What do you YELL!

Waiting for your chance to KILL someone?

Hey, please, go back and re-read this thread from this point.

If you have reason to draw, you have reason to SHOOT, so why talk. KILL him! Guy with a knife is dangerous, so KILL HIM!

The original premise of this thread is a good one. Decide NOW what you're going to yell - - Have a plan. If you MUST shoot, you'll know it at the time. But at least allow for the possibility that the situation does NOT call for a killing.

Yeah, I've practiced the Tuller Drill; I know "The Magic Circle" or whatever they call it nowadays. I am NOT squeamish at the idea of shooting when I must. I just prefer to wait until that time. Waiting for the "GOTTA DO IT!" time is what sets us apart from the criminals, from the predators-upon- society . . . from the murderers.

Think about it, huh?

Johnny
 
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He also asked for what he should yell (if anything) for bystanders present. I know that if I was behind some dude who pulled a gun without saying something like "stop" or "drop it" , I might act like the crazy hero and tackle the good guy because I would think they were doing a shooting rampage. Shouting something, if there is time to do so like in that particular mall situation that actually happened, would also provide bystanders that extra second to either keep from walking in front of you, or have a chance to duck if they are close to the line of fire. I honestly don't think it was a question from someone with a lack of confidence at all, but I agree with Jonny G. that it is one for preparation and having a plan.
 
Just my opinions Daniel964, you guys do what you want, I really don't care. It is better talking about it on here first, before doing it in the streets. Its just funny to me that so much time is spent speculating on hypothetical situations. Things can happen if you carry or not, I just don't live life on the paranoid side, although I am very careful. My family thinks I am too careful and neurotic about safety, I laugh when reading a lot of this stuff because they'd think I was insane living on Long Island and thinking like this. Of course in remote areas things are different, but a lot of you are playing cowboy, go on, have fun, just don't get yourself killed or incarcerated.
 
"STOP! POLICE!" Shouted while drawing.

If the bad guy somehow hears the command, reacts to it, and complies in the 1.5-or-so seconds it takes me to draw and fire, then good on him. He can consider himself lucky.

If I do have to shoot him, maybe the shout will have thrown him off. Or perhaps the witnesses remembering the verbal command may help out in the post-shooting legal drama. I can't see it making anything worse.

Oh, the "POLICE!" bit is me calling for the Police in the same breath. If the bad guy misinterprets me and stops what he was doing any faster for it, well, that's just one of life's little bonuses.

- Chris
 
I don't know about saying "police". In some states it may be considered impersonating a police officer. Now if you say "I'm placing you under arrest" (or something like it but quicker) then there would be less of a problem with that because as a citizens in some (all or most?) states we can make a citizen's arrest.
 
Alright PythonGuy, let me put it a different way. In Md if you identify yourself as a police officer and you are not, you have commited a crime.
Common perception of the phrase "Stop Police" is that the person yelling it is a police officer.
Since it is law to help a police officer in an arrest that asks for it, people hearing this might feel compelled to endanger themselves helping the person who had no authority to ask them (as a DA would argue whether the argument is right or not)
Having people endanger themselves in such a situation may be viewed (by a DA) as tantamount to yelling "Fire!" in a crowded theater.

Citizen arrests are legal in my state and if you are performing a citizen's arrest without saying something that may be viewed as impersonating an LEO, then these legal problems would be avoided IMHO if there was a local, overzealous, District Attorney (which is all too comon in Md where the origional mall incident occured) looking at the case.
 
O.K. I just saw the mall story everyone is referring to.

I'd say a "Drop it!", with gun drawn should do it. If that doesn't work, a hip shot would hopefully immobilize the attacker. Hopefully, a bullet that didn't expand immediately in the attacker might fragment on the floor.

If there's people behind the attacker after yelling "drop it" and presenting a pistol, I would have a hard time shooting until it came down to getting stabbed myself.

