Durability&Longevity of aluminum alloy frame pistols (Taurus PT 92/Beretta 92)

So you are saying between the lines the Beretta 92 design is somewhat superior to the SIG design?
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The SIG design IMO seems better as it almost never needs to be replaced. A very beefy design though I believe SIG recommends changing the take down lever at 20,000 rounds which secures the locking insert to the frame.
 
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LOL.

I don't own a Beretta 92FS/M9 yet but probably will some day. The P226 and 92FS/M9 are both outstanding and very proven combat pistols.
 
That is what I figured as well. Wenn the US army Chose the Beretta 92 that must be a good one for me as well.
Specially I Chose the aluminum pistol because the Frame does not rust.

Sad to read about the aluminum Frame issue after the purchase.
I still do not know if the slide of the Taurus PT 92 is real stainless or if the Barrel is.
Every time I Chat with an Taurus representative I get contradictory answers. Seems the customer agents tell ya what you want to hear after checking every time their own Homepage for answers (Kind of Southamerican style customer Service: "just buy the crap and piss off. Don't worry; if it breaks buy a new one and get lost again").

Any more first Hand experiences with aluminum Frames wear off were the slide is riding?
 
Honda reviews should like 365 five star ratings and half a dozen one star ratings from people who claimed to have various problems. I ignored the one star ratings, yet I am sure there are those that would only dwell on the 6 negative reviews.
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I don't ignore the one star ratings personally. While every company can and does make a lemon, I've owned both pistols and cars that had somewhat systemic issues for certain models. Now some people take what are relatively easy to fix issues and blow them out of proportion and give a 1 star rating, so like you are suggesting the average rating is reported for a reason.

What I look for are similar complaints across all negative reviews and what percentage of reviews are made up of those complaints (again going back to the importance of the average). Given the sheer number of classic P series out in the wild and the number of actually verified frame cracking claims, I'll wager it's not a major concern.


I am always somewhat amused at these, "But my gun won't last!", threads. The OP himself has intimated that he will likely have passed away before he even reaches that round count, given his round counts in the past.

He also mentioned 1000 rds of 9mm costing $800 US in his country in another thread. So even taking the lower frame life estimate of 35,000 (and we know it can go longer if maintenance is done):

35*($800) (number of thousands of rounds for the life of the pistol times the cost per thousand) = $28,000 US

That's quite the expenditure of ammo before the pistol needs to be replaced. At that point the price of the firearm would be dwarfed by the amount spent on the ammo. Some perspective helps, and this is true for anyone.
 
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So those forums and online magazine articles are fearmongering?
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Um. What? You deal in all, or nothing.

What you get on forums are opinions. Sometimes good ones. I advise you not to believe everything you read on them. What you get on online magazines...my advice is to ask yourself: is this online magazine article intended to be unbiased? Don't assume the information you get from them is to be taken as sold unbiased fact just because a blogger or online author wrote it.

Specially metallurgy ingeneers detest aluminum frames in guns. Most say manufacturers speculate the gun owner will never shoot past 30000 rounds in the aluminum gun thus allowing the manufacturer to use an aluminum frame instead of steel or steel inserted rails in polymer frames.
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This above statement is very vague. 'Engineers in metallurgy' do what and say what? In what context? Within what parameters? In regard to which firearm designs and specially why? 'Most say manufacturers speculate'. Who is this "most"? And how do you begin to compare steel embedded in polymer at this point?

In my opinion, your goal is to just use any source, however flimsy or undefined, to create argument.
 
Yesterday I read a lot about the aluminum Frame pistols.
I assume they are not lying on the Internet; why would they?

In the US it is indeed not necessary to worry about Frame wear or breakage of the weapon.

In the USA you can send the guns in for reapairs.
In the USA you can get a new gun if the one you bought has flaws.
In the USA you have warranty.

HERE NOT!

You can't send any gun in for repairs unless to a dubious gun Smith who you know has nor the materials nor the instruments nor the knowledge to repair a specific gun.
Here you know the gun Smith will most likely weld the Frame with an ordinary welder and have no Expertise whatsoever.

Here, if the gun breaks you are screwed.

For example: People think I am crazy if I buy spare springs for the Glock I had. Why would you do that! Spare locking lugs? No Chance to get nor do People even know about it.
 
The simple fact is that aluminum fatigues. The aluminum frames have a minimum life expectancy but they don't all last that long. I have seen 4 air-weight revolvers cracked at the barrel/frame junction on the bottom where the crane hides the crack. Three were the S&W and one was a Ruger.

