desperate times call for desperate measures".

In the mid-60's here, we had a.... well, I wouldn't call it an all-out riot; let's call it a "march of very angry, determined people". They proved that they had destruction on their minds. They marched through town until they got to an area we call the South End. Entry to this area is restricted to a tactically important underpass. Now in the 60's, this area was strongly segregated as a whites only area. In fact, it was a redneck area with a whole lot of deer hunters :D .

The "marchers" tried to enter the South End through the underpass, only to be met by a solid line of people slamming bolts on deer rifles and slug guns. There were also rifles on numerous rooftops.

Approximately 25 people stopped over several hundred in their tracks.

There were no shots fired, no one was injured, and no arrests were made (among the South Enders).

A show of force can be a powerful weapon.
 
The area is having a major riot. The police are tied up with that.
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Exactly. The swat team is busy, believe me.
You have NO legal right to organize a "Posse" and try and protect your neighborhood. nor do you have a legal right to camp out on the roof and start shooting into a mob just because they passed the line in the sand in your yard (some states may vary)
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Well, I only know the law in a few states but- CA Penal Code
197. Homicide is also justifiable when committed by any person in
any of the following cases:
1. When resisting any attempt to murder any person, or to commit a
felony, or to do some great bodily injury upon any person; or,
2. When committed in defense of habitation, property, or person,
against one who manifestly intends or endeavors, by violence or
surprise, to commit a felony, or against one who manifestly intends
and endeavors, in a violent, riotous or tumultuous manner, to enter
the habitation of another for the purpose of offering violence to any
person therein; or,
3. When committed in the lawful defense of such person, or of a
wife or husband, parent, child, master, mistress, or servant of such
person, when there is reasonable ground to apprehend a design to
commit a felony or to do some great bodily injury, and imminent
danger of such design being accomplished; but such person, or the
person in whose behalf the defense was made, if he was the assailant
or engaged in mutual combat, must really and in good faith have
endeavored to decline any further struggle before the homicide was
committed; or,
4. When necessarily committed in attempting, by lawful ways and
means, to apprehend any person for any felony committed, or in
lawfully suppressing any riot, or in lawfully keeping and preserving
the peace.

I would hope few warning shots would be enough to make a group of rioters consider taking a different route, or even go home. If not, I will use whatever force is required to defend my life and that of anyone in my home.

Look at pictures and video from the RK riots here in 92' you will see MANY people standing on roofs with guns, hmm no swat teams though, guess they had other concerns. In the aftermath of the riot shootings will be investigated and you may have to defend your actions in court, but the law is clear.
 
I know of no law against organizing law abiding civilians to protect there homes. The better organized and coordinated they are the safer they will be. If you can do it.........do it.
 
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