Mike Irwin
Staff
"Early-model Panzerfaust?"
Nope. Flame thrower. Trust me.
Nope. Flame thrower. Trust me.
What the heck
- Thread starter Ozzieman
- Start date
What the 25: Way to go Ulrice, you got that one and I am impressed.
#25 B.S.Petropavlovskogo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lHr1DA_-gOI Russan missle or anti tank
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ol0vRjEKItU
Published on Apr 20, 2014
The First Russian Rocket Launcher -- from 1931
The B.S.Petropavlovskogo is an Experimental Shoulder-Fired Recoilless Gun / Rocket Launcher designed in 1931 by Boris .S. Petropavlovskogo is the world's first Shoulder-fired Anti-Tank Weapons ever made. It pre-dated the Bazooka and Panzerfaust by 11 to 12 years. The designer Boris .S. Petropavlovskogo died of tuberculosis in 1933, and Project was cancelled and abandoned. Only 325 Launchers were ever made. Made from Light Alloys (Maybe Aluminum)
Source --
B.S.Petropavlovskogo from 1931 Experimental Shoulder-Fired Recoilless Gun -http://www.dogswar.ru/forum/viewtopic...
Boris .S. Petropavlovskogo - http://russianarmy.mybb.ru/viewtopic....
http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Fil...
http://deutsch.militaria.xooit.fr/t51...
#25 B.S.Petropavlovskogo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lHr1DA_-gOI Russan missle or anti tank
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ol0vRjEKItU
Published on Apr 20, 2014
The First Russian Rocket Launcher -- from 1931
The B.S.Petropavlovskogo is an Experimental Shoulder-Fired Recoilless Gun / Rocket Launcher designed in 1931 by Boris .S. Petropavlovskogo is the world's first Shoulder-fired Anti-Tank Weapons ever made. It pre-dated the Bazooka and Panzerfaust by 11 to 12 years. The designer Boris .S. Petropavlovskogo died of tuberculosis in 1933, and Project was cancelled and abandoned. Only 325 Launchers were ever made. Made from Light Alloys (Maybe Aluminum)
Source --
B.S.Petropavlovskogo from 1931 Experimental Shoulder-Fired Recoilless Gun -http://www.dogswar.ru/forum/viewtopic...
Boris .S. Petropavlovskogo - http://russianarmy.mybb.ru/viewtopic....
http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Fil...
http://deutsch.militaria.xooit.fr/t51...
Mike Irwin really close, so close you got it.
The attachment is one being held
A1 Einstossflammenwerfer 46 man portable flamethrower
1. Einstossflammenwerfer 46
The Einstossflammenwerfer 46 was a flamethrower designed in Germany during the second half of World War II and introduced in 1944; it was engineered to be both cheap and easily mass-produced. The disposable weapon fired a half-second burst of flame of up to 27 metres (89 ft). It was issued to the Volkssturm or the Werwolf movement, but also used by the Fallschirmjäger (German paratroopers).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Einstossflammenwerfer_46
The attachment is one being held
A1 Einstossflammenwerfer 46 man portable flamethrower
1. Einstossflammenwerfer 46
The Einstossflammenwerfer 46 was a flamethrower designed in Germany during the second half of World War II and introduced in 1944; it was engineered to be both cheap and easily mass-produced. The disposable weapon fired a half-second burst of flame of up to 27 metres (89 ft). It was issued to the Volkssturm or the Werwolf movement, but also used by the Fallschirmjäger (German paratroopers).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Einstossflammenwerfer_46
Attachments
DubC-Hicks
New member
Thats the Wimmersperg Spz-kr. Luckily enough, I came across this guy for the first time a couple weeks ago while doing some reading online. The Germans were developing it at the end of WW2 but didn't get it fielded in time.
Man that one went quick,,,,, 
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wimmersperg_Spz
C 5 Wimmersperg Spz-kr bullpup assault rifle
In the autumn of 1944 von Wimmersperg designed two types of simplified assault rifles chambered for the Polte short cartridge a long version and a short version-for which the drawings are held at the BWB/WTS in Koblenz. The captions identify the long version as the Spz-l, and the short version as the Spz-kr. The "Spz" is apparently an abbreviation of the code name Spielzeug (toy). The "1" stands for lange Bauart (long type), while "kr" stands for kurze Bauart mit Regler für Serienjeuer (short type with regulator for sustained fire).
