Illegal Aliens: Solutions

First, I don't see what all the uproar is about. This is as simple an answer as the answer to gun control is. Why make more laws when you can't enforce the ones you have?

The issue here is one of enforcement. That's step one. Any additional legislation is useless untill step one is accomplished and you can prove to yourself you have the ability to enforce the laws you already have. This is purely a budgeting issue for manpower and resources, and the plan to do such lies solely in the Executive Branch. The only thing Congress needs to consider is how much it will cost.

Stop complicating the issue by talking about waivers or work permits or anything else not pertinant to enforcement. We already have facilities in the law to take care of such things. If you can't enforce what you already have, what makes you think you can enforce some NEW laws? When, and if, we get to the point we can successfully control out borders, IF there appears to be a need to adjust our immigration laws then consider it.
 
Quote:
I've been reading everyones posts on this and other threads on this subject. We say we ought to do this and we ought to do that, but nothing really changes.

Yeah, gripin' never got my ancestors anywhere.;)
 
How many here know the Mexican solution?

From what I have read at the Minuteman Civil Defense Corps website:

A significant number of female illegals that enter the southern Mexican border are raped and/or murdered by crooked cops and military. Bribes are also inplace for those not killed.. so they can continue moving north.

The Mexican Constitution specifically addresses the issue with classification of felony and 2 years in prison. No judge, your presence speaks for itself ... felony and jail.

Isn't it Fox and the rest of his corrupt administration that is loudly yelling about the growing US citizen demand for a felony charge and prison time. I guess what is good for them is not good for us.

Also, non citizen gatherings against the government is banned and those that engage are subject to arrest and prison.

IMHO, we must first secure the borders AND ports. At the same time, remove the ability to birth in US for citizenship.

After those are inplace we can begin to address the illegals currently here.

I just returned from the Mexican/Arizona Border, after 10 days on the line with the Minuteman Civil Defense Corps. That word "amnesty" has broken the dam and we are being flooded .. AKA invaded. We were constantly harrassed by the ACLU during both day and night Ops.

Semper Fi!

Kel Tec P-11 9mm
Taurus PT92B17 9mm
Taurus 65B4 357
Ruger 10/22 - quantity 2
Ruger Mini 14
Makarov .380
 
O.K. Short and simple. How do you get a non responsive government to listen and enforce the laws that are already on the books and in our Constitution?
 
Abndoc,

IN CONGRESS, JULY 4, 1776
The unanimous Declaration of the thirteen united States of America

When in the Course of human events it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. ? That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, ? That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security. ? Such has been the patient sufferance of these Colonies; and such is now the necessity which constrains them to alter their former Systems of Government. The history of the present King of Great Britain is a history of repeated injuries and usurpations, all having in direct object the establishment of an absolute Tyranny over these States. To prove this, let Facts be submitted to a candid world.

He has refuted his Assent to Laws, the most wholesome and necessary for the public good.

He has forbidden his Governors to pass Laws of immediate and pressing importance, unless suspended in their operation till his Assent should be obtained; and when so suspended, he has utterly neglected to attend to them.

He has refused to pass other Laws for the accommodation of large districts of people, unless those people would relinquish the right of Representation in the Legislature, a right inestimable to them and formidable to tyrants only.

He has called together legislative bodies at places unusual, uncomfortable, and distant from the depository of their Public Records, for the sole purpose of fatiguing them into compliance with his measures.

He has dissolved Representative Houses repeatedly, for opposing with manly firmness his invasions on the rights of the people.

He has refused for a long time, after such dissolutions, to cause others to be elected, whereby the Legislative Powers, incapable of Annihilation, have returned to the People at large for their exercise; the State remaining in the mean time exposed to all the dangers of invasion from without, and convulsions within.

He has endeavoured to prevent the population of these States; for that purpose obstructing the Laws for Naturalization of Foreigners; refusing to pass others to encourage their migrations hither, and raising the conditions of new Appropriations of Lands.

