UCLA Student Tased: Justifiable?
- Thread starter Heist
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According to news reports they were using actual tasers in drive-stun mode. The drive-stun mode is when the taser is basically used as a contact stun gun. It does not have the same effect as shooting the barbs into someone and zapping them, and only causes localized pain in the area that taser is pressed against. The taser is not designed to incapacitate when used in that manner... it basically becomes a glorified "cattle prod".
old 12 gauge
Moderator
personally, i thought the cops were a couple of gutless nazie wanna bes.
I've had to go in bars and break up many fights and bring people out, i never needed a tazer or had to use a club. so many times now i see 8 or even 10 cops jumping on one person and feeling good about it. the guy was right about the patroit act, the American people have lost most of their rights and it will be too late when they wake up.. that's what happened in Germany, 60 million people just went along with the program and when they woke up and found them selves under Hitlers thumb.
I think the cops went in there scared and figured they had better use the taser to keep from getting hurt and to keep the other students a bay.
I've had to go in bars and break up many fights and bring people out, i never needed a tazer or had to use a club. so many times now i see 8 or even 10 cops jumping on one person and feeling good about it. the guy was right about the patroit act, the American people have lost most of their rights and it will be too late when they wake up.. that's what happened in Germany, 60 million people just went along with the program and when they woke up and found them selves under Hitlers thumb.
I think the cops went in there scared and figured they had better use the taser to keep from getting hurt and to keep the other students a bay.
old 12 gauge
Moderator
deleted
Use of force is covered under state laws and departmental policies. If the officers followed the law and policy they will be ok. If they deviated from those there could be some fallout. Hopefully that department has a training officer who trained them in the proper use of that piece of equipment.
So far I the print versions of each story had some variance in them. The camera work was shoddy, I can hear them talking but not what is going on 100% of the time. I will be interested to see the outcome of the review.
So far I the print versions of each story had some variance in them. The camera work was shoddy, I can hear them talking but not what is going on 100% of the time. I will be interested to see the outcome of the review.
I was very disturbed by this.
I have been actively following taser abuse for the last few years and i believe law enforcement really needs more regulation on using a taser and more common sense.
I have seen videos or read articles on police tasering a granny, on a 6 year old boy in florida, on a man in a wheel chair, on a 7 year old girl who was talking back to a school teacher, a women in Boyton Beach who refused to get our of her car during a speeding ticket etc. etc.
All in all, i have read or watched hundreds cases of police taser abuse. And police just think its no big deal.
I have seen pictures of beautiful women who have been permanently scarred by the taser prongs, i have seen pictures of people who seriously injuried themselves by hitting their head on the railing after being tasered etc.
What disturbs me most is that Police Officers are too lazy to use their training of restraining people. Instead they look at a Taser like a TV Remote Control.
Yeah you might think its harsh. But, i have seen a lot of video clips of two or more cops tasering someone (child, elderly, women etc) when they could have tried to restrain that person first.
I mean, did they really need to taser a 6 year old boy when there were two police officers there?
I have also seen police taser handcuffed people too.
I am a serious advocate against tasers and believe the law enforcement officers who have tasered someone, resulting in their death, should be sentenced to prison!
I believe a taser should be the choice right before using a firearm, not as a first response to a situation.
As for this situation, there were several police officers i counted in that video. You mean to tell me that several police officers couldnt handle a college student?
They could have also tried pepper spray which some find to be safer then the taser.
And further more, the teen was leaving, why do cops have to believe they have a right to touch a citizen.
The problem i see with many law enforcement officers is "power" and "god". They have control issues and that might explain why there is a high level of domestic battery among police officers.
Im not saying all cops are bad, most of my family are police officers. But, i believe we need more oversight on police officers, we need laws that ensure Citizens are "Innocent until proven guilty" and we need police departments to go through major reform.
Anyways, thats my two cents...
I have been actively following taser abuse for the last few years and i believe law enforcement really needs more regulation on using a taser and more common sense.
I have seen videos or read articles on police tasering a granny, on a 6 year old boy in florida, on a man in a wheel chair, on a 7 year old girl who was talking back to a school teacher, a women in Boyton Beach who refused to get our of her car during a speeding ticket etc. etc.
All in all, i have read or watched hundreds cases of police taser abuse. And police just think its no big deal.
I have seen pictures of beautiful women who have been permanently scarred by the taser prongs, i have seen pictures of people who seriously injuried themselves by hitting their head on the railing after being tasered etc.
What disturbs me most is that Police Officers are too lazy to use their training of restraining people. Instead they look at a Taser like a TV Remote Control.
Yeah you might think its harsh. But, i have seen a lot of video clips of two or more cops tasering someone (child, elderly, women etc) when they could have tried to restrain that person first.
I mean, did they really need to taser a 6 year old boy when there were two police officers there?
I have also seen police taser handcuffed people too.
I am a serious advocate against tasers and believe the law enforcement officers who have tasered someone, resulting in their death, should be sentenced to prison!
I believe a taser should be the choice right before using a firearm, not as a first response to a situation.
As for this situation, there were several police officers i counted in that video. You mean to tell me that several police officers couldnt handle a college student?
They could have also tried pepper spray which some find to be safer then the taser.
And further more, the teen was leaving, why do cops have to believe they have a right to touch a citizen.
The problem i see with many law enforcement officers is "power" and "god". They have control issues and that might explain why there is a high level of domestic battery among police officers.
Im not saying all cops are bad, most of my family are police officers. But, i believe we need more oversight on police officers, we need laws that ensure Citizens are "Innocent until proven guilty" and we need police departments to go through major reform.
Anyways, thats my two cents...
