Results of my Open Carry Wal-Mart complaint

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Open Carry

Move to Arizona, I found out that you "CAN" carry "open" in any store or restaurant "unless" they post the "NO FIREARMS" sign on the front door. I recently experienced this there,and just turned around and went somewhere else. I sent them a letter when I got home in regards to why I would not shop at their store. We have to keep trying, or they will win someday ! I live in Calif. God help me !
 
Clarification

Just thought I'd pass on a few friendly corrections regarding this thread . I had another thread originally about my experience at walmart, this new thread is just a follow up. When I was in the store, I was questioned about my gun, after the employee spoke with a manager, I was told I could continue shopping, after that, another pair of employees (also managers) esentially kicked my out with no offer for me to leave my firearm locked in my car, or back at home, to then come back and continue my shopping. One of them was obviously nervious, and was actually pretty rude in the way he handled it. I'm a VERY reasonable person, but I was honestly offended.
I'm in my late 20's. had maybe a little facial hair that day, shorter hair cut. Had on a nice tucked in button up shirt. With kaki cargo pants. And I was carrying cross draw in a button belt holster. :D
 
Open Carry --

Dang! I love this state! (Which will remain unspecified because we don't want you moving here! :eek:)

Rural, open carry is no big deal so long as you look like maybe you're headed out for some sort of "appropriate" recreation. Open carry is right in there with having a tire iron in your truck. Most everyone here looks like they're on their way out to do some sort of "appropriate" recreation, hunting, fishing, or maybe run the John Deere across the pasture and knock down the weeds.
 
Buy a Colt Defender, a Glock 36 or a Firestar Plus in 9mm and carry it concealed. What they don't know won't hurt them. When you get outside to your vehicle pull it out. The key here to buy a small very concealable firearm that won't show.
 
In post #35 I was off the mark in a criticism of the op. In an earlier and different thread, which I had not read, the op explained the blatant rudeness of a couple of the Wal-Mart employees toward him. The op was right to press for a formal apology from the manager for this. They did not give him a direct apology and he's right to be disappointed about that.

I think he did do a good job of forcing them to clarify their position and retrain all store employees in the policy of following state law and allowing open carry.

tipoc
 
Very interesting thread. I always venture into walmart to buy cheap target ammo, and I always carry concealed. In CT where I live open carry is technically legal, but there is a lot red tape concerning it. Now I dress kinda "gang bangerish" I wear baggy clothes and a fitted hat a lot and if i was open carrying I would have the cops called on faster than a heartbeat. I prefer CCW as it doesnt raise any unnessicary alarms from liberals.
 
I personally appreciate WalMart's attitude that they will follow state laws when it comes to concealed carry licenses in their stores. They could take a different approach and ban all guns, but they don't.

I also believe they are a private business and have the right to tell you they don't want open carry in their stores. If you don't like that decision, you also have the right to shop somewhere else. I think open carry in a private business is insulting, and an in your face attitude that will do nothing but get you in trouble.
 
I personally appreciate WalMart's attitude that they will follow state laws when it comes to concealed carry licenses in their stores. They could take a different approach and ban all guns, but they don't.

I also believe they are a private business and have the right to tell you they don't want open carry in their stores. If you don't like that decision, you also have the right to shop somewhere else. I think open carry in a private business is insulting, and an in your face attitude that will do nothing but get you in trouble.

What a great post! +1000!

I just got back from Wal-Mart and I was carrying, and NOBODY said anything to me. Of course, I was carrying concealed. Wonder if that had anything to do with it?

I don't know why people get surprised about being confronted or thrown out of a store while carrying in the open. Yes, it may be your State right. But why do people go into a store and somehow expect everybody in there to be supportive of your 2nd Amendment rights?

Get a clue. Guns scare people. They may call the store managers or even call police on you. They don't care what you're doing. To them, nobody but police should carry a gun. In their eyes, you're a nut looking for trouble. Again, it may be your right to carry, but businesses have the right to tell you to leave if they get a complaint.

Standing in a check out line with mothers and small children in close proximity of your gun is a great way to get our rights taken away. And then when that happens, the Open Carry folks will be the first ones to whine that it's evidence of more government intrusion into our rights.

I understand if you may have to Open Carry if you have no other option. But be ready to be confronted either by store employees or police. If you don't want the hassle, don't Open Carry.