He has obstructed the Administration of Justice by refusing his Assent to Laws for establishing Judiciary Powers.

He has made Judges dependent on his Will alone for the tenure of their offices, and the amount and payment of their salaries.

He has erected a multitude of New Offices, and sent hither swarms of Officers to harass our people and eat out their substance.

He has kept among us, in times of peace, Standing Armies without the Consent of our legislatures.

He has affected to render the Military independent of and superior to the Civil Power.

He has combined with others to subject us to a jurisdiction foreign to our constitution, and unacknowledged by our laws; giving his Assent to their Acts of pretended Legislation:

For quartering large bodies of armed troops among us:

For protecting them, by a mock Trial from punishment for any Murders which they should commit on the Inhabitants of these States:

For cutting off our Trade with all parts of the world:

For imposing Taxes on us without our Consent:

For depriving us in many cases, of the benefit of Trial by Jury:

For transporting us beyond Seas to be tried for pretended offences:

For abolishing the free System of English Laws in a neighbouring Province, establishing therein an Arbitrary government, and enlarging its Boundaries so as to render it at once an example and fit instrument for introducing the same absolute rule into these Colonies

For taking away our Charters, abolishing our most valuable Laws and altering fundamentally the Forms of our Governments:

For suspending our own Legislatures, and declaring themselves invested with power to legislate for us in all cases whatsoever.

He has abdicated Government here, by declaring us out of his Protection and waging War against us.

He has plundered our seas, ravaged our coasts, burnt our towns, and destroyed the lives of our people.

He is at this time transporting large Armies of foreign Mercenaries to compleat the works of death, desolation, and tyranny, already begun with circumstances of Cruelty & Perfidy scarcely paralleled in the most barbarous ages, and totally unworthy the Head of a civilized nation.

He has constrained our fellow Citizens taken Captive on the high Seas to bear Arms against their Country, to become the executioners of their friends and Brethren, or to fall themselves by their Hands.

He has excited domestic insurrections amongst us, and has endeavoured to bring on the inhabitants of our frontiers, the merciless Indian Savages whose known rule of warfare, is an undistinguished destruction of all ages, sexes and conditions.

In every stage of these Oppressions We have Petitioned for Redress in the most humble terms: Our repeated Petitions have been answered only by repeated injury. A Prince, whose character is thus marked by every act which may define a Tyrant, is unfit to be the ruler of a free people.

Nor have We been wanting in attentions to our British brethren. We have warned them from time to time of attempts by their legislature to extend an unwarrantable jurisdiction over us. We have reminded them of the circumstances of our emigration and settlement here. We have appealed to their native justice and magnanimity, and we have conjured them by the ties of our common kindred. to disavow these usurpations, which would inevitably interrupt our connections and correspondence. They too have been deaf to the voice of justice and of consanguinity. We must, therefore, acquiesce in the necessity, which denounces our Separation, and hold them, as we hold the rest of mankind, Enemies in War, in Peace Friends.

We, therefore, the Representatives of the United States of America, in General Congress, Assembled, appealing to the Supreme Judge of the world for the rectitude of our intentions, do, in the Name, and by Authority of the good People of these Colonies, solemnly publish and declare, That these United Colonies are, and of Right ought to be Free and Independent States, that they are Absolved from all Allegiance to the British Crown, and that all political connection between them and the State of Great Britain, is and ought to be totally dissolved; and that as Free and Independent States, they have full Power to levy War, conclude Peace contract Alliances, establish Commerce, and to do all other Acts and Things which Independent States may of right do. ? And for the support of this Declaration, with a firm reliance on the protection of Divine Providence, we mutually pledge to each other our Lives, our Fortunes and our sacred Honor.

