.357 and .44

Georgia Arms

Here are Georgia Arms loadings--first number is ft lbs, second is pfs

357 MAGNUM (new ammo)
125gr Jacketed Hollow Point 544 1400
158gr Jacketed Hollow Point 544 1200
158gr Lead Semi-Wadcutter 424 1100
158gr Plated Semi-Wadcutter 424 1100

44 REMINGTON MAGNUM (New Ammo)
G44MA 240gr Lead Semi-Wadcutter 644 1100
G44MC 240gr Gold Dot Hollow Point 935 1325
G44MD 300gr Jacketed Soft Point 1040 1250
G44ME 200gr Jacketed Hollow Point (Deer Stopper) 1209 1650
 
I thought I heard that being shot with a 44 Mag at 100 yards was like being shot with a 357 Mag at the muzzle.

Is this right?
 
Looks like .357 is only half the .44’s energy
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Give me a break. The super hot +p+ 44Mag load that you listed from BB is not even safe to use in all pistols and that was from a 7.5" barrel. BB's 180gr. 357Mag load is making almost 800ft/lbs of energy from a 4" barrel. From a 7.5"+ barrel you can make 900-1000ft/lbs with a 357Mag. All of BB's 357Mag loads are safe to use in all pistols clearly indicating that they can make them hotter for some specific pistols. That is not a fair comparison. I didn't see any of their 357Mag loads designated +p+ did you? I'm not saying the 357Mag is as powerful just that people often underestimate it and don't give it the credit it deserves. I'm just trying to help the originator out and give him some good information. If you reload you should probably understand that two cartridges that have the same exact case length, should likewise have similar energies. Of course if you use a barrel length twice the length of another pistol the energies are going to be up bigtime, especially in Magnum loadings. A standard 357Mag hunting load like Federal's180gr. load make 625ft/lbs from a 4" barrel. With a 6" barrel that is easily making over 700ft/lbs of energy. I've found this load adequate for anything in the lower 48, but I prefer my own load of a 158gr. JSP going about 1400-1500fps. I find it very controllable and easy to shoot while offering excellent performance on deer and elk.
 
357Mag load is making almost 800ft/lbs of energy from a 4" barrel
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Nope, it was a 6 inch Ruger GP 100 -125gr. @ 1707 fps..with a 4in it's only 1600fps (4 inch S&W L frame Mt. Gun)

The super hot +p+ 44Mag load that you listed from BB is not even safe to use in all pistols and that was from a 7.5" barrel.
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True, not every .44 can shoot the +p+ loads, mainly because the 340gr bullet needs full length cylinder.

The 800ft-lb is the most powerful .357factory load as far as I now, most factory ammo is under 550ft-lb.

But the fact remains that most powerful .44mag is at lest twice as powerful as the most powerful .357mag.


Look I’m not trying to say that .357 isn’t powerful, after all I’m a 9mm fan, but .44 is just out of the .357’s league
 
Nope, it was a 6 inch Ruger GP 100 -125gr. @ 1707 fps..with a 4in it's only 1600fps (4 inch S&W L frame Mt. Gun)
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That isn't the load I'm talking about. I'm talking the 180gr. load, which makes 760ft/lbs out of a 4" barrel.

The 800ft-lb is the most powerful .357factory load as far as I now, most factory ammo is under 550ft-lb.

But the fact remains that most powerful .44mag is at lest twice as powerful as the most powerful .357mag.
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I think you are missing my point. A 44Mag load that isn't even safe to shoot in all guns doesn't really count as all of BB's 357Mag loads are safe to shoot, even in the tiny J-frames. Otherwise the most powerful loads are making about 1200ft/lbs, and that is with a 6.5-7.5" barrel. Like I said, with a 7.5+" barrel, the 357Mag can push over 900ft/lbs of energy. Yes most factory 357Mag loads make about 550ft/lbs of energy, which I explained earlier. The 357Mag was one of the most prolific LE catridges of the 20th century. I don't think that loading full-power hunting loads for police is very practical do you? Keep in mind that the standard 125gr service load makes almost 600ft/lbs from a 4" barrel, it approaches 700ft/lbs out of a 6" barrel. Yes the 44Mag is significantly more powerful than the 357Mag, but it isn't twice as powerful. Show me a 44Mag load that is safe for all guns to shoot that makes 1,800ft/lbs of energy and you've got me. A simple look at factory normal loads that are available at your local gun-shop will compare very similarly between the 357 and 44. Usually the 44 will beat it out by 100ft/lbs not 700. Although not always the case, maybe we can come to an agreement and say that that the 357Mag has 70% of the power the 44Mag has, as a fairly warm 44Mag load will do 1000ft/lbs and a fairly warm 357Mag load will do over 700ft/lbs. Of course we can squeeze out 100-200ft/lbs more out of either cartridge but we can leave it at that. These are about the warmest loads that you will find at your average gunstore.
 
