Who needs guns out in public? I know I don't.

No, I don't know Turner, but cut the height down to about 6'4" and the weight to about 265 lb. of muscle, as far as the anatomical anomalies go, that I'm gladly ignorant of, and the guy I described in the quote below is the closest I know to a real life Turner Brown.

nate45 said:
I have a friend who is very large. One time sparring in the ring, I hit him with my best right hook to the ribs. It knocked the wind out of him, he said good one and hit my left glove so hard that it hit me in the bridge of the nose and made me see stars, it wasn't full power either. He can grab the back of my belt with his right hand and my collar with his left and hold me straight out in front of him with my feet 2' off the ground. It would be very hard for me to stop him with a handgun and I have 30+ years of practice.
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I can out run him though. :)
 
I have a friend who is very large. One time sparring in the ring, I hit him with my best right hook to the ribs. It knocked the wind out of him, he said good one and hit my left glove so hard that it hit me in the bridge of the nose and made me see stars, it wasn't full power either. He can grab the back of my belt with his right hand and my collar with his left and hold me straight out in front of him with my feet 2' off the ground. It would be very hard for me to stop him with a handgun and I have 30+ years of practice.
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He might be big and strong, but he ain't bullet proof .... A service caliber handgun will stop any mortal man with a couple center hits, unless there is body armor to prevent penetration. No matter how big and bad somebody thinks they are, inadequate perfusion is invariably incapacitating.

You may not need a gun to wreak havoc in a kindergarten classroom ... hell the average limp wristed goth geek, given a ball bat and a locked door, could kill everybody in the room in 3-5 minutes .....it's the 110 lb. kindergarten teacher that needs the gun. If even your large friend shows up in class with murderous intentions, I have no doubt that a magazine full of supersonic jacketed hollow points directed by anybody with a modicum of skill would prevent any innocents being harmed.....
 
The teacher would need a Glock 19 and to be a good marksman minimum, missing is not an option and executing a Mozambique drill on a beast like that could very necessary, if someone that powerful were fully suicidally insane, or on PCP.

People have to use what they can effectively use cartridge wise, but I'd want deep penetrating fast and heavy bullets if I had to take something like that on. Even if he died, doesn't mean he still couldn't get a hold of you if he did. Lots of men and animals have killed people after they were already, technically dead.
 
Most of these guys off themselves at the first sign of armed resistance. A .22 or .25 pistol would do that. A 9mm or a .38 may do it better, but that's not the point -- having Rambo in each classroom it not practical*, that doesn't mean you might as well disarm all the teachers then because what's the use. And that seems to be what you are arguing.

*although if just by change you *have* Rambo already in one or two classrooms or in the office, why would you disarm him??
 
*although if just by chance you *have* Rambo already in one or two classrooms or in the office, why would you disarm him??
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You don't need Rambo. Anybody willing and capable of doing the necessary will suffice. There is not any shortage of bravery, as evidenced in this last incident: Staff confronted the nutter with empty hands. Brave, but foolish. It would have been so much better to have confronted him with an adequate weapon in hand.
 
Even today, at 68, one bad knee, . . . one bad shoulder, . . . bad ticker, . . . some heavy breathing problems at time, . . .

I still don't need a gun.

But I want one.

I have wanted one ever since I bought my first 1911 on the black market in downtown Saigon in 1966.

I wanted one when the bg's blew up the Victoria BOQ on Tran Hung Dao, about a mile from my BEQ.

I wanted one when I had to go into the bank (where I worked) in downtown Columbus, Ohio at 2:20 AM, . . . all too often.

I wanted one when there was a nut case shooting up cars off overpasses in Columbus a few years back.

I wanted one when we heard there was a jail break and cons were on the loose.

No don't need one, . . . but I wanted one, . . . so I bought one, . . . and I carry one, . . . hoping I'll never have to use it, . . .

May God bless,
Dwight
 
I'm not little or debilitated.
I'm not paranoid.
I could probably whoop some butt.
I'm not afraid.

But, their are some evil people in the world and when you meet one you might change your thinking.

I carry everywhere permitted by law. I may never need it, and I hope that I don't. Just like a first aid kit, spare tire and other stuff that you may not need but don't wanna get caught without.
 
To add to Nate's post...

He has a perfect example. I will use myself as well. I am a young guy, still in High School in fact. I am 6' 180 lbs. I have been practicing a martial art known as Kung Fu San Soo since I was 12. For those who don't know that that is, look at Krav Maga, and now take away the combat tactics. Pure street fighting.

The following is not bragging, just a few things I have learned. I know the most efficient way of breaking someone's neck, same with the various chokes used by other martial arts. I know just how much force it takes to collapse the *average* person's trachea. I know how to lock up and break every major joint on the body. The major nerve centers are easy targets for those who know where they are. The art is designed around ending the fight in under 10 seconds.

But here is the thing. I am also a teacher. One day when I was teaching, a kid asked me what to do when someone pulls a gun on you. It was a very intriguing question, so I asked my instructor. His response was this. "Run as fast as you possibly can." He had learned this from his master as well (long chain of instructors and higher instructors). This is a man that is now in his 50's and has been doing it since he was *I think* 5 years old. And remember, this art is pure street fighting.

