Click It or Ticket Mobilization

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Frank, why do you have different standards for police and doctors?

You have stated clearly that police should not be obligated to ignore certain laws.
You have also argued that doctors should be obligated to ignore certain aspects of the Hippocratic Oath.

Since both police and doctors have a duty to do their jobs, what's the difference?
 
I think Frank is my dad.

Frank,

Do you have a son named rangermonroe?

Argueing with you and watching from the sidlines here reminds me of the dinner table of my youth.
 
So, is the 'Bend over and take it' group any better?

Or, as Boston T. Party puts it, those who "roll over and pee on their belllies."
 
Frank,

Do you have a son named rangermonroe?

Argueing with you and watching from the sidlines here reminds me of the dinner table of my youth.
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I'm not allowed to argue at work, so I argue here....It's better for everyone that way!!

Frank, why do you have different standards for police and doctors?

You have stated clearly that police should not be obligated to ignore certain laws.
You have also argued that doctors should be obligated to ignore certain aspects of the Hippocratic Oath.

Since both police and doctors have a duty to do their jobs, what's the difference?
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I didn't say "ignore" the "laws" (and I don't believe their oath is a law, is it?) I just said to use discretion with a little justice in mind. People expect the cops to use discretion all the time with justice and fairness in mind. Why not doctors? And believe me, some medical professionals DO use that kind of discretion as far as who gets treated when, and what kind of care they get. I've seen one or two ambulances racing to the hospital at 45 MPH on the freeway under certain circumstances...
 
I believe that doctors just as LEOs have a duty to use discression.

If I show up burned badly, DR. knows that at best I will be a crispy critter begging for death for weeks until I gratefully expire from infection,

Treat the cop with the gunshot to the calf first, but a few cc's of morphine for me to speed me on my trip would be appreciated.

Pull me over, Frank, with me and no seatbelt fastened.

"buddy...is that a 6-pack on the seat?

"Get out...blow in the tube....09...

"Damn, last month that was legal, but due to the new law, you're DUI"

"Now let's tow your car and cost you some real money

"By the way, the seatbelt ticket will cost you $55"
 
Frank, this is very disturbing - we seem to be in agreement. :D

I'm not allowed to argue at work, so I argue here....It's better for everyone that way!!
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Me too!

As to police and doctors, they both have a duty to perform their jobs, even if they involve doing things that the individuals do not particularly care for. And they both bear the burden of exercising professional discretion in situations, including making life-and-death decisions, that most of us will never have to face.
 
Pull me over, Frank, with me and no seatbelt fastened.

"buddy...is that a 6-pack on the seat?

"Get out...blow in the tube....09...

"Damn, last month that was legal, but due to the new law, you're DUI"
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Actually, you'd beat that one....You can't make someone take a test just because they have alcohol in the car, whether it's open or not....I'd refuse the test in that situation and take the civil infraction hit...
 
"You can't tell me what to do! You can't You can't You can't You can't...........!"

I think that well represents a certain segment of society.
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TBO,
You are absolutely correct. There are folks who whine when people order them around. Hell, I'm guilty of that now and again myself. Bet you are too. Accepting and following commands is a learned response - one that some learn better than others. In fact, some learn it so well that they do anything and everything a superior tells them to do without question. Some refuse to learn it at all and don't merely ignore commands but actually do the opposite of what they are ordered to do out of spite.

I think we can all agree that neither extreme is healthy.

The arguments that support wearing one's seat belt don't necessarily transfer over to making it a crime to not wear your seat belt.
 
Way I look at putting my seat belt on is an investment in my future....

My wife has a part time job at a local funeral home.....most of the new customers who died in an auto accidents were not wearing seat belts...

I want to live a long life........
 
As was said somewhere in this everly so lost thread, who said driving a vehicle is a right ? It is a privelage. Period. Therfore to exercise that privelage, you must obey the laws associated with it. It has nothing to do with your individual rights, views or freedoms, etc. If you don't want to wear one, fine. Just be prepared to pay the piper.
 
Perhaps that is the flaw in our thinking. Who has the authority to proclaim that driving--doing anything, for that matter--is a privilege? It is not a right in of itself, but I certainly wouldn't call it a privilege. I think driving should fall into the right of "pursuit of happiness".

And no one run to the dictionary now...
 
FYI, last night the Maryland State Police issued 111 no seatbelt citations in Rockville, after NIGHT VISION GOGGLE driver surveillance on a major city road.
 
touched on a million times, im sure. but my two cents:

seat belts should not be a law. sure, we should all wear them, but there is no excuse for an agency of any sort (in this case Gov't) to be telling a person what they NEED to do in order to be safe. Just like motorcycle helmets in many states. optional, but highly reccomended
 
Ben, agreed. There are also those who don't like being asked to do something... :rolleyes:
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True enough. But this really isn't about being asked to do something. Police aren't pulling people over and saying "Excuse me sir, do you realize that wearing a seatbelt can increase your chances of surviving an accident? Please wear it in the future."
They're saying "Excuse me sir, I am citing you for violation of our state's seatbelt code. Please sign here, it is not an admission of guilt, merely an affirmation that you will either pay the fine or show up in court ..."

That's not a request, that's a punishment for noncompliance. There's a difference, I think.
 
For those in favor of mandatory seat belt use to save societal resources spent on the indigent injured, might I suggest:
- Criminalize tobacco use
- Criminalize alcohol use
- Criminalize fast food consumption
- Criminalize working more than 12 hours per day to support your family
- Criminalize motorcycles, ATVs, ski-boats, tree stands, private aircraft, martial arts, high school football.
- Certainly criminalize hunting and all firearms.


Once we see what the results of those changes are, I'm certain we can think up more.

It's really a bit disappointing to see people, who claim to be rugged individualists, so worried about what their neighbors are doing "wrong". Get over it, people. There's only one result of the "collective good" argument.....it's a bobsled to slavery at the whim of the State.
Rich
 
Frank,

That is an excellent question, since NVGs are light amplification (not thermal) devices, and I do not have the answer.

What I know is this: WTOP (DC's all news station) broadcast a report this morning outlining the facts I stated above. The report also stated that the NVGs were "military surplus".

With all this said, I second your point; the intense light form headlamps should have really limited the NVGs’ utility. Hell, the Navy spent many millions to re-light cockpit for NVG compatibility, and the intensity of those earlier dim, red cockpit lights was nothing like a headlight (admittedly, it was the light's color/frequency, as much as its intensity).

Regards -- Roy
 
I'm still amused that this thread, about potentially being stopped by the police with firearms in your car went from that relevant issue to five pages of debate over the merits of the Click it or Ticket program. :confused:

Can we give the OP a take on transporting firearms? ;)
 
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