threat is down... 911 is called...what to say/not say

K

KingEdward

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If anyone has personal experience or suggestions or especially legal knowledge/view, please submit

BG has broken/entered. Has either threatened me or is proceeding with visible weapon towards sleeping area (it's late night / early morning).

In lieu of threat (opportunity, ability, jeopardy) BG is fired upon and hit multiple times and falls and breathes last in the hallway of a 2 BR apartment.

I don't touch anything. I re-secure/close door and make sure no other threats are present (and let's say there are no other threats). Then I lay firearm on dining table and call 911.

as it progresses and the stress level builds, what do I say/not say, do/not do?

IMO this is a trying time to keep your emotions in check and not make a verbal/mental mistake.
 
While I may not be able to maintain intended composure, My planned and practiced call is basically to state that there has been an intruder shot and he is down. I need police. I cannot hear you as my hearing is temporarily diminished and my weapon is safe and I am awaiting the patrol to arrive...
Of course address is given.
Once police arrive I will respond with up raised hands until they are confident no threat is posed.
From TFL I have decided I need to decline questioning without a lawyer present...
Brent
 
Just let them know there was an intruder and that you fired and need police. All 911 calls are recorded so say just enough to get the police there so they can decide what happened. It would really suck to accidentally say something that could jurt you in court.
 
My theoretical two cents:

On the 911 call, I would advise to say 'shots were fired' rather than "I shot". Don't deny or conceal anything, but focus on only giving the information that is critical at that moment.

While you are waiting, depending - take photos. Without disturbing evidence, if you can get your camera, or cell phone camera, preserve information for yourself (and your lawyer, if it comes to that).
 
With taking pics... Isn't there a possible risk of coming across too callous or even "pre-meditated" that you were able to think clearly to take pics and record evidence? It is kinda understood that most everyone involved in an SD/HD shooting is going to be lost in hysterics or passing a manslaughter off as a SD shooting. I hope I am wrong and only a few officials think this way.
Brent
 
What to say

Since you are being recorded, say there was an intruder in your house and you were afraid for my life and my families safety. I shot him, send an ambulance and police immediately. Give your address and hang up.
That tells the lawyers you were acting in self defense and did not have a desire to hurt the intruder. That keeps the prosecuting attorney for the dead person's family a hard time attacking you.
 
1. Establish personal safety, and safety of others;

2. Secure the scene: Don't touch or remove anything, or allow anyone else to. Do not clear or reload your weapon.

3. Get witnesses' contact information. Get license plate numbers, or ask them to remain to talk to the cops. Get business cards or phone numbers.

4. If appropriate, offer first aid and/or call for medics.

5. Secure your weapon, and anticipate the arrival of police. Avoid getting shot by them. Cooperate if they prone you out, etc.

6. Answer basic questions directly and briefly. Use common sense, don't be evasive, but stick to the facts. Don't make any statements except for basic facts the first responders need to do their jobs (descriptions of other suspects, possible witnesses, which way they went, location of weapons, etc.). Other than that, request to speak with an attorney and respectfully refuse to answer questions without one present. Stick to the truth. Don't lie, even a little.

7. When in doubt, keep your mouth shut. Prepare to be taken to jail. Definitely don't talk to anyone in jail about anything related to the case. Don't blog. Don't talk to the press. Tell your family not to talk to the press. Don't worry about anything you read in the paper or see on TV.

8. Let the chips fall where they may. The system makes some allowance for mistakes but not lies or cover-ups. You're the good guy. Tell the truth (with your attorney present...).
 
Depending on how you post on TFL or other such forums, you may want to send a few balls of hot lead thru the hard drive area of the chassis.
Brent
 
i am thinking defended myself vs. saying shot or fired.

on second thought, I might take a picture or two but
response time where I live is 2 min or less usually (I have experience with south Nashville police response) and I can see where me holding a camera over a fallen person could raise eyebrows.
 
Reading some of the other replies, I want to add:

Don't try to "spin" the story. Semantics like "I shot" vs. "Was shot" are when things start to slide down the slippery slope. Lawyers will twist anything you say, so don't over-think it. Yes, your 911 call is being recorded, but avoid trying to justify it on the phone. What about "A man has been shot. Please send paramedics and police." ?

Don't do things for appearance sake. Call the ambulance because it's the right thing to do, not because it will look good in court.

