Obtaining an alien firearms license - WA State

I didn't say Europeans were better than Americans - I am saying we are both the same and should not be discriminated against - either Americans abroad or foreigners here

Americans in England are subject to the same laws as an English person in every way - zero discrimination. In fact you are allowed 6 months as a visitor in England whereas an English person is allowed 90 days in the US

I am sorry if my reasonable level of education offends you but it's hard to shake off after all these years and I wouldn't want to do that just so nobody ever calls me elitist. Doesn't the gun lobby want educated people joining them and pushing for gun rights ?

I am on my 3rd U.S. driving licence - Wisconsin /Florida /Washington so you missed my point which was that if my Green Card is genuine enough for 3 driver's licenses (I passed car and motorcycle road and theory tests here) , then why not for a .22 lr single shot rifle license ?

U.S government agencies CAN tell the difference between a genuine green card and a forgery

I can't figure out why Americans are happy to see their own existing gun freedom legislation being frustrated by an admin hiccup between departments , just so that they can take swipe at a foreigner

If I thought this was a majority position in America I would pack up and leave - but I still don't believe it is. I believe there are literate, reasonable, fair minded, open, rational, friendly Americans and I am sticking with that belief and staying and taking the discrimination whilst fighting it

If that is a 'bad attitude' in anyone's book then so be it
 
"The more people who can be allowed to take up the hobby, the more people can defend against unreasonable gun laws"

"Be allowed"??? "Hobby"???

You need to stop thinking like a European.

Tim
 
Aliens? Firearms?

alien_comp01.jpg
 
welcome to TFL & America

I was asked where I learned English. When I said 'England' I was asked if they spoke English there.
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Thats really funny...it really happened? LOL!

I was living in Ireland and was in a heated political debate with a Scotsman about gun rights (he was against them) and after scoring a good point (we had a drunken audience keeping up with the debate) he said "why don't you learn to speak English" ...I replied..."I'm not in England, why should I. ?"
That clinched it, I was the clear winner....You'll notice our American debates are not settled with ideas, just clever one liners.
 
I believe that the 2nd Amendment should pertain ONLY to AMERICAN CITIZENS! Of course, illegal aliens should have absolutely NO rights in this country (zip, zero, nada) and Resident Aliens only limited rights. This IMHO, is a matter of national security and public safety.

I for one, am sick to death of hearing non-citizens gripe and complain about our country because they feel that our laws and politics are not fair to them. Guess what guys, they AREN'T SUPPOSED to be fair to you all! They were designed for US, not you! You come here either as a guest or an invader and then try to CHANGE our laws and policies to benefit YOU and attempt to turn our nation into the very nation you fled from. If you don't like our laws or our politics then, LEAVE! Go back to your own country and tell THEM how unfair we are ... I for one don't care to hear it anymore and WON'T miss you!
 
The more people who can be allowed to take up the hobby, the more people can defend against unreasonable gun laws"

"Be allowed"??? "Hobby"???

You need to stop thinking like a European.

Tim

Tim I think you are right - I do think of target shooting as a hobby - I don't want to strut around in bars with a concealed Glock looking for a reason to be provoked and then to shoot someone. Am I being un-American if I don't want to do that ?

Perhaps that is why I am not making a connection with you guys - I am thinking of the shooting world as fun and an interest when it's more about appearing tough and killing people ?

If that is the case then it looks like I stumbled into the wrong forum and that has to be my fault and the result of being a stranger here.

If it isn't the case, then I would like to stay and make my case, even if nobody agrees with me so far about removing the administrative deadlock with the existing legislation.

Actually I think I did make my case and people don't agree
 
I believe that the 2nd Amendment should pertain ONLY to AMERICAN CITIZENS! Of course, illegal aliens should have absolutely NO rights in this country (zip, zero, nada) and Resident Aliens only limited rights. This IMHO, is a matter of national security and public safety.

I for one, am sick to death of hearing non-citizens gripe and complain about our country because they feel that our laws and politics are not fair to them. Guess what guys, they AREN'T SUPPOSED to be fair to you all! They were designed for US, not you! You come here either as a guest or an invader and then try to CHANGE our laws and policies to benefit YOU and attempt to turn our nation into the very nation you fled from. If you don't like our laws or our politics then, LEAVE! Go back to your own country and tell THEM how unfair we are ... I for one don't care to hear it anymore and WON'T miss you!
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QFE

Perhaps that is why I am not making a connection with you guys - I am thinking of the shooting world as fun and an interest when it's more about appearing tough and killing people ?
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Guns are tools, I don't even like shooting but I recognize the importance of every American owning one of the most important tools of all.
 
Someone who is not even a US citizen should not be telling the US what its gun laws should/shouldn't be.


I am not - I fully support the existing Washington law which allows fully legal foreigners to have a firearm so long as they have an 'alien firearms license' - I just want it to be actioned that's all

I am not an American citizen yet but I am a human and was born with the natural right to speak out - in this country or anywhere

If you disagree with that then it's you who is not a real American - no matter where you were born
 
You weren't born with anything that automatically makes you a US citizen, and until you are one you need to stop complaining about our laws. Move back to Europe, try buying some guns over their before you start on us.
 
With all these rude comments most of you are allienating an honest "about to be" gun owner. He never asked to change the law but to execise his right the law already grants him but ran into administrative problems. He was asking our help to get through that problem and he has been hammered down. No wonder the "American gun culture is fading".