Both the rifle and the compact carbines consist mainly of stamped parts, many recognisable as having been directly or indirectly derived from the Sten MkII MP. Both utilise the standard StG44 magazine and magazine catch, and StG44 barrel blanks. The receiver tubes are original Sten parts with a diameter of 35mm and a wall thickness of 2mm. The rear socket section of the two-piece turning bolt is a modified Sten component, and the operating handle, recoil spring, its housing and end cap assembly, with its method of affixing the butt stock, are standard Sten parts as specified in the relevant parts lists.
The gas port is positioned at the forward end of the barrel about 21cm (8.25") back from the muzzle. The gas piston, located on the right side of the barrel on a 60. diagonal to the vertical, led into a gas chamber inside the barrel jacket. The gas block enclosing the barrel held the gas regulator, configured as a spring-loaded pin by which the vent could be regulated or closed by means of the lever on top of' the gas block. Both short and long types have remov+able barrels, like the MP40. The rear end of the barrel is held by a barrel tube, which fitted into the fore end of the receiver tube and was held in position by the barrel nut. The rear part of the barrel tube served as a locking piece for the two-piece turning bolt, while the gas piston acted on the bolt head through cutouts in the barrel tube.
The Spz-1 and Spz-kr were hammer-fired, while the SPz-kv (kv standing for kurze Bauart mit Vcrshlußzündung; short type with bolt ignition; fig 160) fired from the closed bolt, actuated by the bolt socket. All were capable of single shot and sustained fire. Single-shot fire could be applied by pulling the trigger half way, while pulling the trigger further to the rear produced burst fire.
The firing system housing, some of the trigger components and the butt stock of the long version are very reminiscent of the MKII Sten, and the sights and general layout are conventional. Not so the com+pact carbine, whose action has been truncated into a "bullpup" configuration with a curved metal butt plate affixed directly to the end of the receiver tube (fig 159). A firing mechanism housing is fixed onto the underside of the receiver cylinder, with the trig+ger guard at its forward end and the magazine well following the rear part of the trigger guard, where an inserted StG44 magazine served as the pistol grip.
The sight axis on the carbine was about 50mm above the upper surface of the cylinder, whereon an appropriately located rear sight base of sheet metal was welded, slightly to the left of the longitudinal axis of the receiver. The upper part of the rear sight's side walls were provided at the rear with four vertically spaced rectangular steps, each representing 100m, so that the rear sight leaf could be raised or lowered. presumably by means of a sliding bar, to cover ranges from 100 to 400 metres. A metal dovetail bracket to accept the regular ZF4 scope mount was welded onto the right side of the carbine receiver, so as not to obstruct the rear iron sight. A rectangular front sight base, provided with a hood to protect the front sight blade, was welded onto the plain muzzle end of the barrel. The front sight blade on the Spz-1 version is a standard K98k part.
Two different firing mechanisms were proposed for the Spz-kv carbine, one with a more-or-less conventional hammer as used in the Spz-1 (fig 1581 and the later variant, produced in January, 1945. fitted with a spring-loaded rotating disk-like regulator with delay detents controlling a more forwardly positioned hammer.
No official documents dealing with the von Wimmersperg assault rifle exist, other than the drawings he made and signed himself It is quite possible that he made up these drawings for use by an armsmaking firm, as before the war he had been in negotiation with firms such as Mauser, Simson & Co, Fokker, etc, concerning the actual construction of his early self-loading rifle and machine gun prototypes.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wimmersperg_Spz
C 5 Wimmersperg Spz-kr bullpup assault rifle
In the autumn of 1944 von Wimmersperg designed two types of simplified assault rifles chambered for the Polte short cartridge a long version and a short version-for which the drawings are held at the BWB/WTS in Koblenz. The captions identify the long version as the Spz-l, and the short version as the Spz-kr. The "Spz" is apparently an abbreviation of the code name Spielzeug (toy). The "1" stands for lange Bauart (long type), while "kr" stands for kurze Bauart mit Regler für Serienjeuer (short type with regulator for sustained fire).