Once you shoot someone, regardless of circumstance, you ARE the investigation. Photos or a video may help identify witnesses, but, overall, I think you'll be too busy and flustered for it.
 
i am thinking defended myself vs. saying shot or fired.
Click to expand...

Say NOTHING except the barest of facts until you talk to a lawyer and have him present during questioning - as is your right. Do very little. Safety and/or holster your gun.

Yes, you're the good guy, but the cops don't know that.

"This person broke into my house and I was in imminent fear for my life. I shot him." Do not answer unsolicited questions. Cops have a way of getting you relaxed and off guard and then you say something you wish you hadn't.
 
You keep a loaded firearm (or more than one) in the house because you truly believe there is a real possibility that at some point in the future, you might need it to defend and protect your family and property. You very carefully chose the weapon(s) and loads and practice religiously with them. You might have even taken an NRA class and/or a CCW class. Since you have put so much thought and time into preparing for that time you pray (or hope) never comes, why not take this one step further by writing out a brief list of things to say when you call 911 and post it next to all of the telephones that could be used after the threat has been taken care of. You might also want to print this out on a small card, laminate it and put it in your wallet/purse in case you can't get to your phone or use a cell phone.

You have just shot at and possibly killed someone and it is likely you may not be thinking too clearly. There are a lot of great suggestions here and maybe we can collectively come up with a list of things to put on this card. Input from LE personnel would be most welcome.

1. Stay calm (or at least try to)
2. Don't touch anything
3. Call 911
4. Call your lawyer. (Don't have one? Get one! If you think that one day you may put a bullet in someone, you will NEED a lawyer and trying to find one after the fact is probably not the best time to go looking)

As far as taking your own crime scene photos, I am not sure how the court will look on this. If the pictures were not taken by a recognized crime scene investigation unit, it is probably doubtful they will be allowed to be used as evidence, especially if they were taken by one of the parties involved.

Scott
 
so keeping it simple it might look like this:

1. call 911 - prior to this, do not disturb the scene.

2. give location (address) and give my description

3. the emergency is: shots have been fired.

4. please send an ambulance

5. make sure whomever arrives does not perceive me as a threat (gun in secure condition and away from my person)

6. keep any reponses initially to brief words and be truthful

7. call my attorney and get him present before any statements are made or
any lengthy question/answer sessions take place

8. have a cooperative and willing attitude with Police and others and if taken in custody, be relaxed and calm.

9. Let my attorney earn his money.
 
If the 911 tape includes sounds of the B&E in progress, the homeowner yelling stopdropyourweapontheolicehavebeencalledstoporI'llshoot etc, there would be less to be explained to lots of people later. You'd be surprised how much a phone microphone will pick up...

In other words, call 911 as soon as possible.

lpl
 
best advice I can give is even if you know the guy is dead have 911 walk you through live saving measures (laugh as you might but it just may save your butt in court)
 
Odd how being honest, forthright, doing the right thing, and accepting responsibility for one's actions takes a backseat.

I recommend calling the police and answering the questions the dispatcher asks you. They are trained to handle the incident, most citizens are not. Responding officers need facts, fail to provide them and you will place yourself in undue danger.

It amazes me the number of folks who see an attorney as a saving grace. Attorneys care about being paid--nothing more, nothing less.

Anyone who thinks they are going to shoot someone and say nothing about it to first responders are living in a fantasy land.
 
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I actually learned something from this thread, and so I thank you all.

Yes, we are training for that moment. We chose a specific weapon, a specific brand of ammo, a specific load of ammo, and personally trained for this exact scenario. So going the extra distance and conferring with YOUR lawyer (not just A lawyer) on how you should word your call, is excellent advice. Even if anyone answering has the proper answer for you, you shouldn't be trusting your life and freedom to our opinions.

So I will definitely be getting a lawyer before carrying once my CCP goes live.

Now here's a question, what does "getting a lawyer" even mean, to those of us who never had one. Do you pay for a single meeting, discuss why you need one, keep the card and store it for when you might need it? Does that make him "on call"? How do you choose a lawyer who will be available for when you need him? I'm not rich, and in the end this guy just wants money, so do I have to get approved by him? If I don't have much cash when I need him, how do I secure his services and build up that debt? It's not lilke this kind of court case would be short and inexpensive.
 
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