In response to:
Taser policies are being challenged across the entire United States. There are pending legal cases against counties, states, cities, police departments and the individual police officers and policy authors. And its not just the United States, lawsuits are turning up all over the world and many organizations on human rights are strongly against tasers.
The beauty of US Law is that while we might not be able to file criminal charges against a police officer who has followed department policies, we can file individual civil lawsuits against all those said individuals. Sure, we might not win every case, but we will hurt them at least from attorney fee's.
In any event, i am not saying get rid of the taser, just we need more training, more education, more laws and more objective policies that ensure citizen rights above all!
Taser policies are being challenged across the entire United States. There are pending legal cases against counties, states, cities, police departments and the individual police officers and policy authors. And its not just the United States, lawsuits are turning up all over the world and many organizations on human rights are strongly against tasers.
The beauty of US Law is that while we might not be able to file criminal charges against a police officer who has followed department policies, we can file individual civil lawsuits against all those said individuals. Sure, we might not win every case, but we will hurt them at least from attorney fee's.
In any event, i am not saying get rid of the taser, just we need more training, more education, more laws and more objective policies that ensure citizen rights above all!
That is the way the legal system is supposed to work.......The main gist of what I was saying is that if the officers followed the law and the policy, the governmental unit to which they belong is going to bear the brunt of the legal system. If the officers failed to follow the law and departmental policy then they are on the chopping block.
I have a great idea, every time the officer gets his taser for the day he can either get tased right then or he can get tased for every time he used it.
They had some cop in Orlando a year ago who had tased a 5 year old boy for misbehaving at his first day at school. The kid spent like two days at the hospital. Another guy in the same city had used his 1700 times in his first nine months of having it.
If I had been tased like in the video and the next week I saw a cop being beaten to death I would have a hard time stopping to help him.
Tasers may be useful, but every time one is used on a non-criminal public support of the police drops a bit more. And public support is about the only thing that they have going for them. Being hated by every single person is not going to help you survive your day of work.
They had some cop in Orlando a year ago who had tased a 5 year old boy for misbehaving at his first day at school. The kid spent like two days at the hospital. Another guy in the same city had used his 1700 times in his first nine months of having it.
If I had been tased like in the video and the next week I saw a cop being beaten to death I would have a hard time stopping to help him.
Tasers may be useful, but every time one is used on a non-criminal public support of the police drops a bit more. And public support is about the only thing that they have going for them. Being hated by every single person is not going to help you survive your day of work.
How bout the kid that just died from being tasered.
He was suffering a nervous breakdown carrying a bible and crying "I WANT JESUS"
Instead he got a dose of taser ... obviously a very large one , and died in the hospital.
It's not a command remote control ... it's a WEAPON for less likely lethal self defense.
He was suffering a nervous breakdown carrying a bible and crying "I WANT JESUS"
Instead he got a dose of taser ... obviously a very large one , and died in the hospital.
It's not a command remote control ... it's a WEAPON for less likely lethal self defense.
Im sure, him being a teenager, he probably made a fuss about having to leave because he forgot his student ID.
How many times have you gone to blockbuster or the gym and forgot your membership card? How many times have you gone to work and forgot your photo ID badge? Most businesses recognize this and they have established policies to validate a persons ID instead of sending them home. Many companies with ID badges will have a temporary badge for the employee to use after they verify their employment status using the Access Control System or another method. The gym or blockbuster store will look your name up in their computer system etc.
So i think UCLA failed here. They had no way to validate a student except by the student ID. My college police have palm pilots that have a database which lists the students info and a photo. Its a relatively cheap thing to implement. They also had a barcode scanner thing attached to it to scan vehicle stickers to identify the owners too. But, it could have been as simple as calling the main security control center and having them look up the students name in a database. Simple solution!
As for who says he..... Well there were over 60 witnesses who said the student was walking toward the exit when the officer "grabbed" the student by the arm and said "show me ID". He didnt tell the student to stop or come here, instead he grabbed the student first.
This is a common problem with police officers and a breach of constitutional law. There is a video on Youtube here <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3NmC5wHfCdM">Surviving Police Encounters</a> which brilliantly shows how law enforcement as standard policy try to overcome your constitutional protections. It goes into detail about what cops can and cant due and the laws behind it (the three scenarios cover vehicle stop, being confronted while in a public place and a few other scenarios). Many attorneys have indicated the police breached the students constitutional rights by grabbing him the way they did and that it would be considered a form of assault by the police officer.
But, your right that homeless guys do occupy the city libraries, i even have seen some with free websites LOL. But, in this case its a student who forgot his ID and was there to work late on a school-related assignment.
Key points:
1. People forget ID's
2. UCLA needs guidelines for verifying students who forget ID's.
3. Is Tasing a person for no ID justified as reasonable force?
4. As the news said, they do this every night at that time, so obviously ID isnt working if people keep getting caught, so why not start an educational program creating awareness on wearing your ID badge? If my company can have a poster reminding employees to wear their ID, then why doesnt UCLA?
Lastly, Enforcement is just part of the equation. We have plenty of laws on the books and plenty of people enforcing them. But, very few people who are educating society on these laws. UCLA needs to focus on awareness and education first!
Personally, i think when police arrived and saw the student leaving, they should have ended right there. But, no, the cops have to be all authoritarian and grab the student and say "show me id". Thats where i think police are sometimes stupid. They took a little situation and turned it into world news. This story has hit every major newspaper around the world, we even hear the President Amijad of Iran now talking about how the US abuses muslims etc.
In short, i feel the police officers in this situaiton should be fired. Not for abuse of power, but for how they handled the situation. They took a small event and turned it into a major issue for a stupid reason, no ID.