10mm or 357 mag?

I'd start with a .357 revolver but............

If you like revolvers go with .357 mag

If you like Auto's go with 10mm

To each his own but I do not like auto loads in revolvers.

I didn't read all the posts so I'm sure someone covered this but the 10mm will be very expensive to shoot. The .357 mag revolver can shoot cheaper .38 spl loads which is a lot cheaper. Not sure what everyone else got out of the trauma surgeon article but what I got was shot placement is key, on any animal or in target shooting for that matter. Cheaper ammo = more practice = better shot placement in my why of thinking.

10mm vs 357 mag vs 40 S&W vs whatever is like the .270 vs .308 vs '06 debate for deer. They all do the job if the shooter does his. It's fun to discuss it and debate it, but the reality is the same.

Some auto manufactures like EEA, Glock allow you to drop in a different caliber barrel on some guns. So you could swap out the 10mm barrel for a 40 S&W so this could lessen the shooting cost with some up front money.

The reason gang bangers survive so many wounds is the bullets usually have ricocheted off the pavement or building before it gets to them....
 
I typically throw a little into the ammo can every pay check. Once it grows enough, I think my next purchase will either be a Glock 20 or one of those sweet new GP-100 Match Champions. After that, it'll either be conversion barrels for the former to shoot .40 and .357 Sig or a trip to the smith for the latter to rock 10mm and .40 with moon clips. I'm only 10% of the way there now... :rolleyes:
 
I've thought about getting a glock 20 and buying a 9x25 Dillon conversion barrel. It's a lot cheaper than a Coonan Classic with very similar performance. I'm surprised no one brought up the 9x25 Dillon in this thread. It's what the 357 Sig should of been.
 
coldbeer said:
I've thought about getting a glock 20 and buying a 9x25 Dillon conversion barrel. It's a lot cheaper than a Coonan Classic with very similar performance. I'm surprised no one brought up the 9x25 Dillon in this thread. It's what the 357 Sig should of been.
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The 9x25 Dillon has a small following but look at what it is, you're shooting .355" 9mm bullets to velocities the bullet isn't designed for. You even get this with the 10mm, meaning it shooting .400" bullets faster than they're intended. With the .357 Mag, you get bullets specifically designed to handle the extra velocity it delivers, a big short fall with the 9x25 Dillon and 10mm.
 
The argument is that the expanding defense bullets in a .400" diameter that fill the consumer's market are all designed to expand between 900 and 1,000 FPS.

Handloaders can look a little harder, spend a little more money and buy bullets that MAY be better suited to higher velocities.

It's not that a .40cal slug won't run at a higher velocity that the 10mm can push it, it's more that it's not designed to be optimal at 200-300 FPS faster than .40 S&W.
 
without a doubt

The 9x25 Dillon is the loudest handgun cartridge I've had the displeasure of hearing.


Rob Leatham said it had too much recoil.
 
.It's not that a .40cal slug won't run at a higher velocity that the 10mm can push it, it's more that it's not designed to be optimal at 200-300 FPS faster than .40 S&W
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How is that since the 10mm is the parent of the 40?
 
With the .357 Mag, you get bullets specifically designed to handle the extra velocity it delivers...
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I don't know... The .357Mag gained its reputation primarily on the strength of the 125gr JHP loading. That round was known for rapid expansion and fragmentation, something that would likely be termed bullet failure in this day an age. Yet it worked very well for stopping bad guys in the real world.

Today, it's probably true that a .40 caliber bullet is morely likely to be tailored for .40S&W velocities than for 10mm velocities. That said, the .357Mag 125gr JHP loading suggests that overdriving a bullet a little is not necessarily such a bad thing in terms of self-defense as long as you don't take things to the extreme.

If you want to take a 10mm hunting, there are bullet options out there that won't expand too agressively and will hold together for deep penetration. The Hornady XTP line--especially in the heavier weights seems to fill that bill.