Tough decisions... I hope I never have to.
 
The guys who say you don't have to say a thing if deadly force is justifiable are right. But I like the added legal padding that comes form acting more reasonably than I have to...

A little thing that's nice about yelling "Stop. Police!" is that witnesses who see you don't look like a police officer often hear it as "Stop, please!" Something to do with auditory exclusion....

But I still gravitate to the "Stop. Don't move. Don't make me shoot you." type stuff. Even when I wear a badge. Just believe in commands that might be obeyed - identification is above the shirt pocket when I work and I'll verbally identify later. While off - I don't care it he looks for it or not, I'm in charge of my life and the situation and he's about to find that out. In short, he'll obey or be shot, and like ChristopherII said, maybe both if he ain't quick about it.

The ol' adage - you'll fall back on trainning applies here. Do we practice a command/yell enough while practicing? I'll bet not - probably gonna be "Squeak!" in a fight or die situation... :eek:
 
PythonGuy,

Perhaps you should read the IF AND statements before you answer the post by insulting the character of the poster.

I think 99% of the folks here know what to do in an obvious situation - BG threatening your life / family and clean backstop - you shoot. The point of the post is - this is NOT one of those situations.

Better to ask the opinions of the learned folks here than to experience it in person and NOT have a plan. Its not paranoia, its just being prepared in my book.

If you READ Chris in VA's post about a woman attacking someone at the mall - with a knife and walking away - if that FBI agent was not there and YOU were, I guess your only choices are to blast her or to run away. Good luck with both - I prefer alternative choices.

Hence the post. Its the smart thing to do.
 
Firstly, if he had a gun out and was drawing a bead on me if you draw you need to take him out and say nothing.

Otherwise 'freeze' or something simple to get his attention.

If he has not got a gun out and you are not in a situation of facing lethal force I am a bit concerned about the fact that you have your gun out. You are going to have a tough time justifying it if he is not armed....
 
Lawyer Daggit,
The story he was referring to was a possible crazy woman who had a large kitchen knife and just stabbed two people on two different floors of the mall. The FBI agent was some distance away and there were still many bystanders in the vicinity who had not realised that the blood curdling screams was anything other than a cat fight between two women. No gun in this situation except for the FBI guy. He was asking what should be done in a similar circumstance if we were in the FBI agent's shoes and we were not an LEO. At least I am almost positive that that was what he was asking.
 
I would say... awww $%&# it... it doesn't matter what I'd say, because the sound of my gun firing will be drowning it out anyways.
 
If you yell police some bad things could happen to you --- liest of which would be being in trouble with the law --- yelling police might make others less likely to pitch in and help you, and might make them not call the real police figuring you alredy got it covered.

If this is going to be about a specific incident, my vote would be start a thread based on that particular scnario as it would be easier to lay all that out than to have assumptons being made since clearly the posibilites range from a lot of words exchanged to zero depending on distance / wepon / mindset / location etc....
 
Fair?? Is it "fair" for some scumbag to pull a knife on you???

:D
Ya, I guess if he has a knife, I'd better just pull my knife. You know, be a man, make it fair.
Click to expand...

Sorry, but IMHO the above is a response "of questionable wisdom." A knife can maim, cripple or kill just like a gun can. If you draw a knife, you are asking to either get hurt, killed or arrested as a mutual combatant in a felony knife fight.

As far as "making it fair," the thug made it unfair when he pulled a knife on you. As one of the Marine's rules of gunfighting says, "Always cheat; always win." IMO, the only "fair" fight is the one that the intended victim wins. Let's be clear here: WE ARE TALKING ABOUT A MATTER OF LIFE AND DEATH. - win any way you can. Read Bill Jordan's book, "No Second Place Winner."

As far as "being a man," be man enough to do whatever it takes to survive and win, period. The thug who pulled the knife started this - he set the rules, not you. And ALWAYS bring a gun to a knife fight!
 
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