Simple answer, I call a 223 a 223, a 22-250 a 22-250 etc. When buying ammo I would advise the buyer to not just just assume all 22's are the same. I would guess a reporter would not just lump all of the 22 calibers together and would at least try correct identification. If the correct identification is not known, call it a small caliber. Growing up a 22 meant 22lr. Guess times have changed.
Trump Shot on Campaign.
- Thread starter Jim Watson
- Start date
In the "gun culture" and absent context, when someone says "a .22" we usually think of a .22 rimfire. Because we, generally speaking, use an actual cartridge name when we are talking about one.
The press, generally doesn't, and sometimes doesn't even know the difference, or care.
In this case, with the context of it being an "AR style" rifle and a 150yd range and the intent to shoot a person, its quite unlikely it was a .22LR, but not impossible, as there are AR style .22lr out there.
As time goes on more and more details are being released. One I heard today was that the father legally purchased the rifle, in 2013.
SO this was not a new purchase, and, apparently all laws were complied with. Over a decade ago......
Like it or not, things are going to change (again) now. Which ways, and how much is yet to be seen.
The press, generally doesn't, and sometimes doesn't even know the difference, or care.
In this case, with the context of it being an "AR style" rifle and a 150yd range and the intent to shoot a person, its quite unlikely it was a .22LR, but not impossible, as there are AR style .22lr out there.
As time goes on more and more details are being released. One I heard today was that the father legally purchased the rifle, in 2013.
SO this was not a new purchase, and, apparently all laws were complied with. Over a decade ago......
Like it or not, things are going to change (again) now. Which ways, and how much is yet to be seen.
And I am afraid you nailed it. The press reports on way too much that they do not know or understand. I guess there is a lot of pressure on being the first to report anything, facts be damned. I thank God Trump is alive and well
it could have been so different. I hope this near disaster can somehow bring this country together.
Aguila Blanca
Staff
And I read that the father had purchased the rifle -- legally - six months ago.44 AMP said:
Stay tuned ...
The shooter could have legally bought it himself, so not really any big news there, one way or the other.
The quote I believe you are referring to says "at least 6 months ago".
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...ump-shooting-gunman-father-ar-15/74401175007/
"The Associated Press, citing law enforcement sources, reported the rifle was purchased by Matthew Crooks <the father> at least six months ago."
Here's another source.
https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/tru...fbi-names-pennsylvania-man/story?id=111921870
"The firearm recovered at the scene was legally purchased by the suspect's father, an urgent trace conducted by ATF found, according to multiple law enforcement sources. A source who has been briefed said the gun was an AR-15 style rifle that was purchased in 2013."
The quote I believe you are referring to says "at least 6 months ago".
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news...ump-shooting-gunman-father-ar-15/74401175007/
"The Associated Press, citing law enforcement sources, reported the rifle was purchased by Matthew Crooks <the father> at least six months ago."
Here's another source.
https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/tru...fbi-names-pennsylvania-man/story?id=111921870
"The firearm recovered at the scene was legally purchased by the suspect's father, an urgent trace conducted by ATF found, according to multiple law enforcement sources. A source who has been briefed said the gun was an AR-15 style rifle that was purchased in 2013."
armoredman
New member
So....now we will have a ten year waiting period to buy ARs? Or twenty? Like buying a car in the old Soviet Union...
In all seriousness, I wonder how much this will affect President Trump's thinking on firearms.
In all seriousness, I wonder how much this will affect President Trump's thinking on firearms.
The Verminator
Moderator
Easy to answer.
The shooting will have ZERO effect on Trump's thinking on firearms.
He never displays his thinking--he only reflects the feelings of his base support.
And we know better than most how they feel about firearms.
The Verminator
Moderator
Trump may have been hit in the ear........but only because of a tiny twist of fate.
He had been facing forward.
The shot came at an angle from his right.
As the trigger was pulled--Trump turned his head to look to his right--and that changed the angle just enough that the bullet did not contact his skull.
If it had hit his skull with even slight contact.......the .223 would disrupt a significant area and put bone fragments into his brain even if the bullet itself did not contact the brain.
History would have taken a detour.
He had been facing forward.
The shot came at an angle from his right.
As the trigger was pulled--Trump turned his head to look to his right--and that changed the angle just enough that the bullet did not contact his skull.
If it had hit his skull with even slight contact.......the .223 would disrupt a significant area and put bone fragments into his brain even if the bullet itself did not contact the brain.
History would have taken a detour.
I think this WILL have an effect on AWB’s under Trump. He already ordered the ATF to ban bumpstocks. This proves he can be swayed to negatively impact 2A rights.
Now, HE has been shot with an AR, other people shot right in front of him. I cant see that not having a negative impact.
Logic says if the shooter had used a scoped 308 and aimed center mass, Trump would likely be dead. The tool isn't the issue. The nut behind the trigger was loose and THAT is the real problem with any of the “mass shooting” we see.
Now, HE has been shot with an AR, other people shot right in front of him. I cant see that not having a negative impact.
Logic says if the shooter had used a scoped 308 and aimed center mass, Trump would likely be dead. The tool isn't the issue. The nut behind the trigger was loose and THAT is the real problem with any of the “mass shooting” we see.
The Verminator
Moderator
Also........with one person dead, one with grievous injury and another with lesser injuries and our nation in stunned disbelief........this is not a topic that should allow childish attempts at humor.
The Verminator
Moderator
Well, banning popular modern rifles of the AR type is far different from banning bump stocks.
Many millions own AR type rifles.
Very few own bump stocks. Very few would even want one.
Plenty of people don't even know what a bump stock is.
As for the speculation about a .308 and center mass.
Wouldn't need a .308........a .223 would suffice to kill.
But.......how do we know that this shooter didn't aim at center mass?