There are no aluminum alloys, at this time, that do not fatigue. There are steels that don't fatigue with stress below a certain level. Aluminum begins to fatigue at any stress level so there is no way to build an aluminum part that won't fail. I have also seen the base on a Dillon press fail from fatigue. That is the nature of the metal. Building guns out of it is slightly better than building guns on a 3-D printer.

If you want a disposable gun then buy an aluminum framed gun. If you want a gun that will last, as long as you don't overload it then buy steel.
 
That is what I mean:

So the US Military adopted the weak Beretta 92 and aluminum AR 15 (M16).
Why?

So the Beretta 92/Taurus PT 92 is a weak prone to fail Piece of junk?
 
The military has often used disposable firearms. When you have the budget that the military has it doesn't matter because guns are replaced - just like soldiers.

Why do drag racers use aluminum drive lines? They're lighter and disposable.
 
Since it is true aluminum is a soft metal (ShootistPRS has a valid Point and it is reasonable what he says, IMHO)...

...that is why I wanted to know first Hand experiences with aluminum framed pistols specially the Taurus PT 92 AFS/Beretta 92.
 
Do you own the gun already? If yes, isn't this whole discussion a moot point? The only way to know how many rounds before failure on any specific gun is to shoot it until failure.

I'd assume Beretta knows what they're doing and not worry about it.
 
I wanted to know first Hand experiences with aluminum framed pistols specially the Taurus PT 92 AFS/Beretta 92.
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I have a 92FS that I bought in November 2011 and is shot regularly, with a current round count of around 3K rounds. It shows finish wear on the rails. Everything else on it is fine. Fine pistol, shoots great, looks great, no problems, certainly no concerns about frame failure.

You say you want first hand experiences: How many of the people who have told you that aluminum frames are junk have shot one to failure? At what round count did the failures occur?
 
I am sure SIG, Beretta, CZ, etc took frame material into consideration vs frame life when engineering the design of an aluminum alloy frame. I don't know about the others but SIG has a lifetime warranty for original owner. Again reputable sources have stated that they have know of plenty of SIGs such as aluminum alloy frame P226s and P228s with well over 100,000 rounds fired through them and I don't think it could be much different for Beretta. There is a forum member on The Pistol Forum - LSP... who had first hand knowledge as did Todd Green. A lot of very high volume shooters on that forum too.

I remember when Japanese cars like Honda and Toyota started showing up with aluminum block engines and all the talk about how they could not last 100,000 miles. Well today many many examples of such with in excess of 300,000 miles and still going strong without any engine work. How could that be possible with aluminum??
 
Durability&Longevity of aluminum alloy frame pistols (Taurus PT 92/Beretta 92)

There are M16s and Beretta 92s that have been in service for a long time and are still going despite a lifetime of neglect compared to how a private owner will treat them. You're acting like it's going to fall apart the first day you shoot it. It won't. And for the third time, given the rate you can shoot in your country the pistol could likely outlast you.


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We have here a waiting time after buying to check Police Report and get the Registration Card for gun-owner of about 1 month. So I do not have at Hand yet the gun.

I have an 92FS ... with a current round count of around 3K rounds. It shows finish wear on the rails
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So basically at 3000 rounds the steel slide eats itself through the aluminum Frame of the tried&trusted US Military adopted Beretta 92 gun.

Those are indeed not good News.
I would rather want the slide to glide upon steel inserts since that wears less. Or being able to buy a spare alu Frame like in the FCU modular guns of which I am a big fan.

But considered the expensive guns here (Taurus PT92 costs you here way more than 1300 $ and an Beretta 92 costs you way upward 2000 $) I guess I will live with what I bought.
I realised I am a bit of an perfectionist.

There is allways the Option of the Taurus PT 1911 but on my PT 1911 vs PT 92 thread People suggested the PT 92 was the better gun. At that time I just considered the positive side of the not rusting aluminum Frame and did not think of it wears down from the slide movement.
Supposedly the PT 1911 has a real stainless steel Frame. Slide and Barrel I am not sure.

So peace Beretta 92/PT 92 design. But most certainly I will hate it if I see aluminum pieces chipping and getting into the Action.

Can someone post a Picture of the wear on the rails of an Beretta 92/Taurus PT 92 please!
 
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Durability&Longevity of aluminum alloy frame pistols (Taurus PT 92/Beretta 92)

TheGuyOfSouthamerica said:
So basically at 3000 rounds the steel slide eats itself through the aluminum Frame of the tried&trusted US Military adopted Beretta 92 gun.



So peace Beretta 92/PT 92 design. But most certainly I will hate it if I see aluminum pieces chipping and getting into the Action.
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Wow. Just, wow.



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