Do we need Hi-Capacity in everyday Carry?

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That's an easy answer, my wife does the banking! She would just take one of those nice easy chairs. As always I would just back into a spot. Get the story, after our Orange County Deputys had been and gone.

Maybe that is what you would do in Boulder? Orlando, not so much. Not sure where the capacity we all carry fits in here. As we are in Folsom for a month, minus any firearms and banking via her laptop. As the Aussies would say. No Worries.
 
USNRet93 said:
How about...walk into a bank..see guy at counter with gun out, pointing at teller..you walk up, not saying a word, and put a round behind his ear, killing him...??

Execution?
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No.

He is displaying a firearm. He is committing a felony, and he is an active threat.
 
How about...walk into a bank..see guy at counter with gun out, pointing at teller..you walk up, not saying a word, and put a round behind his ear, killing him...??

Execution?
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Perhaps, but it's legally justified and not murder. I'd say it was good tactics. ("Execution" is not a legal term)
 
Ah Ha! Well said. Aquila Blanca. That teller will be covered in blood and brains! UG!
Not so easy to wash off, inside her head. Glad this is just an exercise.
 
How about...walk into a bank..see guy at counter with gun out, pointing at teller..you walk up, not saying a word, and put a round behind his ear, killing him...??
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I suppose, given the original topic of the conversation, that would indicate we would not need high capacity magazines at least not in that scenario.

Of course some would argue even that scenario requires 17+1 rounds and four extra magazines just in case.

:)
 
I'm unable to share the surveillance footage I have on my phone.

Right here in Miami Florida a few months ago. A man was walking to his car at around 8:30/9:00pm and a car pulled up. Out of it, 2 guys came out from the back doors. One had a 33rd stick mag in a Glock and another had the 50rd drum in his Glock. They both pointed guns at him, he got down, they put a knee in his back and robbed him of all his belongings.

If that went south in the many times that it has, I wouldn't feel comfortable with a 5 shot snub nose as my only defensive pistol.

Remove the best case scenario from your reasoning of wanting to carry. Not trying to make anyone feel bad, but we do for worst case scenario. Not best. I can't for the life of myself understand why someone would knowingly choose to look at the best case scenario on what could be the worst day of their lives.

As Masaad Ayoob said: "The criminal is the actor. He gets the first move. He doesn’t need to carry a gun until he decides he’s going to use it. The good guy or gal is the reactor: we don’t know when we’ll need it, which is why it behooves us to carry a defensive firearm wherever it is legal to do so."

So they can run up on you with stick mags a piece. Why not prepare for that as best as we can if we're going to be reactive?
 
If that went south in the many times that it has, I wouldn't feel comfortable with a 5 shot snub nose as my only defensive pistol.
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What exactly would make you feel comfortable in the scenario you describe? Because there is no way that is going to be comfortable
 
I would suggest, if you are comfortable in that situation, you might need to consider why. There are only a handful of explanations as to why someone would feel comfortable having multiple firearms pointed at him or her while someone was forcing them onto the ground outside of serious mental concerns.

To be clear: I am suggesting you would not be comfortable regardless of training and equipment. It would be a tremendously uncomfortable moment.
 
Lohman446 said:
I would suggest, if you are comfortable in that situation, you might need to consider why. There are only a handful of explanations as to why someone would feel comfortable having multiple firearms pointed at him or her while someone was forcing them onto the ground outside of serious mental concerns.



To be clear: I am suggesting you would not be comfortable regardless of training and equipment. It would be a tremendously uncomfortable moment.
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Comfort isn't binary. There are levels of comfort.

Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk
 
To be clear: I am suggesting you would not be comfortable regardless of training and equipment. It would be a tremendously uncomfortable moment.
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Please keep all projections to yourself.

Stick to what you know and feel. Not what you assume and "know" someone else's capabilities are or aren't. :) K? Thanks.
 
I don't see any projections in his comment tbh. A person that describes himself as "comfortable" in the situation you just described is, IMO, kidding himself or foolhardy.