Both the rifle and the compact carbines consist mainly of stamped parts, many recognisable as having been directly or indirectly derived from the Sten MkII MP. Both utilise the standard StG44 magazine and magazine catch, and StG44 barrel blanks. The receiver tubes are original Sten parts with a diameter of 35mm and a wall thickness of 2mm. The rear socket section of the two-piece turning bolt is a modified Sten component, and the operating handle, recoil spring, its housing and end cap assembly, with its method of affixing the butt stock, are standard Sten parts as specified in the relevant parts lists.
The gas port is positioned at the forward end of the barrel about 21cm (8.25") back from the muzzle. The gas piston, located on the right side of the barrel on a 60. diagonal to the vertical, led into a gas chamber inside the barrel jacket. The gas block enclosing the barrel held the gas regulator, configured as a spring-loaded pin by which the vent could be regulated or closed by means of the lever on top of' the gas block. Both short and long types have remov+able barrels, like the MP40. The rear end of the barrel is held by a barrel tube, which fitted into the fore end of the receiver tube and was held in position by the barrel nut. The rear part of the barrel tube served as a locking piece for the two-piece turning bolt, while the gas piston acted on the bolt head through cutouts in the barrel tube.
The Spz-1 and Spz-kr were hammer-fired, while the SPz-kv (kv standing for kurze Bauart mit Vcrshlußzündung; short type with bolt ignition; fig 160) fired from the closed bolt, actuated by the bolt socket. All were capable of single shot and sustained fire. Single-shot fire could be applied by pulling the trigger half way, while pulling the trigger further to the rear produced burst fire.
The firing system housing, some of the trigger components and the butt stock of the long version are very reminiscent of the MKII Sten, and the sights and general layout are conventional. Not so the com+pact carbine, whose action has been truncated into a "bullpup" configuration with a curved metal butt plate affixed directly to the end of the receiver tube (fig 159). A firing mechanism housing is fixed onto the underside of the receiver cylinder, with the trig+ger guard at its forward end and the magazine well following the rear part of the trigger guard, where an inserted StG44 magazine served as the pistol grip.
The sight axis on the carbine was about 50mm above the upper surface of the cylinder, whereon an appropriately located rear sight base of sheet metal was welded, slightly to the left of the longitudinal axis of the receiver. The upper part of the rear sight's side walls were provided at the rear with four vertically spaced rectangular steps, each representing 100m, so that the rear sight leaf could be raised or lowered. presumably by means of a sliding bar, to cover ranges from 100 to 400 metres. A metal dovetail bracket to accept the regular ZF4 scope mount was welded onto the right side of the carbine receiver, so as not to obstruct the rear iron sight. A rectangular front sight base, provided with a hood to protect the front sight blade, was welded onto the plain muzzle end of the barrel. The front sight blade on the Spz-1 version is a standard K98k part.
Two different firing mechanisms were proposed for the Spz-kv carbine, one with a more-or-less conventional hammer as used in the Spz-1 (fig 1581 and the later variant, produced in January, 1945. fitted with a spring-loaded rotating disk-like regulator with delay detents controlling a more forwardly positioned hammer.
No official documents dealing with the von Wimmersperg assault rifle exist, other than the drawings he made and signed himself It is quite possible that he made up these drawings for use by an armsmaking firm, as before the war he had been in negotiation with firms such as Mauser, Simson & Co, Fokker, etc, concerning the actual construction of his early self-loading rifle and machine gun prototypes.
That big crank on the right side screams "Madsen light machine gun" to me, but the stock is wrong and the ammo box is not something normally associated with a Madsen....
A couple google searches later, it's evidently a Madsen designed to serve as a coax machine gun, the feeding mechanism was built into the ammo box...
So "Madsen coax machine gun" variant is my best guess.
Jimro
A couple google searches later, it's evidently a Madsen designed to serve as a coax machine gun, the feeding mechanism was built into the ammo box...
So "Madsen coax machine gun" variant is my best guess.
Jimro
Mike Irwin
Staff
I THINK that's a Madsen Model 1924/42.