Here's an interesting test of a .40S&W bullet fired at 10mm velocities (faster, actually) that produced excellent results with no signs of bullet failure.

http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?p=5780413
 
So quite a few of us agree that the real difference between 9mm,40S&W and 45ACP are very slim yet we have 8 pages on 357vs10mm! Really...........
 
How is that since the 10mm is the parent of the 40?
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Really very easy...
In the heyday of the 10mm (late 1980s), expanding bullet technology was in it's infancy. These bullets have come a long, long, long way since the .40 S&W was born in 1990, and performance .40cal expanding/defense projectiles have been designed, produced and marketed in .40 S&W ammo.

For quite a long time the only 10mm JHP you could get was the Federal Hydra-Shok (top-tier product in...1988...) and the Winchester Silvertip (cutting edge bullet technology of 1985...)

Gold Dot? HST? This stuff didn't exist when the Smith & Wesson 1076 was being issued to the FBI.

Some of us have been 10mm guys for a very long time. Some of us can admit that we've always carried a gigundo chip on our shoulder and spent -FAR- too much energy SNEERING at the .40 S&W round.

Harsh reality, 10mm guys: if not for the existence of the .40 S&W round, we would have a HELLUVA time finding component bullets to handload our 10mm ammo and factory 10mm would cost even more because of the simple economy of scale.

Don't believe me?
Ask the fans of the .41 AE where they get all of their component bullets and factory ammo.
 
In the heyday of the 10mm (late 1980s), expanding bullet technology was in it's infancy. These bullets have come a long, long, long way since the .40 S&W was born in 1990, and performance .40cal expanding/defense projectiles have been designed, produced and marketed in .40 S&W ammo.
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Most of the better bullets of new technology have no problem dealing with the added velocity.
With bonded jackets and reverse taper jackets they can make a bullet that opens easily to a certain point but doesn't over expand beyond a certain point all the while holding together for weight retention.
John's golddot test he linked is a good example of how well modern bullet tech works over a wider velocity range.
Sure there are some bullets that still use older technology like both the Nosler and Sierra 135gr bullets that turn to schrapnel at 10mm speeds, of course for that same reason, I wouldn't use them in a 40 either.
Of course 357 has similar issues as there are plenty of .357 dia bullets that will come apart at mag velocity and plenty that will expand nicely and penatrate deep.

The 357 magnum is a very versatile cartridge. If I want more horsepower I just step up to the 44 magnum.
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makes sense but so does

The 10mm is a very versatile cartridge. If I want more horsepower I just step up to the 44 magnum.
 
since you asked

Ask the fans of the .41 AE where they get all of their component bullets and factory ammo
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I used to get my cases from Israel, and my jacketed bullets from Speer (their 41 AE 180g Gold Dot) and Sierra (their 170g JHC intended for the 41 Magnum) and lead bullets everywhere as intended for the 41 Magnum.

Now cases are $2 each, and I still have a small stash of Gold Dots, and can still get Sierras and lead.
But them cases......
I think of all I left lay during USPSA and IDPA matches; oh the expensive horror!


I was 'factory 41 AE ammo' for quite a mass quantity ;)
 
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HINT, for anyone that didn't know. (I -did- know)
There is an active bot that runs in the background on TFL forums. :eek:

If you mention .41 AE in any discussion thread, a bat signal lights up the sky in Caspian Country and WESHOOT2 arrives on the scene in very short order! :D
 
Lot's of variables in that question...revolver vs. automatic, all steel vs. poly, availability, range gun, carry piece, hunting or target applications...the list goes on.

For overall use, filling all of those points, the .357 is far more useful. Great target accuracy with down loaded .357's or .38 Spl's., a revolver's superb trigger and overall simplicity, any sort of weight you can imagine from 20 oz. J-frames to 44 oz. full size N's, barrel lengths from 1-7/8" to 8-3/8 or more, and plenty of bullet styles for any suitable purpose, from target wadcutters to JHP's suitable for deer and black bear. And maybe the biggest plus, you can find ammunition most anywhere in the country, even with the current panic buying.

I don't think the 10mm can fulfill any of those points....but some will argue!

HTH's Rod
 
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