My point is this: I, or someone like me, could be extremely dangerous in one on one encounter. But I have been taught, and I teach, that basically all the martial arts training in the world won't matter when the barrel is pointed at you.

Personally, I plan on getting my CCW as soon as I turn 21 (if I am a civilian). Hopefully I will be serving in the military at that point though, and I won't need one.
 
I'm a 48 year old male human being and I wouldn't need a gun for SD if there weren't any guns in society.
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Some of us are 70, do have ailments and no longer are capable of wrestling bad guys to the ground. If guns weren't invented we would have to invent them for the knife carrying, sword swinging axe chopping club bashing bad guy because we don't meet your high physical standards. It's not about guns but everybody having a right to defend themselves and old codgers and petite women cannot match you gorilla's. Got your point but we live in the real world where guns have been around for 13 centuries. That genie ain't going back into the bottle.
 
nate45,

I get the tenor of your OP; but I won't play the game of letting the government decide who needs what.

The 2nd Amendment is not about need. If we try to answer a question about who need guns; we have lost the meaning of the 2nd amendment.
 
I hope you're right Grumpy, but right now some are talking about extreme measures on guns. I hope we stay legally armed.

Not only would it be horrible for people to be unarmed, in the hypothetical no guns scenario, it would be really bad since there are 300,000,000+ firearms out there and criminals already have proved they don't care what the law is.

So in actual reality, not only would the elderly and size disadvantage have to worry about strong fit criminals, they'd have to worry about strong fit criminals with guns; While they the law abiding had none.
 
@Nate

Really liked your OP and I agree with you 100%. Let me walk that slightly back and say that I agree with you 98% because I also always carry a knife and have a large collection that I like to rotate as my EDC.

That's neither here nor there though and most people wouldn't have time to jab an attacker with a knife as self defense.

I don't carry a gun every single day, I know that's a bad habit, but sometimes I just don't feel like it but any attacker needs to watch out on the days that I'm carrying.

Great post and great point which I got loud and clear.
 
Guns have more reach then your legs or your arms. They also take less training to be effective. I won't fight someone like you. In fact, I haven't had a fist fight since I was in grade school.
 
No1der said:
Let me walk that slightly back and say that I agree with you 98% because I also always carry a knife and have a large collection that I like to rotate as my EDC.
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Knifes are scary and dangerous, a two inch blade with a rounded point is all anyone needs. Even long pointy kitchen knives should be banned. They serve no purpose and are only used to kill and maim by dangerous criminals. They are...wait for it... assault knifes!

No, seriously, at least in jolly old England.

Doctors' kitchen knives ban call

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/4581871.stm

A team from West Middlesex University Hospital said violent crime is on the increase - and kitchen knives are used in as many as half of all stabbings.

They argued many assaults are committed impulsively, prompted by alcohol and drugs, and a kitchen knife often makes an all too available weapon.

You see, when firearms are unavailable to common criminals, they use knifes, impact weapons, brute force, etc

So the solution of those who suggested bans on guns, is naturally, bans on knifes. We must child proof the world. How many kids have to be knifed, before we do something? Think of the children. :(
 
Personally, I plan on getting my CCW as soon as I turn 21 (if I am a civilian). Hopefully I will be serving in the military at that point though, and I won't need one.
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you'll probably need one eventually anyways
 
Fascinating thread. After reading the OP and this thread a couple of times, it seems to me that talking about how bad we are is not really Nate's point. He asserts that in a world where no one has guns the most physically capable are not as vulnerable as the rest of us, and in fact without guns we are at risk from these men who have the desire to do evil. It has always been so. All that it takes for evil to flourish is for good men to do nothing, or not be able to do anything to stop it.

I believe the best weapon we have is our mind, and the ability to avoid violent incidents. Sometimes that means walking or running away from trouble when everything in us wants to stay and fight. I also know that there are predators out there looking for prey, and the only protection we have is to arm ourselves to stop them. Depending on physical prowess, government, or anything else is not realistic.
 
Exactly K_Mac.

As a wise man once said, "people don't use weapons to fight with, they use them to win." The average, fit man doesn't need a weapon to win against most children, the elderly and women. That may sound sexist, ageist, or whatever, but its a fact. In a society without guns the vulnerable have almost no defense. It takes too much strength and skill, to use most any other weapon I can think of. Pepper spray, etc is of limited effectiveness in the face of the big baddies, just ask the police.

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When a psycho loon like this, jumps out with a big knife. I can take off running, because I'm fortunate enough not to be naturally slow, or handicapped. Running is basically all I could do too, empty handed, because he would gut me like a fish. That guy can run a pretty fast 20 yard dash too, he might catch me. I'd much rather pull out my PM9 and demonstrate the superiority of projectile weapons over edged.
 
I can't fight like I used to and have slowed down a lot. I do keep aware of my surroundings and try to steer clear of trouble.

I can't bench press 200 lbs but I can bench press a G30.
 
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