After Germany invaded Norway, they took the Norwegian arms and issued them for local use (not an uncommon practice, German troops in France were often armed with Bethier and MAS 36 rifles and Hotchkiss machine guns).
One of the most interesting things they did was to redesign the Madsen to adapt it to a belt-fed gun, no small feat because of the very peculiar operation of the Madsen's action.
I have a book somewhere in my collection that describes the rework as beink akin to redesigning an elevator so that two cars could operate in one shaft and pass each other.
After Germany invaded Norway, they took the Norwegian arms and issued them for local use (not an uncommon practice, German troops in France were often armed with Bethier and MAS 36 rifles and Hotchkiss machine guns).
One of the most interesting things they did was to redesign the Madsen to adapt it to a belt-fed gun, no small feat because of the very peculiar operation of the Madsen's action.
I have a book somewhere in my collection that describes the rework as beink akin to redesigning an elevator so that two cars could operate in one shaft and pass each other.
Good one and yes it is a Madsen
This is one being fired
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kNV4pWy4EJU
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Madsen_machine_gun
The Madsen was a light machine gun that Julius A. Rasmussen and Theodor Schoubue designed and proposed for adoption by Captain Vilhelm Herman Oluf Madsen, the Danish Minister of War, and that the Danish Army adopted in 1902. It was the world's first true light machine gun produced in quantity. Consequently, Madsen was able to sell it in 12 different calibres to over 34 different countries worldwide, where it saw extensive combat for over 100 years.[3][4] The Madsen was produced by Compagnie Madsen A/S (later operating as Dansk Rekyl Riffel Syndikat A/S and then Dansk Industri Syndikat A/S).
The design dates to 1880s with the Danish Forsøgsrekylgevær (Self Loading rifle M.1888), meaning "trial recoil rifle", being a precursor design. In 1883 Captain Vilhelm Herman Oluf Madsen (a Danish artillery officer), and Rustmester Rasmussen (a weapons technician at the Danish Arsenal), began working on a recoil-operated self-loading rifle; Madsen developed the idea and Rasmussen fabricated the actual weapons. The rifle used a non-removable stripper clip that used gravity to feed rounds to the action; when the gun was not in use one could fold the clip down to cover the opening. The rifle used the 8×58RD cartridge, first in black-powder and then in a much more powerful smokeless powder version. The design was not successful. An improved design in 1896 gave the rifle an enclosed, but still gravity-fed, magazine. This version saw some 50–60 rifles being produced, but they were only issued to the Danish navy for use by coastal fortifications troops.
Investors formed a company (the Dansk Riffel Syndikat; DRS), in 1898 to commercialise the rifle, and bought the patent rights from Madsen and Rasmussen in exchange for royalties on future production. By this time Madsen had left the project to become Minister of Defence in Denmark. In 1899 Lieutenant Jens Schouboe became the manager for the DRS, and a number of subsequent patents bear his name. Consequently, the Madsen rifle is sometimes referred to as the Schouboe rifle. In 1901 he patented the design for the Madsen machine gun. The original Madsen machine guns used black-powder cartridges that quickly jammed the action. However, once the design was tried with 6.5mm smokeless powder rounds it worked well.
The Madsen has a rather sophisticated and unique operating cycle. The machine gun uses a mixed recoil-operated locking system with a hinged bolt that is patterned after the lever-action Peabody Martini breechblock.[3] The recoil operation is part short and part long recoil. After firing a round, the initial recoil impulse drives the barrel, barrel extension, and bolt to the rear. A pin on the right side of the bolt moves backward in grooves in an operating cam plate mounted to the right side of the receiver. After 12.7 mm (0.5 in) of travel, the bolt is cammed upward, away from the breech (the "short" portion of the recoil system). The barrel and barrel extension continue to move rearward to a point slightly exceeding the combined overall length of the cartridge case and projectile (the long portion of the recoil system, responsible for the weapon's low rate of fire).
After the breech is exposed, an odd lever-type extractor/ejector, mounted under the barrel, pivots to the rear, extracts the empty case, and ejects it through the bottom of the receiver. The bolt's operating cam then forces the bolt face to pivot downward, aligning a cartridge feed groove in the left side of the bolt with the chamber. While the bolt and barrel are returning forward, a cartridge-rammer lever, mounted on the barrel extension, pivots forward, loading a fresh cartridge.