? John Hancock

New Hampshire:
Josiah Bartlett, William Whipple, Matthew Thornton

Massachusetts:
John Hancock, Samuel Adams, John Adams, Robert Treat Paine, Elbridge Gerry

Rhode Island:
Stephen Hopkins, William Ellery

Connecticut:
Roger Sherman, Samuel Huntington, William Williams, Oliver Wolcott

New York:
William Floyd, Philip Livingston, Francis Lewis, Lewis Morris

New Jersey:
Richard Stockton, John Witherspoon, Francis Hopkinson, John Hart, Abraham Clark

Pennsylvania:
Robert Morris, Benjamin Rush, Benjamin Franklin, John Morton, George Clymer, James Smith, George Taylor, James Wilson, George Ross

Delaware:
Caesar Rodney, George Read, Thomas McKean

Maryland:
Samuel Chase, William Paca, Thomas Stone, Charles Carroll of Carrollton

Virginia:
George Wythe, Richard Henry Lee, Thomas Jefferson, Benjamin Harrison, Thomas Nelson, Jr., Francis Lightfoot Lee, Carter Braxton

North Carolina:
William Hooper, Joseph Hewes, John Penn

South Carolina:
Edward Rutledge, Thomas Heyward, Jr., Thomas Lynch, Jr., Arthur Middleton

Georgia:
Button Gwinnett, Lyman Hall, George Walton
Click to expand...
Hate to say it, but it looks like this may be the only option. These abuses can all be listed (with varying little details) but essentially the government violates these things in one way or another relating to illegal immigrant invasion and other issues.
The short answer is, start on the local level. Start on the county and state level. Ignore those goons inside Washington. They do more harm than good. Secession of states with likeminded people and principles united maybe the only political option.
 
1. Illegal immigration should be made a felony.

Not because they will be imprisoned for a longer time. Because they won't, because there's not enough prison space.
Click to expand...
Hey, here's an idea: How about internment camps for convicted illegal aliens? 1st offense = 1 year, 2nd = 2 yrs., 3rd = 4 yrs, 4th = 8 yrs., etc.

If "The Government" can scheme to build internment camps for We The People as some claim they have - why not put actual criminals in them - what a concept!:D
 
Ah, the eloquent words of our founding fathers. It's good to be reminded of them and to re-read them.

Here are some of the things I've resolved to do.

Repeated letters to the editor. This may cut into my forum time, but it's worth it. They may not print them, as our paper is a leftist rag, but maybe some editor will feel it's time for a little fair and balanced reporting.

Letters to Boxer and Feinstein, my Senators. They've never listened before, but with an election coming up, maybe they will pander and take one for the team.

A donation to the Minutemen. Personal reasons prevent me from going down there, so at least I can do this.

Vote my beliefs. Stay informed as to who believes what, vote accordingly.

If anyone else has any suggestions, short of armed insurrection, let me know.
 
Chain Gang For Those Caught

REMEBER THE GOOD OLE DAYS? For every illegal caught, force them to be on a chain gang rebuilding the roads, cleaning right of ways etc for a set amoutn of time for each offense then ship em back to where they came. Also I think that the citizenship laws should be redone (hey my wife is German and I am not biased against immigrants and their wanting to become citizens). I don't think that just because some immigrant (illegal or legal) who flops out a kid in the USA automatically has the right to have the kid become a citizen and the mother has the right ot stay with the kid until 18. If one of the parents (verified by DNA testing of father to prove he is the real father, this is a problem in gremany with the turk females getting a homeless german guy to say he is the father ) is in fact a legal citizen then the kid is an american citizen, if not then it should still be an illegal or legal immigrant.Start out at local levels and petition for the politicians who favor your/our views, and VOTE and encourage everyone you know to VOTE.

I like what the Israelis are doing with that wall idea, think we should do the same (combine with sensors to tell when they try to dig). Cheaper solution over the long run to stop the furture illegals), heck the one that are caught can help build it while on the chain gang. just my 2 cents.

