147 grain 9mm smack down

I think I can come up with a test to "prove" one round is the most effective round for self defense.

I can then change a few variables in the test and "prove" that its the worst round for self defense.

A popular round made by a reputable manufacturer is going to preform about as well as can be expected given all of the variables that can occur in a real gunfight as long as its a decent caliber and you can put it where it needs to go.

I have seen a bunch of people killed by .22's and .25's. Based on my observations, you would be well armed with either of them. Yet, I don't carry them for defense and, wouldn't suggest you should either.

Bullets and people do weird things when they meet.

Every ammo maker is trying their best to make the best round possible, but, you need to remember, they are out to sell ammo first. If they can convince you thier round is the best, its a good thing for them.
 
I want any slight advantage I can get. If one round penetrates 1" farther in the universal medium of ballistic gel, and/or the chrony says it has 50 fps more velocity, and/or the recovered bullets expand 1% more reliably than something else - then that's the one I'll use.
Click to expand...
And any performance you eke out in that manner will be swamped by improvements in your shot placement. And reliability of the round in your given weapon. You would have done better to spend that time dry firing or doing basic shooting drills instead of running numbers looking for what are most likely statistically insignificant differences.
 
The difference between .380 ball and the best .45 ACP hollowpoint will not make up for two inches of lateral dispersion, from the centerline of the body.

It hits what it hits and it pokes holes through it, or it don't. Those are the foundation elements of gunshot wounds from handguns.
 
just me

I am unable to ignore the body of yes-anecdotal reports on the 'smack-down' effect of high-speed 125g JHPs.

I recognize that many hold strong opinions on this subject in both directions, yet to some I might suggest careful consideration of the concept called "conventional wisdom".
 
 
over penetration

I'm not going into the stopping power side of this business. Its been hashed over so many times .....

I will comment about "over penetrating". I don't have the numbers in front of me, but a very high percentage of bullets fired in police shootings, (and I suspect civilian SD instances) don't hit the intended target and end up sailing off into background anyhow. These rounds are clearly the equal of an over penetrator, , , more so than a round that has struck an assailant, yet we're not hearing about multiple bystanders getting hit, friendly fire, etc.

I would rather have a round that offers adequate penetration, consistently.

Which has but a little to do with the OP, sorry.
 
I can't help myself

I consider the 147g JHP+P 9x19 to be a 158g JHP+P 38 Special.

I consider the 124--127g JHP 9x19+P/38 Super/9x21/9x23/357 SIG (and 135g JHP 40 S&W and 10mm) to be a 125g JHP 357 Magnum.

I consider them as such because
 
I got an idea, don't shoot me with any of that junk.... 115, 124, 147, I'm sure it all hurts pretty bad. In all seriousness, I carry 124 Speer GD, have fired 147gr and didn't have any issues.
 
If it works in your gun, and you feel like using it...go for it.

The bad reputation for the 147 gr. JHP can be traced to quite a few places. Most of the time, the 9mm as a whole gets called a weak, underpowered round, and the 147 further gets called unreliable and slow.

A big issue now is there are so many other calibers that get the title of "best man stopper", and people gravitate toward them like flies to s$%t. The unfortunate reality is they are no better suited for protection against people than the 9mm they replaced.

Against any human target, the standard 9mm in any weight has more than enough power to destroy even the strongest tissues. A hit to the heart with a 9mm is only different than the same hit with a .40 in that the .40 might expand to a slightly larger diameter. Energy, velocity, penetration, etc. are nice on paper, but really amount to a big, fat zero with real world performance. To a human heart, a tissue roughly the size of a fist, the difference is like a cat being hit by a 3/4 ton truck (or Ford F250 size) or a 1 ton (Ford F350); it makes no difference.

Where does a heavier caliber really shine? Larger or stronger wild animals. You might need the penetration of a .357 Magnum when shooting the breast plate of a wild hog, which can be extremely tough to penetrate. Often, you need more than a normal anti-personnel round to deal with charging bears.

To sum it up, the reason the 147 gr. 9mm isn't as widely used is because people feel it can't keep up with the big boys when it comes to dropping a person like a sack of dirt. Unfortunately, most of these people are misinformed.
 
i ve seen numerous videos of 380 acp hp bullets expanding quite well at
900fps-ish reported velociteis...if they arent lying of course.

why wouldnt a 147g 9mm (if such exists?) at 1000fps not expand??

in the videos i saw using bullets hitting bone and meat if the hp bullet struck bone it usually was deflected or deformed anyway and expansion was soso and uneven.
 
b-bore website states its subsonic? 147 g 9mm bullet travels 930fps from a 3inch barrell.....the videos i saw of 380acp s hitting bone were doing quite well at the same velocites (going thru bone and about 4 inches into game flesh) yet with significantly lighter bullets.
 
"A 20 year old report using 30 year old data. :barf:

Today's 147 grain bullet technology is not your father's 147 grain bullet technology."

were all older hp bullets crappy???? were they more dependent on higher velocity to expand 'properly'? substantiating the (false) claim of 147g failures??
 
This is a thread from 2010, and it contained a lot of bull. There are multiple 147gr loads that are known to be very effective. Speer Gold Dots, Winchester PDX1s, and Federal HST, just off the top of my head. 147 offers light felt recoil, and very good penetration.
 
Universally the detractors of the 147-gr. 9mm bullet soured on it based on experience with very old bullet designs. Which is unfair on two levels- first, none of the modern, premium self defense ammo is problematic in ANY bullet weight, and second, ALL of the old hollow points were erratic performers at best in ANY bullet weight.

I switched from the warp-speed 127-gr. +P+ Winchester Ranger load to the 147-gr. standard pressure Federal HST after noting that the performance was nearly identical, but the Ranger load recoils like a .40 S&W, while the HST load recoils like a 115-gr. FMJ practice load.
 
I've loaded up a lot of 147 gr. FP hard cast 9mm. I use it for target practice and in my EDC. Never had an issue with it.
 
stormyone: said:
lol I wonder if people still believe the crap on Chuck Hawks website?
Click to expand...

I run across that 'site occasionally- the amount of disinformation there is astounding making it the ideal quagmire for the uninformed.

IIRC, he has even begun to charge folks for the "wisdom" offered by his 'site. Eh. :rolleyes:
 
Old thread with older info.

Modern 147gr JHP rounds work very well. Back in the 80's close to the infancy of modern JHP tech, the 147gr rounds would not reliably expand. They were JHP, but FMJs in practice. Today, the technology is far better, but the 147gr rounds now have a bad rep due to past poor performance.

I carry 124gr +P Speer Gold Dots, but I wouldn't be against carrying 147gr Gold Dots either.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top