This is one being fired
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kNV4pWy4EJU
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Madsen_machine_gun
The Madsen was a light machine gun that Julius A. Rasmussen and Theodor Schoubue designed and proposed for adoption by Captain Vilhelm Herman Oluf Madsen, the Danish Minister of War, and that the Danish Army adopted in 1902. It was the world's first true light machine gun produced in quantity. Consequently, Madsen was able to sell it in 12 different calibres to over 34 different countries worldwide, where it saw extensive combat for over 100 years.[3][4] The Madsen was produced by Compagnie Madsen A/S (later operating as Dansk Rekyl Riffel Syndikat A/S and then Dansk Industri Syndikat A/S).
The design dates to 1880s with the Danish Forsøgsrekylgevær (Self Loading rifle M.1888), meaning "trial recoil rifle", being a precursor design. In 1883 Captain Vilhelm Herman Oluf Madsen (a Danish artillery officer), and Rustmester Rasmussen (a weapons technician at the Danish Arsenal), began working on a recoil-operated self-loading rifle; Madsen developed the idea and Rasmussen fabricated the actual weapons. The rifle used a non-removable stripper clip that used gravity to feed rounds to the action; when the gun was not in use one could fold the clip down to cover the opening. The rifle used the 8×58RD cartridge, first in black-powder and then in a much more powerful smokeless powder version. The design was not successful. An improved design in 1896 gave the rifle an enclosed, but still gravity-fed, magazine. This version saw some 50–60 rifles being produced, but they were only issued to the Danish navy for use by coastal fortifications troops.
Investors formed a company (the Dansk Riffel Syndikat; DRS), in 1898 to commercialise the rifle, and bought the patent rights from Madsen and Rasmussen in exchange for royalties on future production. By this time Madsen had left the project to become Minister of Defence in Denmark. In 1899 Lieutenant Jens Schouboe became the manager for the DRS, and a number of subsequent patents bear his name. Consequently, the Madsen rifle is sometimes referred to as the Schouboe rifle. In 1901 he patented the design for the Madsen machine gun. The original Madsen machine guns used black-powder cartridges that quickly jammed the action. However, once the design was tried with 6.5mm smokeless powder rounds it worked well.
The Madsen has a rather sophisticated and unique operating cycle. The machine gun uses a mixed recoil-operated locking system with a hinged bolt that is patterned after the lever-action Peabody Martini breechblock.[3] The recoil operation is part short and part long recoil. After firing a round, the initial recoil impulse drives the barrel, barrel extension, and bolt to the rear. A pin on the right side of the bolt moves backward in grooves in an operating cam plate mounted to the right side of the receiver. After 12.7 mm (0.5 in) of travel, the bolt is cammed upward, away from the breech (the "short" portion of the recoil system). The barrel and barrel extension continue to move rearward to a point slightly exceeding the combined overall length of the cartridge case and projectile (the long portion of the recoil system, responsible for the weapon's low rate of fire).
After the breech is exposed, an odd lever-type extractor/ejector, mounted under the barrel, pivots to the rear, extracts the empty case, and ejects it through the bottom of the receiver. The bolt's operating cam then forces the bolt face to pivot downward, aligning a cartridge feed groove in the left side of the bolt with the chamber. While the bolt and barrel are returning forward, a cartridge-rammer lever, mounted on the barrel extension, pivots forward, loading a fresh cartridge.
Mike Irwin
Staff
No, no no... that's an interrupter style toilet flow valve...
That one's a new one on me.
That one's a new one on me.
Jimro I am sorry but you are WRONG
Mike (staff) in fact had it right.
It is a an interrupter style toilet flow valve...
But it can be used as a
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EMP_44
ERMA Model 1944
The EMP 44 fires from an open bolt. The caliber is 9×19mm Parabellum. The length of the gun is 892–950 mm depending on stock position. The barrel length is either 250 or 308 mm long. Its rate of fire is 500 rounds per minute and has sliding two 32-round MP 40 magazine wells. The practical range was 150–200 meters.