However if you do have the option, get a CCW by all means. If you live in Colorado, they do have a good CCW permit:

http://www.handgunlaw.us/states/colorado.pdf

In my opinion, carrying a weapon should not be a publicity stunt to wave your Constitutional rights in everybody's face. It's about being able to defend oneself from an unprovoked lethal force encounter.

Why ask for trouble "just because you can?" Go get a CCW and never have a problem again.
 
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I am glad I live in a state where open carry does not scare people! Maybe the way to get people over their fear of guns is to show them that normal, everyday Americans carry guns in normal everyday life and that it is, well, a normal action? Concealed carry will do nothing to cause people to see that.
 
But MTS840....

Get a clue. Guns scare people. They may call the store managers or even call police on you. They don't care what you're doing. To them, nobody but police should carry a gun. In their eyes, you're a nut looking for trouble. Again, it may be your right to carry, but businesses have the right to tell you to leave if they get a complaint.

Wouldn't it be great if people weren't so scared of guns?
Cops with guns don't scare the rabbits because they are expecting the cops to have the guns.

Why not private citizens?

What better way to facilitate the process of acclimatization than open carry?
 
That is funny

Wall Mart sells ammo and pellet guns but does not allow open carry? What if a wild youth grabs a BB gun and goes ... WILD? Both pellet guns and pellets are in easy reach at my local Wall Mart. :eek:

P.S. Friday night is video camera night (1800 - 0100) at my local Wall Mart. Theres more action in the store and out in the parking lot than a backwoods bar. :D
 
Wouldn't it be great if people weren't so scared of guns?
Cops with guns don't scare the rabbits because they are expecting the cops to have the guns.

Why not private citizens?

What better way to facilitate the process of acclimatization than open carry?

Sure it would be great if it were that way. But we can't change reality by wishing it was different.

Today's media have a liberal agenda. They rarely portray guns or gun owners in a positive light. When people see a story on TV about a shooting, the media often displays a picture of a gun and use words such as "gunman" or "armed and dangerous." They see the images of survivors weeping and hugging each other and are left to answer the question "why?"

And in their defense, if someone has ever had a loved one murdered by a gunman, how sympathetic do you think they are going to be to your gun rights? What is easier to do? Pass tougher sentencing laws, or pass tougher gun laws?

In the aftermath of such a tragedy, their emotions drive their determination to ban guns, believing that such laws will make it harder for criminals to murder someone else's loved one. The laws pass because opportunistic lawmakers tie "crime" with "guns." They see a chance to get facetime on TV, and everybody feels better about themselves. These poor people are emotionally spent and angry how someone like that was able to get a gun.

Ask yourself. When's the last time the major media outlets portrayed a citizen successfully defending himself with a gun outside his home? Doesn't happen often. For every story like that, there are a hundred others that show civilians walking around with guns in public as some paranoid nut case looking for trouble.

Police administrators don't like Open Carry because of the "subject with a gun" calls that can potentially turn into a lawsuit, either for "infringing upon your rights," or even worse, a use of force incident. May God help you if you're the subject of such a complaint and you run from police.

So it's no surprise when people at Wal-Mart see some guy with a gun, those negative images or words pop into their mind. To them, only police have been properly trained in the use of firearms, and to them, police conjure up such positive feelings as "secure" or "trust" and usually "competent." Simply put, in a general sense, people trust the police.

You can't change these mental images by flaunting your rights in their faces when that's all they see on the news.

You may Open Carry your whole life and never have a problem. You may meet a lot of people who support your right to Open Carry.

But many others may not say anything to you directly, but they might call the store manager or police behind your back. And if you're a store manager, what are you going to do?

Are you going to tell these people that you have a right to carry that gun in the open in this State, or are you going to tell the guy with the gun to leave?

That's a no-brainer.

If we're going to win the battle of the minds, we can't fight the mainstream anti-gun media. In my opinion, we have to show the world that we are competent and that we use discretion, not waving the 2nd Amendment in everybody's face. The media makes it look like we have a 'chip on our shoulder,' and then they find some idiot gun owner who reinforces that opinion.

People at the mall or any other place are only going about their daily business. They aren't thinking about anything else, and suddenly they see some guy walking around with a gun strapped to his side. Suddenly, those negative images and emotions just popped into their minds.

Keeping the gun covered until it is needed in a lethal force situation may help people get over negative imagery of the guns and stereotypes of their owners.