He had to shoot quickly and there are reports that he was denied membership in a shooting group because he was such a bad shot.
Jim Watson
New member
Trump credits his turn of the head with (almost) generating a miss.
His statement and what he says he plans for his next speech are considerably milder in tone.
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/opinion/columnists/3082224/trump-im-not-supposed-to-be-here/
“The most incredible thing was that I happened to not only turn but to turn at the exact right time and in just the right amount,” Trump said Sunday afternoon in a talk aboard his Boeing 757 as he flew to Milwaukee for the start of the Republican National Convention. “If I only half-turn, it hits the back of the brain. The other way goes right through [the skull]. And because the sign was high, I’m looking up. The chances of my making a perfect turn are probably one-tenth of 1%, so I’m not supposed to be here.”
"Trump explained that before Saturday night, he had finished the speech he planned to give later this week at the Republican convention. “I basically had a speech that was an unbelievable rip-roarer,” he said. “It was brutal — really good, really tough. [Last night] I threw it out. I think it would be very bad if I got up and started going wild about how horrible everybody is and how corrupt and crooked, even if it’s true. Had this not happened, we had a speech that was pretty well set that was extremely tough. Now, we have a speech that is more unifying.”"
His statement and what he says he plans for his next speech are considerably milder in tone.
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/opinion/columnists/3082224/trump-im-not-supposed-to-be-here/
“The most incredible thing was that I happened to not only turn but to turn at the exact right time and in just the right amount,” Trump said Sunday afternoon in a talk aboard his Boeing 757 as he flew to Milwaukee for the start of the Republican National Convention. “If I only half-turn, it hits the back of the brain. The other way goes right through [the skull]. And because the sign was high, I’m looking up. The chances of my making a perfect turn are probably one-tenth of 1%, so I’m not supposed to be here.”
"Trump explained that before Saturday night, he had finished the speech he planned to give later this week at the Republican convention. “I basically had a speech that was an unbelievable rip-roarer,” he said. “It was brutal — really good, really tough. [Last night] I threw it out. I think it would be very bad if I got up and started going wild about how horrible everybody is and how corrupt and crooked, even if it’s true. Had this not happened, we had a speech that was pretty well set that was extremely tough. Now, we have a speech that is more unifying.”"
Good point. I guess im looking at the shot thru my own optics (pun). Thinking the shooter misses by an inch or so. Maybe he missed by feet. Inexperienced shooter, rushes his shot. We dont know the exact rifle/optic/iron sights. There are many things we will never. The only thing we know for sure is the last thing that went through the shooters mind
stagpanther
New member
150 yards is a chip shot for any real trained shooter--obviously a lone wolf death-by-police-blaze -of-glory thing IMO. Maybe wanted to start a revolution of sort in the process. Maybe was challenged on a gaming platform. Could be any one of a million bizarre motivations.
NJgunowner
New member
If Trump was still facing forward he'd be dead. The shooter apparently played too many video games where you go for the head shot.
As a nation we dodged a bullet. If he'd been killed I can't imagine how bad it would have been. Retaliation would be a constant threat, you'd have to run campaigns out of a bunker for the next year. It's still a possibility I suppose, but less likely with him only getting nicked.
The ones I feel bad for are the families of the man who died and the two wounded. They are being lost in the shuffle.
As a nation we dodged a bullet. If he'd been killed I can't imagine how bad it would have been. Retaliation would be a constant threat, you'd have to run campaigns out of a bunker for the next year. It's still a possibility I suppose, but less likely with him only getting nicked.
The ones I feel bad for are the families of the man who died and the two wounded. They are being lost in the shuffle.
No, people should not, but they do, and, they will. Humor, even dark humor and what some people consider twisted and sick are a way some people deal with stressful things. One man's amusing is another's disgusting, just look at what passes for comedy these days.
I do find it a bit ironic that some people are making a big deal about the shooting, probably seeing it as something very serious because of the intended target. But, by the numbers, one dead (not counting the killer) and a couple wounded, its not much of anything in America today.
By the number of people shot and killed, its not even close to a very slow night in Chicago, and only injured a person or two more than a bad day on an Alec Baldwin movie set.
(note the sarcasm, which is intentional, and also, the truth)Lethal violence is not worse because it is directed against some one rich, famous, or a political figure. It is more shocking to some people, because it happens less frequently, but its not a worse crime than shooting anyone else just because you feel like it.
I lived through the 60s, where we lost a president, a presidential candidate and several civil rights leaders killed, and others injured and crippled by assassin's bullets. ONE of the results was that we passed the most sweeping and expansive gun control laws in our nations history (GCA 1968).
It didn't stop the violence. Nor have any laws, before, or since.
There are already some people claiming that the Trump shooting was some kind of "Reichstag Fire", created by and for Trump's benefit. One thing I read claimed a 1992 movie where the presidential candidate set up a fake assassination attempt as the inspiration for this real life event.
People are going to claim all kinds of crap, some rational sounding, some so far out as to boggle the mind with disbelief. That's going to happen, is already happening, deal with it as you deem appropriate.
Sharkbite said:
A fellow (Cory Mills) was on TV yesterday explaining how in service he had trained to make "T" shots and that anyone who knows how to breathe and press a trigger could have made the shot at several hundred yards. I'd guess that having a PO discover you as people on the ground yell that you are up there might be distracting, and I know how distracted I get when the people the next bench over talk too much.
I hope this event doesn't substantially alter the way public events are held. The search for more safety never ends but it claims a lot of freedom of action along the way. The way we fly is screwy because of hijackers and 9.11. Court houses all have metal detectors now. PA I and II left us all with less privacy.
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Jim Watson
New member
Outdoor political events where there is not blanket coverage are probably on the way out.