The gun was crudely assembled with a stock made of pipes welded together. This was part of its design philosophy for the weapon was created in response to the requirements of the Primitiv-Waffen-Programm, more or less in an attempt to imitate the British Sten gun and to a lesser extent the PPSh-41. Ultimately, its crude looking design was what made it to be rejected by the German army.
The gun was probably designed in 1942, with the sole exemplar known having serial number 15, and having February 1943 as its manufacture date. One theory as to fate of the prototypes is that most were cannibalized for their dual feed mechanism which was then installed on MP40/I.
History
The wide use of submachine guns by the German armed forces in the Second World War led to a strong dependence on the industrial capacity of arms factories that brought out simplified designs at lower production costs. In 1944, Erma, the main MP 40 producer submitted the EMP 44. The receiver was produced out of welded steel tubing like the Sten. The flash suppressor was formed in the same manner as the Russian machine pistol PPS-43 muzzle brake from stamped steel. The EMP 44 was rejected due to its failure to pass acceptance tests, but mainly because new weapons like the MP 44/STG 44 were already produced with the goal to replace both the MP 40 and the Karabiner 98k.
Mike (staff) in fact had it right.
It is a an interrupter style toilet flow valve...
But it can be used as a
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EMP_44
ERMA Model 1944
The EMP 44 fires from an open bolt. The caliber is 9×19mm Parabellum. The length of the gun is 892–950 mm depending on stock position. The barrel length is either 250 or 308 mm long. Its rate of fire is 500 rounds per minute and has sliding two 32-round MP 40 magazine wells. The practical range was 150–200 meters.
The gun was crudely assembled with a stock made of pipes welded together. This was part of its design philosophy for the weapon was created in response to the requirements of the Primitiv-Waffen-Programm, more or less in an attempt to imitate the British Sten gun and to a lesser extent the PPSh-41. Ultimately, its crude looking design was what made it to be rejected by the German army.
The gun was probably designed in 1942, with the sole exemplar known having serial number 15, and having February 1943 as its manufacture date. One theory as to fate of the prototypes is that most were cannibalized for their dual feed mechanism which was then installed on MP40/I.
History
The wide use of submachine guns by the German armed forces in the Second World War led to a strong dependence on the industrial capacity of arms factories that brought out simplified designs at lower production costs. In 1944, Erma, the main MP 40 producer submitted the EMP 44. The receiver was produced out of welded steel tubing like the Sten. The flash suppressor was formed in the same manner as the Russian machine pistol PPS-43 muzzle brake from stamped steel. The EMP 44 was rejected due to its failure to pass acceptance tests, but mainly because new weapons like the MP 44/STG 44 were already produced with the goal to replace both the MP 40 and the Karabiner 98k.
Last edited:
Mike Irwin
Staff
Hum...
I want to say another German Volks weapon, but it looks too finished...
So, I'm going to say... one of the competitors, or perhaps even an early version, of the MP43/Stg 44?
Then again.... that rear sight looks a lot like the Thompson M2 sight, and unlike anything the Germans used...
Huh....
I'm stumped.
I want to say another German Volks weapon, but it looks too finished...
So, I'm going to say... one of the competitors, or perhaps even an early version, of the MP43/Stg 44?
Then again.... that rear sight looks a lot like the Thompson M2 sight, and unlike anything the Germans used...
Huh....
I'm stumped.
mapsjanhere
New member
The grip section screams Colt to me, doesn't look like anything the Germans designed.
seeker_two
New member
Mag well is too short for a rifle round. Some type of .30 Carbine?
DubC-Hicks
New member
It's the Hyde carbine. They used .30 carbine, an MG42 style removable barrel, and the Thompson style receiver and selectors. I think only a couple exist in the world. No one wanted an SMG as heavy as it was. The all steel heavy Thompson style receiver was heavy enough, the removable barrel just added weight.
If only it was designed like the M3 Grease Gun, but in .30 carbine. I think it would've been a bit more successful being lighter, in a more potent caliber than .45.
If only it was designed like the M3 Grease Gun, but in .30 carbine. I think it would've been a bit more successful being lighter, in a more potent caliber than .45.