Anyone know suarez international?

About the best you can say about Suarez is that he attracts a slavishly loyal group of fanbois. Plenty of threads right her on TFL (not to mention his cult-like forums) attest to that.

If he has actually repented of his past as a fraud and workman's comp cheat, I would think he would stop lying and attempting to defraud people. A quick look at the US Palm AK magazine scandal should be plenty of evidence that he has not.

But at a certain point this discussion becomes trying to convince a guy who dressed up like Han Solo at his wedding that George Lucas isn't a genius. People invest not only thousands of dollars but much of their self worth and identity in being part of a loyal cadre, and reasoned discourse is impossible and met with the same stale talking points. To the OP: do your research and make up your own mind. But I would not give that man a cent.
 
Quick reminder to those who have forgotten: Massad Ayoob is a member of TFL and is protected by the "don't attack other TFL members" rule. Perfectly acceptable to say the man is wrong about stuff (provided you have facts to back up your claims), but if you want to call him names, do it elsewhere.

As for Suarez, here is a link for those who really want the history: http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=159985. You can read TFL owner Rich Lucibella's thoughts about Suarez in the opening post.

pax
 
A company called US Palm developed new US made polymer AK mags. Suarez started pimping them, with his standard realism and restraint. He claimed that they were extensively torture tested, highly reliable, and made claims as to their construction. When people actually got their hands on them, they started failing due to a lack of proper metal reinforcement. Which Suarez claimed they had. The mags also failed a number of tests he claims they would survive easily.

The man is a criminal, and a fraud. He may be a skilled fighter and trainer (doubtful in my mind but not impossible) but I refuse to give money to con men.
 
Pax, with all due respect (and I do mean that sincerely), just because Ayoob is a member here should not mean he is immune from what anyone can categorize as an "attack". There is so much to bring up about him and others like him, that I don't even know where to begin. Perhaps you can help me to understand what is off limits and what isn't. Can I post links to threads that engage him directly and call him out on such things as his adrenaline enhancement episode...or his baseless advocacy against the use of reloads or self-loads in defensive situations?...or his flip-flop on .380ACP for defense, once Ruger came out with their LCP?...or his (alleged) citing of non-existent court cases to back up his points?...or his (alleged) fabrications in his writings and (alleged) false claims of access to data he says was provided to him by government and police agencies?

Again, I respect you and this forum...my very favorite since before I became a member in 2004. I remember the now classic threads where George Fennell took on the pretenders when they were posing as tribology experts. I remember how many times this forum did not automatically elevate the opinions of members just because they were cops above the opinions of noncops (unlike many other similar forums). I remember how this forum took on Front Site when GT was being threatened with legal action. These are just a few examples that come to mind at this very moment. It is this spirit of accuracy, honesty, openness and even rebellious insubordination to those who try to intimidate the less money-capable individuals that has made this forum what it is. I hope that you keep this forum great by honoring that spirit.
 
seed,

You can engage him directly about anything -- provided you do not attack him personally.

"Mas, there appears to be a contradiction between what you said here (link provided) and what is reported in the newspaper here (link provided). That sure looks dishonest to me. Can you explain the discrepancy?" would be fine.

"Massad Ayoob is a lying little sneak!" would not be.

I trust you can see the difference.

TFL exists to promote the cause of responsible gun ownership. We pride ourselves on civil but truthful conversations about firearms and self defense. We handle our fellow members with gloves, but we handle the issues bare-fisted. And we do not tolerate the level of rudeness or the type of ad hominem attacks that are so sadly common elsewhere on the web. With that in mind --- have at it.

pax
 
Seed, as you assembled your falsehoods for your unprovoked attack on me, did you intentionally lie or just fail to apply due diligence to your research.
You claim that I threatened to sue CalGuns. You know or should have known that I expressly said that I had no intent to do so, but that one disingenuous poster’s attacks on me and others opened the forum to that type of liability. It is plain to see on the last page of the thread in question, here:

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=343110&highlight=Massad+Ayoob&page=8

You claim that someone has me “pinned down” here and on THR? Since I’m presently not engaged in any dialogue with anyone on either forum, can you tell us how a man who isn’t there can be “pinned down”? Links, please.
So far, you seem to be letting your obvious malice overcome truth.
 
A company called US Palm developed new US made polymer AK mags. Suarez started pimping them, with his standard realism and restraint. He claimed that they were extensively torture tested, highly reliable, and made claims as to their construction. When people actually got their hands on them, they started failing due to a lack of proper metal reinforcement. Which Suarez claimed they had. The mags also failed a number of tests he claims they would survive easily.
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Evidently, he wasn't the only one deluded. Several 'name' trainers recommend the USPalm mags as the 'go to' mags for the AK.

I'm going to have to respectfully ask to have my account deleted from this site. I'm not worthy to be on a forum populated with so much perfection.
 
Gabes an interesting guy, he makes no bones about his forum, in his words it is his dictatorship and he uses it for alot of advertising. hey its capatalism. I really like the guy, so do some dont. I like his training style, the weapon systems he prefers, and his total dislike for the square range/stand and deliver types. Personally, he seems like a alright guy. What dealings i have had with his company have been good also. Probably my favorite thing about him is his open challange to any other trainers for a battle of training methods in force on force.
 
Gabes an interesting guy, he makes no bones about his forum, in his words it is his dictatorship and he uses it for alot of advertising. hey its capatalism. I really like the guy, so do some dont. I like his training style, the weapon systems he prefers, and his total dislike for the square range/stand and deliver types. Personally, he seems like a alright guy. What dealings i have had with his company have been good also. Probably my favorite thing about him is his open challange to any other trainers for a battle of training methods in force on force.
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Well said. I very recently got involved over on warriortalk after getting into the AK game. At times I definitely find many of the members there to be a bit cultish, but I also find that a lot of what is taught by SI to be excellent training and concepts. If those guys like something, they LOVE it... Just check their opinions on AK's, red dots on pistols, etc., they are very passionate about the things they believe in.