Based on the comments here when Americans visit bars in Europe they should not be allowed to drink if under the age of 21, should not be allowed to have sex with local women if under the age 17 (in most countires 14 and above is legal) should not be allowed to smoke pot in designated places, should not be allowed to be publicly intoxicated and urinate in public because it is all the privilige of local citizens only.

BTW: most Europian contries DO allow firearm ownership. England is the bad apple in the EU but most others like Sweden, Finland, Switzerland has fairly liberal (less liberal compared to the US though) gun licensing. One thing that is quite different: you cannot use greater force for self defense than what has been used by your attecker. Hence killing somebody in self defense is never justified. But doing the same as an officer or a licensed security guard at work can be justified based on the circumstances.
 
"I do think of target shooting as a hobby - I don't want to strut around in bars with a concealed Glock looking for a reason to be provoked and then to shoot someone. Am I being un-American if I don't want to do that ?"

No, but you are being European if that's the way you see it.

Tim
 
With all these rude comments most of you are allienating an honest "about to be" gun owner.
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RUDE is coming into an American Forum and telling us how backwards and unfair our laws are concerning the right to own and bear arms! I for one, am glad to hear that resident aliens are having problems owning firearms here legally!
:);)
 
I for one, am glad to hear that resident aliens are having problems owning firearms here legally!
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You and me in Texas should be more worried about drug runners and illegals having guns. The few who went through the trouble getting legal resident status over the years and try to obtain a firearm legally should have no problem doing it so. He will not end up shooting an HPD officer 7 times from the back of his patrol car you can be sure about that:

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/front/5793341.html

I have several friends from the EU working here some of them are honest gun owners and regularly going to the range together. They are just as much of a threat to national security as an American going over to Europe.

Do the simple math:

You go to a church the first time.

1. The priest welcomes you and very friendly. You are happy and glad to tell everybody inyour neighborhood to visit that chuch. You bring your family and make them become church members.
2. The priest is rude. Comments your appearance or ethnics on a rude way. You never go to this church again. You tell everybody around you not to go there any more.

Same with gun owners:

1. If a "to be" owner is "welcome" he will care to keep his rights. He might join the NRA helping to lobby for gun rights when needed. He tells his family members to vote for pro-gun candidate and encourages his friends to do the same. Once gaining citizenship he'll help us getting more support on votes when needed.
2. An "unwelcome" "to be" owner will get sour. Will encourage his family members to vote for anti-gun candidates, will never join the NRA and will encourage his friends and neighbors to vote for anti-gun candidates.

And frankly; we need all the support we can get in the next presidental cycle.
 
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It's not what he is saying, but how he is saying it. Neither he nor yourself can see that.

This "I'm entitled to everything" attitude isn't going to cut it, I'm afraid.

I've got no problem with legal aliens owning guns. I've got a problem with his attitude, that he deserves it "because he's a citizen of the world bs".

Call me touchy, but Europeans (he's been here 8-10 years and still identifies more with them) have screwed up their centers of influence so much I'd just rather not take the attitude. Of course, I think I'd have the smarts not to go into France or Spain and gloat about the good 'ol USA and how they need to change their laws so I can own a gun without being licensed - as licenses are not the norm here, but are there if you can get them at all.
 
I went though the thread again paying a bit more attention other than the original post. I think you are right some posts have gone a bit agressive on both sides :rolleyes:.

He got exactly what Americans get when criticizing the laws and politics over there (Iraq, global warming, traffic rules, drugs and firearms etc.) :D.

I wish he still joined the NRA though but I think we lost him :(.

I remember walking on a street with my family in Europe once having an Old Navy tshirt on me that happen to have an American flag on it. A guy almost attacked my while yelling about Iraq. He sounded Russian or some other Slavik speaking though.
 
It's not what he is saying, but how he is saying it. Neither he nor yourself can see that.

This "I'm entitled to everything" attitude isn't going to cut it, I'm afraid.

I've got no problem with legal aliens owning guns. I've got a problem with his attitude, that he deserves it "because he's a citizen of the world bs".
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The way he is saying it is offensive but I do not think that ANYONE who is not a full-blown American Citizen should be allowed to purchase or own firearms in this country. Become a full-blown citizen and buy all the guns you want!

Call me touchy, but Europeans (he's been here 8-10 years and still identifies more with them) have screwed up their centers of influence so much I'd just rather not take the attitude. Of course, I think I'd have the smarts not to go into France or Spain and gloat about the good 'ol USA and how they need to change their laws so I can own a gun without being licensed - as licenses are not the norm here, but are there if you can get them at all.
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EXACTLY ... I was thinking the exact same thing!
 
but I do not think that ANYONE who is not a full-blown American Citizen should be allowed to purchase or own firearms in this country
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Just don't tell it to anybody specially not to an anti-gunner. You are dividing the gun owner population that can lead to disarming the whole. They will quickly disarm the non-citizen gun owners and for the next no one will care. Be careful what you wish for :cool:.

Just like the AWB. Most gun owners might not care or affected directly. But if you give them 1 inch they will want the whole 9 yards.

BTW: Interesting opinion from a gun owner in Texas which is considered a pro-gun state.
 
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The Second Amendment doesn't mention anything about citizenship.

The right to keep and bear arms is fundamental to all people everywhere and has nothing to do with beaurocratic titles. All free men everywhere have the god-given right to own and carry arms.
 
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