Also, it is not that hard to become a citizen/get a green card as everyone says. I went through this ordeal with my wife (she is german and was my fiance when we started the process). As long as you go through all the steps in the right order (yes it takes a while and costs about 1000 including medical exams) it takes about 3-6 months to get a green card and after you meet the requirements for citizenship it takes even less time. Those that say it is impossibe are just lazy and/or can't follow simple directions (they are even numbered and come in many different languages).
 
Dobbs to President: Do you take us for fools?

I think he does - but we're getting smart fast.

Dobbs to President: Do you take us for fools?
By Lou Dobbs
CNN

Wednesday, May 10, 2006; Posted: 3:44 p.m. EDT (19:44 GMT)


U.S. flag flies near U.S.-Mexico border in Andrade, California.NEW YORK (CNN)-- Reports this week that the Border Patrol is notifying the Mexican government of the locations of Minutemen volunteers are being denied by U.S. Customs and Border Protection. True or not, the Bush administration continues to follow absurd policies on both issues of border security and illegal immigration.

President Bush continues to push his guest worker program and amnesty for anywhere between 11 million and 20 million illegal aliens, and he insists still that nothing less than what he calls comprehensive immigration reform is acceptable.

And the lies keep coming from both political parties. This president is not enforcing the immigration laws enacted by Congress, and this Congress is failing in its duty of oversight to demand that those laws be followed.

Only a fool, Mr. President, Sen. Kennedy, Sen. McCain, would believe you when you speak of new legislation. You don't enforce the laws now.

Would you do so if the law were more to your liking? Would you secure our borders and ports? Would you halt illegal immigration? Those are rhetorical questions, only, I assure you. The answers are obvious; obvious because of your conduct.

As many as 3 million illegal aliens continue to cross our border with Mexico each year. Enforcement against illegal employers of illegal aliens in this country is all but nonexistent, Mr. President. How do you explain that the Immigration and Customs Enforcement agents have all but ended their investigations and inspections of employers that hire illegal aliens? Again, only a rhetorical question, because we all know the answer.

But here is the official record of your sense of duty: 318 employers out of five and a half million in this country have been fined for hiring illegal aliens since 2001. In 2004, only three employers were fined. That is a dismal record, Mr. President, as dismal as the fact that the number of ICE agents assigned to enforce immigration laws in the workplace has declined from only 240 back in 1999 to now less than 100.

Illegal alien employer fines
2001 100
2002 53
2003 162
2004 3
(Source: GAO reports,8/31/05)
The problem in our lack of border security and illegal immigration is becoming increasingly obvious: two political parties that are beholden to corporate America, the largest employers of illegal aliens, and the leadership of both parties that are selling out American citizens in search of cheap labor and political advantage. How dumb do you all think we are? Again, that's only a rhetorical question.

Over the next few days on my broadcast, I'm going to make a suggestion that I hope may help the leadership of both the Republican and Democratic parties begin to take some notice of our laws and our expectations that those laws be enforced. And also take at least some notice of the fact that Republicans and Democrats also represent American citizens, not just corporate America and special interests.
 
I think the wall idea hurts our cause. It sounds ridiculous to most people, probably because it is! If we were really serious we would get the NSA on it, dropping miniature microphones linked to a super computer to tell when and where people are crossing the border. We would have Schweizer RU-38's patrolling day and night, with mounted (on horseback) tracker teams on call 24/7. The planes cannot be heard from the ground if they are a few thousand feet up, from there they can just turn on FLIR or night vision and track the illegals, designating them with an IR beam so the tracker team could pick it up... Horses are fast and fairly silent, and offer an excellent POV. When the border crossers are caught a vehicle or transport helicopter would come and pick them up.

Of course thats if we actually wanted to stop illegal immigration, which we (Jorge Shrub) don't.
 
Gentlemen
We are looking at this the wrong way! The ideas I have been reading about haven?t worked yet so let?s do something really different. The border is very long to be able to put up a wall and the Mexican gov is not going to help us.

Bring our troops home from Iraq in the next couple of years and they will have the training for the next mission. INVADE MEXICO and put the border at Guatemala. The Mexican government has done the first part for us ? they have disarmed the public and only the police and military have guns. The 2nd part can be easy too, we Bribe the army and police just like everyone else does, and they will not oppose our invasion!!