I think the distinguishing point here is that differences in capabilities are what they are. Yes you can always come up with a practically speaking insurmountable situation. But when comparing a 5 shot revolver to a 15 round semiautomatic I don't think we need to go to those extremes. It doesn't have to be guys loaded down with "extendos". Heck just two people in total with "standard capacity" is fair enough. Is 5 shots enough capacity to get enough hits on both to stop their aggression while allowing for a miss or two? That's someone's call. A pair of criminals isn't a particularly unlikely scenario in my mind.

At the end of the day we make decisions. Most of those are compromises at some level. This thread seems to be an ongoing attempt by two sides to convince the other that one is "right". At some point you make a decision, understand the reasoning behind and the downsides of that decisions, and move on. This horse is almost unrecognizable. But hey, it is a discussion forum so the beat can go on.

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Comfort isn't binary. There are levels of comfort.
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Fact. Your brain learns to adjust and think clearly in some scenarios. Especially ones you've either been in or trained for. No one is saying it's a breeze, but thinking CAN and DOES happen. It isn't all reactive bed wetting like some project or assume it will be.

I like speaking to other trained individuals on topics such as this. There is a more steel sharpens other steels feeling.


A person that describes himself as comfortable in the situation you just described is, IMO, kidding himself or foolhardy.
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I didn't say it'd be comforting at all.

I'd be less comfortable with a sub-par low capacity weapon.


Let's not dive into contrarianism and fixate on ONE word to attempt to discredit the rest of the post.

Can we try to discuss my point in it's entirety?
 
If that went south in the many times that it has, I wouldn't feel comfortable with a 5 shot snub nose as my only defensive pistol.
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I didn't say it'd be comforting at all.

I'd be less comfortable with a sub-par low capacity weapon.
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Your second statement is likely a fair statement. Your first statement left a lot of room for interpretation and could be easily taken as there were scenarios in which you would be comfortable in the situation. I was hoping for clarification.

Its not comfortable with a revolver (I assume). It is also not comfortable with an UZI (I assume).
 
Right. It just so happens the intent of some is only to discredit and not discuss.

Read my edit...

You're so over dramatic! lol, Uzi. 5-shot snub compared to a Glock 19, maybe?
 
Can we try to discuss my point in it's entirety?
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Right here in Miami Florida a few months ago. A man was walking to his car at around 8:30/9:00pm and a car pulled up. Out of it, 2 guys came out from the back doors. One had a 33rd stick mag in a Glock and another had the 50rd drum in his Glock. They both pointed guns at him, he got down, they put a knee in his back and robbed him of all his belongings.
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We are discussing an attack by multiple assailants who are well armed and, likely, competent and determined. There are at least three - the two gunman and the driver of the car.

Chances are, if this situation goes south, I am not walking away uninjured from it. It is very likely I am killed. Your attempting reaction against action and hoping to draw and neutralize multiple targets, one behind cover, before they can successfully react.

Chances are, regardless of what concealed firearm I attempt this with, I have taken more than one shot from competent and determined attackers before I have fired the fifth round.

As you note others may (rightfully or wrongfully) evaluate their skill differently than I do. That's fair and why when I answer the question I note I can only speak for me.
 
Well, that's because we know the outcome. In the scenario itself, we don't.

That'd all have to be gauged while in it. (Unfortunately)

My point is if you have to go live and fight, would you be better off with a higher capacity weapon like a Glock 19 at 15+1 or a 5-shot revolver?

Yes or no. Better off with which one? In that scenario. G19 or Snub nose.

I await your response.
 
My point is if you have to go live and fight, would you be better off with a higher capacity weapon like a Glock 19 at 15+1 or a 5-shot revolver?

Yes or no. Better off with which one? In that scenario. G19 or Snub nose.
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We posted too close to the same time. Assuming three competent and determined attackers, two of whom already have guns drawn at close range, it is unlikely I manage to pull the fifth shot before I am incapacitated. So I leave some rounds in a J frame or some rounds in my G19. I am marginally quicker on the first shot (tenths of a second so very marginal) with a J-frame than a G19 from concealment though I carry them differently

I'm dead with either. The advantages of one or the other does not change it. My best chance is my attackers are undetermined or incompetent.
 
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