New Cartridge 357 Ring Of Fire

The change to 9mm--and via testing the Beretta--was political. The US was the only country in NATO with the .45 ACP. All the others were 9mm. So, commonality of pistol ammo.
 
sliclee said:
Sorry to break the news of the 92 Beretta.
The 9 mm gun is not strong enough to pass the original longevity test.
Clinton was the president then and had to, for some reason Im sure you can think of, make that model pass the test and be chosen. Beretta refused to make the gun stronger as it would reduce their profit margin.
That left clinton with one out and somehow got the maker of NATO 9 mm ammo to reduce the strength of the 9mm so the gun would pass the test and they did and it did so it was passed.
Click to expand...

I really didn't expect to find anything in this thread sillier than what the OP has posted, but you somehow managed to out-do him!

The Beretta M9 entered service with the US military in 1985.

Bill Clinton was elected president in 1992. In 1985 he was governor of Arkansas.

I mean come on, a good conspiracy theory is one thing, but the governor of Arkansas controlling the military handgun trials with a time machine is kind of pushing it, isn't it?
 
Sorry to break the news of the 92 Beretta.
The 9 mm gun is not strong enough to pass the original longevity test.
Clinton was the president then and had to, for some reason Im sure you can think of, make that model pass the test and be chosen. Beretta refused to make the gun stronger as it would reduce their profit margin.
That left clinton with one out and somehow got the maker of NATO 9 mm ammo to reduce the strength of the 9mm so the gun would pass the test and they did and it did so it was passed.
Think of what I just said. It was every where, imagine defending yourself with ammo under 1000 fps.
They had the nerve to try it again recently without making it stronger.
Before your mouth and brain say anything LOOK IT UP!
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This is what comes to mind after reading your post

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LQCU36pkH7c

There is so much wrong with this I don't even know where to start. Clinton wasn't even president when the Beretta M9 was put forth into the trials and then adopted. Since you called me out in the title of your post, feel free to PM me and I will school you on the M9/92, because you are clearly ignorant on the matter, and ridiculous comments like yours don't bode well for your credibility. It would be prudent to take your own advice next time before posting which was "Before your mouth and brain say anything LOOK IT UP!"



Not sure where you get your info, but ill leave you with this.

Dont-Believe-Everything-You-Read-on-Internet.jpg
 
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I find the comments complaining about his backstop to be somewhat ridiculous. We dont know if he has a backstop or not, where it is, or if its even needed. My parents have a measly 20 acres. At the end of the 20 acres is over 2000 acres of flood plain. It's neck deep in mud and water and has no option of innocent victims being back there. We can walk to the edge of the flood plain and shoot worry free. Maybe he has a similar setup, or maybe there is a massive hill 50 yards behind that we cannot see.
 
All

Hi guys,
I'd like to thank everyone for their info.
I have posted some comparisons on youtube of the 357 Remington Magnum vs 357 Ring Of Fire with 125 JHP. They are tagged 357 Magnum vs 357 Ring Of Fire.
The intent to develop a rimless cartridge to match the 357 Mag with heavier bullets in short barreled pistols is viable.
This cartridge does not kick as much as the revolver cartridge. Maybe this is just Glock?
Dave
 
13.6 gr of AA7 under a 125 JHP?
AA data from their website shows a max of 12.1gr with pressure at 33,000.
my Lee reloading shows a max of 13.2gr at 42,700.
Looks like you are making hand grenades.
 
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Well, I came into this thread late.

I personally fall into the "any cartridge we need has already been developed and am now waiting for phasers" camp.

But, I gotta love and admire a person with an idea and willingness to pursue it!
 
All

Hi guys,
Mike: The load data I used for the 357 magnum 125 JHP came from Sierra load manual 50th anniversary 4th edition dated 1995, on page 190. The powder was bought in 1995. It shows a maximum of 14.4 grains at 1450 fps. I chose the 13.9 grains at 1400 fps for the charge load and dropped down a little. I figured old load data should be used for old powder which has been properly stored and in good condition.
However I see the prudence of using current load data in future testing and will do so to prevent someone from using older load data with current production powder.
Thanks for bringing this up...good point.

SPAREMAG: LOL! I tentatively agree with you on the phasers!!! Still, I'd like to see the rimless 357 magnum doublestack mag pistol produced before we settle...besides the 327 Ring Of Fire...which may be next.
Dave
 
"the 327 Ring Of Fire...which may be next."
It's called hot-rodded 7.62x30 longue. I would actually be much more interested to see where a cut-down 30carbine round might end up, since you can likely attain velocities needed for good expansion while also significantly decreasing your ammo size. A magnum-version of the 9mm-length CBJ would definitely fit a niche presently left unfilled in the autoloader world (a Glock 20 with 5.7x28 velocities that holds +20 rounds), and would actually make a very suitable PDW cartridge in compact carbines like the MPX.

I've looked into this before, and there's not a whole lot of development to be found, but I have ascertained that there is still a good 20% or so of headroom above the typical pressures for 30 Carbine before the brass starts letting go (a thicker, reinforced case head would take more, but you also start losing capacity in a small case).

TCB
 
There have been a couple of attempts to interest European police in a .32 Super Duper Auto, neither caught on. It is just so easy to give them the same 9mm as their armies.
 
All

Hi guys,
The 357 Ring Of Fire differs from the 9x23 in the caliber and weights of bullets it will fire at magnum velocities.
The 960 Rowland is pretty cool...but it does drop off magnum levels with heavier bullets...along with stablization issues...but still a good concept for smaller framed pistols.
The 327 Ring Of Fire is a pending concept to use the 30 carbine casing. I saw the benefits you have found with this... :)
Dave
 
"The 357 Ring Of Fire differs from the 9x23 in the caliber and weights of bullets it will fire at magnum velocities."

The incredulity comes from the fact that you are claiming your near-identical-size case is providing significantly more performance than the 9x23's already-near-borderline pressure levels. And in guns that already have a hard time containing 9x23's recoil power output without damaging themselves. We're not saying we don't believe you (though I think you should have your chrono tested and should get some softer primers for testing up loads), we're saying it is pretty much impossible you are doing this safely (in a way that won't damage/destroy a firearm, possibly in an uncontrolled manner)

"There have been a couple of attempts to interest European police in a .32 Super Duper Auto, neither caught on. It is just so easy to give them the same 9mm as their armies."
I agree, and think it's more compelling in a PDW. A 10% or whatever increase in capacity for a handgun is a near-neglible one round of 18 or so. A 10% increase in a 40 or 50 round helical or coffin mag is more significant. Also the fact that the power levels of a magnum pressure handgun round are kind of wasted in hi cap guns due to shooter fatigue and strength issues, but are considerably tamed in something with a stock to brace and possibly a muzzle that is further away and silenced. If this 357 ROF is truly holding together well at the levels posted, it would similarly benefit from a stocked firearm with a more robust gas-operated breech locking system.

TCB
 
All

Hi guys,
Barn: Your concerns are well founded. This is why I cannot give intimate details on this at this time. I do not want to risk someone getting injured or worse, trying to mimic my tests. There are safety procedures conducted off screen before I record.
I see Mr. Rowland has figured out a few things about increasing performance, some things I have considered already...and seem to be necessary for further development. I'll keep y'all posted.
Thanks Guys!
Dave
 
The 357 Ring Of Fire differs from the 9x23 in the caliber and weights of bullets it will fire at magnum velocities.
Click to expand...
So like has been said before the 357 ROF is basically a 9X23 loaded to unsafe pressure levels.
 
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