This will make the length of border much shorter. Mexico will be a part of USA just like Puerto Rico. In PR they have lots of American stores but all the menu?s and directions are in Spanish.

We can then make the laws, reform their system and do nation building just like Iraq. It will be easier than Iraq because there are fewer Iraqie?s (Moslems of various denominations) and the people actually like us- or at least our money.

The hard part will be deciding on what to do with Mexico once we own it.
 
Try going to Mexico ans asking for free money (Welfare) and free health care. Tell them you want your kids to go to school there but only to a bilingual teacher because you don't want to learn Spanish. See how that works for you.....why do we as Americans have to put up with that garbage when no other country in the world would do that for us?

My suggestion is stop spending hundreds of millions on welfare, healthcare, and everything else on illegal aliens and spens the money instead on a really high fence, alot of razor wire, more border patrol...and give them orders to shoot anyone who crosses the fence.

My parents immigrated here from Italy back in the 30's but nobody gave them anything once they got here. They either worked their butts off or they starved. Once here (thru Ellis Island) they were quarantined for months before being allowed into the country. There was no sneaking over the fence then...wasn't allowed, and shouldn't be now. I'm not picking on just the Mexicans either...If we get Cuban or Chinese boat people...tow their rickety floats back out to international water and point them somewhere else.
America IS being invaded...most people just don't see it.
 
I rather have a big wall than a fence. Armed Border Patrol Agents walking the 18' wall with orders to shoot to kill any infiltration of our border. How do we know they do not intend us harm? They are already criminals.

I think it was said best early in this thread "enforce the law".

Or do we pick and choose who to enforce the law upon? When Ireland had the Great Potato Blight in the late 1800's did many Irish come to America because they were starving? Yes. Did they get processed through Ellis island in accordance with the law? Yes. Heck my familys name is actually "Belyus" not "Bellus". But, the people working at Ellis island the day my great granfather showed up decided that our family is now called "Bellus". Last I checked he did not piss and moan, he went to work. And beings how he was processed in a way in accordance with the law he was legal. MY GOD. SOME IMMIGRANTS TO THIS COUNTRY ACTUALLY FOLLOWED THE LAW? WHAT A CONCEPT.

Build the wall! My prayers out to you minutemen trying to fight the good fight, only to see your efforts minimized by crooked politicians and a tyrannical government.

80% of Americans feel that illegal immigrants should not be given special treatment and should be treated like criminals. The U.S. Government is not acting in a way consistent with the demands of its people. Who is the master and who is the servant? Because right now the U.S. Government is thumbing their nose at you the U.S. citizen. "of the people, by the people, FOR the people"

Gosh. No where in there did I read

"Well we are the Government and we know what is best for you little servants and pesants. Just sit there and shut-up. We'll let you know what is the best course of action to take."

WOW! 80% of the citizens that the Gov should serve disagree with the way this is being handled. I think Michale Savage called it "Government Anarchy". Pretty accurate depiction in my view.

BUILD THE WALL!
 
The Wall

Lets see, an 18 foot tall wall across the southern border of the U.S. Man it every 100 yards with guard post manned by troops with shoot to kill orders. Make sure they have the latest night vision equipment,

How about command detonated mines? We wouldn't want false alarms from coyotes and jackrabbits.

Don't forget the razor wire and attack dogs.

This system worked really well in Berlin for a long time.


Please, there are other ways. Don't let your emotion and anger get ahead of your reason.
 
To those deriding a fence,

Do you have a fence for your backyard? Assuming you do, why? Do you expect it to really keep a person out if they want to get in?
 
Stop trying to fool others..Abndoc..you just want open borders...be honest with yourself and others..you'll feel better about it... remember all, its best to win your argument with truth...I want a fence and security..thats the truth of my argument..(spoken without emotion):p
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top