I've gotten to be acquaintances with one of the staff instructors, and I would have no problem recommending him for certain types of instruction. Mr Suarez makes no apolozies for the way he runs his site, and he shouldn't have to... It's his site to run as he pleases, though I will admit he sometimes comes off as a complete rear-end. I have been really impressed with the fact that the site features a Christian Warrior sub-forum. I take everything there with a grain of salt, just as I do here or on any other forum. But if given the opportunity to attend an SI class, I would most certainly give it a shot.
 
The only dealings I've had were trying to get the spam e-mails to stop. Right along with the Viagra and exxxtenze as well. Telemarketing doesn't work on me through my phone or computer. People who advertise in this fashion are just trying to make a quick buck IMO. The info I had researched on this fella indicated to me he was/is bombastic, dictatorial, my way is the BEST way kinda guy. To me, if it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck, it's probably not a cow.:D Disciplines and techniques vary as in martial arts. Capoeira isn't better than Karate, just different. Don't try to blow smoke up my @%$ and tell me otherwise.
 
The incident did happen but has been blown out of proportion over the years by the 'net. IIRC, it was one of SWAT Magazine's (the host of this forum) own writers who did the 'article'.
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Funny how crimes are downplayed when people like the person who was convicted.

So, if no one on TFL ever takes an SI class, I really doubt it will hurt his bottom line.
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So much for endorsing boycotts.
 
Having gone back and looked through the TFL conversation between Mr. Lucibella and Mr. Suarez, one thing jumped out at me: Suarez disagrees with The Modern Technique? Okay, if someone can tell me where I'm missing something here, please do, but....I thought Jeff Cooper was the founder of The Modern Technique, and I also thought that Suarez was one of his star pupils at one time, even an instructor for him at one point? I know I have a 1990s issue of Guns And Ammo where Cooper was really singing Suarez's praises in his column. What gives? When did Suarez decide that his mentor's teachings were wrong?
 
I believe that is what part of the debate itself is about. One side feels that Suarez in practice teaches modern technique while trying to call it something else and calling other trainers outdated with little evidence, while the other side feels that he really is teaching something new and different and outside the box, and has sufficient evidence to support his claims.

The only things I got conclusively out of that thread were, Suarez was given an opportunity to discuss why he feels his method is superior to the others and he did not deliver a straight answer. Also that while his marketing and rhetoric seems questionable, when it comes down to it he at least provides reasonable and effective training, and is not an outfit like ADE (featured here:http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=460005 )

Personally would I take a class at SI? maybe. Given his marketing methods, would SI be a top contender out of programs available? newp.
 
Actually I made no accusations on anyone (excluding the spelling dispute). I did say "Ethics Matters" and I'll stand by that statement.
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That strikes me as kind of a drive by accusation. you say ethics matter yet you don't say anything specific.

I really don't have a dog in this hunt so I will let it go at that.

I have seen the court records and all the Internet stuff. Not really impressed that any great crime was committed. Looked to me that politicians were on a witch hunt. If they had such a great case they should have pursued it to the bitter end.

I just think that when a person questions another person ethics he should do it clearly without any tap dancing on an Internet forum.

Whether or not you provide training for free is not relevant to the conversation. I recognize you for doing that and you should be commended for it.

If one chooses to provide training for pay that is ok too. The way this nation works.

Mr. Lucibella promotes his magazine on the forum which is his right to do so and he should do so since he provides the resources for this forum. I thank him for that.

If Mr. Lucibella didn't make money to to pay the bills then we wouldn't have this forum.

If another guy promotes products he is selling and pays the bills so that the forum stays on the Internet for the free use of people there is nothing wrong with it.

I have never met Mr. Suarez nor participated in any of his courses. They have been recommended by a guy I respect and he has attended the other prominent courses as well.

I just think that before we say anything bad about anybody on the Internet you should be clear about it and back it up with the facts or say nothing at all.
 
Despite what it may look like, no one is attacking the person himself. What they are doing is showing a side to his story that most are not privy to know for one reason or another. These guys make money (your money) to sell their services and sometimes to directly or indirectly promote products or companies that pay their bills, usually through advertising dollars (especially in the case of gun rags) or perhaps through direct sponsorship. It wasn't until the internet, (even with all of its flaws) came out and gave us a forum (generic meaning) to have unprecedented access to formerly out of reach information, source material and communication avenues with each other and even semi-famous personalities. These old-school gun rag writers are threatened by this access and free exchange of information. They can be and have been repeatedly called out on their falsehoods (should they have any) and they don't like it...it really hurts their bottom line. Perhaps this is why Suarez feels so desperate to constantly raise the bar in his claims of bravado and technical superiority. Same for Ayoob, who I see has actually replied on this thread...accusing me of falsehoods and perhaps lying.

By the way, thank you for joining us Mr. Ayoob. I will try to get to your requests as soon as I can. I'm currently dealing with a lot for the next four days (work week and a broken bath pipe in my residence which I discovered at 4:30 am this morning), so I may not be able to give it the effort it deserves until then. I hope you will bear with me until then. In the meantime, you can accuse me of whatever you like...I don't mind. I don't earn a cent off of any of this.
 
I would say that no Gabe does not teach modern technique, he emphasizes alot of point shooting (and unless i completely misremember what i have read, MT is all about sight use) and he also if a very firm beliver in the great piece of tactical knowledge "MOVE YOUR ASS"!!!!:D




And yes, SI people are cultish, just like Gunsite people or any one who follows a specific trainer.
 
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