The 357Mag was one of the most prolific LE catridges of the 20th century. I don't think that loading full-power hunting loads for police is very practical do you?
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But there are people that hunt deer with .357 so the demand is there and no one has made the “1200ft/lbs” load which I don’t even think is possible (out of a handgun )since again most factory loads are 450-550 ft-lb, so 800ft-lb is a pretty warm load for .357mag.

Even when you compare mild local gun store ammo .44 factory ammo is 750-1050 ft-lb, so still it’s about 2x the power of .357mag.

Plus you don’t know that BB +p+ is not safe in all guns, it doesn’t sat anything about that on their website ALTHOUGH you do need a full length chamber.
 
It's not a matter of revolver strength with the +P+ loads, but the fact that the 330+ grain bullets used in these loads are seated so far out the case that when chambered in some revolvers it will stick out of the chamber. All the recommended handguns for the +P+ loads on the website have the longer cylinders.
The loads would be safe to shoot in a S&W M629 if they would only fit.
 
Nevermind, so I could just shoot 9mm loads out of a 3" barrel and shoot 45ACP out of a 6" barrel and say the 45ACP has twice as much energy. I haven't seen one commonly available 44Mag load that has twice as much energy as a commonly available 357Mag load out of a similar barrel length. Reloading has brought me to similar figures.
 
The 357 mag is a fine pistol round...one of the best in my book. That said, the 44 mag outclasses it...plain and simple. Numbers can be subjective (not supposed to be, but that is the way it is...), but whether the 44 has twice the energy than the 357 or 1.5 times the energy or whatever, one thing is for sure...the 44 has significantly more energy and can do things that the 357 can't.
 
The .357 is a great round and the 38 is a terrific target round. The 44 magnum is also a very effective round and according to some folks is now woefully underpowered. Whatever.:rolleyes:

mathman
For the novice, the .357 mag is the most versatile handgun
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I thought the 22LR fell into that category. Personally I wouldn't give a .357 magnum revolver to a novice and expect them to do all that well. Now if I wanted to scare them off of the idea of shooting ever again then I would give them a cylinder full of 125 grain semi-jacketed hollow points. They may not be 44 magnums but they have their own share of buck and snort.
 
Good points Jeff, I agree the 357Mag is definitely not for a novice shooter. I think the 357Mag is a better revolver for someone who doesn't have much experience with Magnum cartridges as clearly indicated by the originator. The 44Mag is definitely one heck of a cartridge that I love to hunt with. It has awesome knock-down power on deer and elk. Also, according to some people on this thread, the 357Mag is no more powerful than a +p 9mm.
 
Personally I wouldn't give a .357 magnum revolver to a novice and expect them to do all that well.
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I agree...in principal...but a novice can start with 38 specials in a 357 mag...right? :)
 
I decided I'll probably go w/ the 357. I don't think I need the .44 plus it's my first pistol so I'll go with the smaller of the 2 and I can learn with the .38's and move up. thanks for the replies though.
 
Also, according to some people on this thread, the 357Mag is no more powerful than a +p 9mm.
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Well that is true and you know it; a hot 9mm +p+ like a Buffalo Bore is just as powerful as a (regular) factory .357mag.... but most powerful .357mag of course is a bit more powerful then 9mm.
 
I decided I'll probably go w/ the 357. I don't think I need the .44 plus it's my first pistol so I'll go with the smaller of the 2 and I can learn with the .38's and move up. thanks for the replies though.
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Good choice, if you are not reloading you will find the 357/38 combo much more versatle than the 44M/44spl combination. There is much more ammo selection at your local gunstore and it usually costs about half as much, which means you will shoot it a lot more.
 
"Good choice, if you are not reloading you will find the 357/38 combo much more versatle than the 44M/44spl combination."

It is actually a good choice even if you are reloading. It is just that reloading for the 44 Spl/44 Mag really goes a long way towards making them less painful to shoot, budget-wise.
 
I agree gb in ga. The 44 combo is a very expensive combo to shoot if you don't reload. The 357/38 has worked out very well for me and does just about everything I need it to, except big-game hunting. For that purpose I would rather have my 300WM rifle. The 38spl cartridge is really fun to shoot and is very very accurate. I've used the 357Mag for hunting here in Colorado with very good results. A 158gr JSP or JHP at 1300-1400 fps does excellent on deer and elk sized game. I practice with this load a lot and it is not painful at all to shoot out of my Ruger GP100s.
 
One nice thing about handloading for the .357 Mag is that, barring buying factory loads from the likes of Buffalo Bore, that is the way you can actually attain the really stellar performance potential that the round has to offer. Of course, you need to carefully tailor them to your individual gun. Not to mention, reloading is a "hoot", and can get downright addictive!

That said, the exact same principle applies to the .44 Mag as well.
 
I figured that it'll be a good round for ccw and that it won't be too pricey. I looked at the price of .44's and they got kind of high. I won't be using it really for any big game just for defense and going out to shoot. Now I just have to wait another 2 months till i turn 21 to get my purchasing permit

Joel
 
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