Not only will it help change public opinion, but it's really the only reason most of us carry a gun in the first place.
 
MTS840 said:
If we're going to win the battle of the minds, we can't fight the mainstream anti-gun media. In my opinion, we have to show the world that we are competent and that we use discretion, not waving the 2nd Amendment in everybody's face. The media makes it look like we have a 'chip on our shoulder,' and then they find some idiot gun owner who reinforces that opinion.

People at the mall or any other place are only going about their daily business. They aren't thinking about anything else, and suddenly they see some guy walking around with a gun strapped to his side. Suddenly, those negative images and emotions just popped into their minds.

1. The public is never going to see a "competent gun owner using discretion" if they never see the gun.

2. I don't "wave the 2nd Amendment in everybody's face". I carry a gun in a holster on my belt.

3. "then they find some idiot gun owner who reinforces that opinion." No s... Sherlock. And that idiot gun owner is just as likely to be carrying a gun concealed that does something stupid with it, or a bunch of good ol' boys out having fun in the woods somewhere and do something stupid. But again, that is all the public is EVER going to see if the "competent gun owner using discretion" keeps his gun hidden.

4. "People at the mall or any other place are only going about their daily business." And so am I. I engage in normal activities in normal places where other normal people are engaging in those same activities.

5. "Suddenly, those negative images and emotions just popped into their minds." So you are a mind reader? And if those negative images and emotions do pop in their minds, how do you propose to change it by hiding the guns? All you are doing is reinforcing their opinions that guns are bad and should be hidden away like forbidden fruit.

A lot of people felt the same way about black people 70-80 years ago. A lot of people felt the same way about gay people 30-40 years ago. How did blacks and gays gain the equality they deserve? Did they do it by hiding away? Did they do it by keeping in their own little groups, in their own little sections of town? Did they do it by being "competent and using discretion"? No. They did it by inserting themselves into society, where they normally were not tolerated, until finally people starting noticing that they were just normal people like everyone else. And every now and then they did stage rallies and protest marches. If it worked for them, why do you not think it will work for gun owners as well?

People, in general, are getting tired of two major things. They are getting tired of being a victim (a victim to crime, a victim to the economy, to whatever). AND they are getting tired of a government that keeps promising them that they will be protected by further government regulation, when in fact, the more the government does, the worse the situation becomes. Look at the statistics whenever gun control comes up. In Seattle for instance. Over 95% of Seattle residents were against Mayor Nickels banning guns in public parks and recreation centers. He did it anyway, and the Court quickly ruled his gun ban illegal and ordered the signs removed in 30 days.

Recently the Vice President of the Brady Campaign spoke in Seattle. Do you know how many people showed up? 37! We are talking Seattle, here. We are talking one of the head honchos of the Brady Campaign! Do you think Seattle can be considered the cradle of conservatism? And yet look at how much the liberal society in Seattle supports gun control. NADA. None. Zip.

There is one reason to be afraid of the Brady Campaign - that reason is only if you are choking on the propaganda they are shoving down your throat. They are losing support everyday, and the only way we are going to ensure that they keep losing support is to show people that normal people carry guns in normal life - and nobody is ever going to get that image in their mind if they don't see the gun.
 
The law is clear on this . If its posted at all general customer doors the owner of the store can BAN guns. With that said as an instructor i always suggest to carry consealed if state law allows it. If state law allows concealed carry it is to your advantage to do so. I personally do not like open carry. But i will be the first to go to bat for gun rights as we all do. But open carry is not a good idea if the state allows concealed firearms. Just me could be wrong Thanks.
 
TOM RENZO said:
The law is clear on this . If its posted at all general customer doors the owner of the store can BAN guns.
That depends entirely upon state law and is not universal in every state.
 
I always say - If you're gonna act like a poser, expect to be treated like one...

Open carry in an urban environment is about as lame as it gets...IMHO, of course...
 
Some of us have the courage to stand up and exercise our rights and some don't. Hiding your gun away like criminals do is pretty lame. IMHO, of course.
 
Guess I'm considered 'lame' then, as I've open carried quite a bit. I'd much prefer to OC as it's more comfortable, but sometimes I just get tired of the silly attention it draws.

Realizing this goes against every 2A ideal, sometimes I wish we could just have a vetting process for concealed/OC and people would just leave us the heck alone after that. Police officers go through it and people don't look twice when they walk around with a gun on their hip all day.
 
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