Some advice requested: shady subject at LEO house

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^^^ I know where you're getting at lol... I have witnessed it once and I've also had one of the neighborhood kids act out in front of his friends, yelling " *blank* 12" repeatedly. I walked to my mailbox and smiled and he hauled it down the street. I do believe it happens when they see my patrol car not in the driveway (I know, its usually in the garage but i had to take the motorcycle apart, and its in pieces, so that has to get cleaned up to get the patrol car in the garage).

I do trust her that this occurring while I'm away. We had another incident that occurred while I was on the phone with her and needless to say the curiosity and then the terror seemed real. I deal with crazy/mentally ill/paranoid people on the daily and though yes, I am biased, she isn't claiming people are crawling through locked windows lol. But the thought of her maybe imagining things has gone through my head but I don't believe that is the case.


Taking people's advise (this is a gun board so I will keep it to firearms and training) she now carries her Shield in a holster around the house when I'm not home and has a spare mag with her also (loaded with 124 grain HST). After practicing techniques, she is able to manipulate the slide enough to load and unload a round. She's having a mental issue (hold your jokes) where she stops pushing up on the slide stop while racking the slide, so she can't get it to lock open. But if an empty mag is inserted, she can pull it back far enough to lock it open when the empty mag engages the slide stop. There is also a loaded SP5k in the bedroom as well.

Thanks again for everybody's comments and concerns. It does mean a lot that people show their concern. Obviously training is never complete but she has vastly improved with everyone's recommendations. Thanks again.
 
The Kel-tec PMR 30 might be another option in the same concept with the added plus of 30 rounds of .22 magnum ammo.
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I have one of those! Real easy to rack the slide, but the real advantage, it is so light! And 30 rounds of .22 mag!

My Wife can rack the slide on our Glock 42 and loves the recoil of the .380 round. And no, I can not get her to carry it, she has a Carry License.

Dead give away, the marked vehicle in the drive!
 
Personally i wouldn't do the AR route for home defense. Unless your protecting from the zombie apocolypse or have a ranch with coyotes.

Aside from a dog the sound of a slide being racked on a pump shotgun is universally known as "you picked the wrong place"!!
Maybe look at a 410 for her. Still as deadly as a 12 ga, just not as many pellets.

My wife has issues with grip size and racking a semi auto also.
After much experimenting we picked up a Walther PPS M2 for her.
At 15 yards shes hitting one of those swinging targets that are meant for 22's.
 
std7mag said:
Personally i wouldn't do the AR route for home defense.
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Why? An AR-15 is a superior home-defense weapon to a shotgun in almost every way. Here’s why:

-Due to NFA restrictions, an AR-15 will almost always be shorter and more compact than a shotgun.
-An AR-15 has much less recoil.
-Engaging multiple targets is faster and easier with an AR-15.
-Follow-up shots are much faster and easier with an AR-15.
-With proper defensive ammo, an AR will penetrate FAR less through walls than almost any defensive shotgun or handgun load.
-An AR-15 has a much higher capacity.
-An AR-15 is much easier and faster to reload.
-The average AR is more reliable than the average semi-auto shotgun. And the AR-15 will usually be more reliable than even a pump shotgun unless the shooter is well-trained and pumps the shotgun properly each time (I'm fairly proficient with the 870 and 590, but I've owned both and I've had more stoppages with those two than I've ever had with any AR I've owned).

I like the 870 and 590 a lot, but I use an AR-15 for primary bedroom home defense. My wife finds a pump shotgun to be much more difficult and complicated to use than the AR, and she can't stand the recoil. Also, I'm worried about over-penetration through walls, and my 62 gr. Hornady TAP .223 loads will penetrate FAR less through walls than any kind of buckshot.

And if the sound of a pump shotgun is what you're looking for, the sound of a round being racked into the chamber of a rifle isn't exactly welcoming either. But I don't like that tactic; it either means you didn't have a round chambered already or you're ejecting a live round onto the ground and losing up to 20% of your ammo. Both are bad ideas. And don't forget that making that sound gives your position away, too.

There's nothing wrong with using a shotgun for home defense, but I think a semi-auto rifle in .223 is easier to use, more effective (especially against multiple attackers), and also safer for innocent bystanders because of far less penetration through walls.
 
Why not just use a lever action 30-30?

What is a "defensive" shotgun load?
Mine is loaded with Federal 6 shot.

My shotgun doesn't have the tendancy to jam. :D
 
Why not just use a lever action 30-30?

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Because shooting holes through the neighbors' houses is not neighborly.

What is a "defensive" shotgun load?
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Ask Clint Smith.

Mine is loaded with Federal 6 shot.
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Don't tell him that ..... he pulls no punches. Somebody's feeling will get hurt.

My shotgun doesn't have the tendancy to jam.
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None of my guns have a tendency to jam ..... a gun that tends to jam is a liability, not an asset.

A short handy 5.56x45 carbine with frangible ammo ( 50gr V-max or similar) can't be beat for home defense..... especially if one has a suppressor on it- no flash and your hearing will not suffer as much if you have to use it.
 
std7mag said:
Why not just use a lever action 30-30?
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Because for the purposes of home defense, it’s inferior in every single way to an AR-15 (except maybe price).

std7mag said:
My shotgun doesn't have the tendancy to jam.
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Mine don’t ether. Most don’t. But unless the shooter is very proficient with it, they’re going to short-stroke a pump shotgun under stress more often than they’d experience stoppages in a halfway-decent AR-15

Look, use what you want for home defense. A shotgun is a good choice and a lever action isn’t a bad choice either. But anyone who claims that an AR-15 isn’t a good choice for a home-defense long gun doesn’t know what they’re talking about.
 
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I think a short barreled, suppressed AR in 5.56 x 45 is the perfect home defense weapon. Unfortunately in Illinois that is illegal, so a 16" carbine with a collapsible stock is the best alternative. My first choice is always a pistol because of convenience, but a carbine is a much better choice. I keep an 18" 12 gauge pump close at hand as well, but length, weight, and recoil make it a "last stand" weapon for me, and a no-go for my wife.
 
I have several "female shooters" in my household, plus their "female" shooting friends. Most of them do well and feel comfortable using my 1911s(while they don't/can't always rack the slide, they are comfortable with them in condition 1) and my L-frame revolvers. I doubt very much that a most females within the scenario of a SD/HD situation would have to be overly concern with a reload, when starting out with a handgun capacity of 7-8 rounds. Any of them that would survive a shootout confrontation long enough and the completion of a speed reload, could probably rack the slide somehow. There's a lot more to proper SD/HD technique/procedures than throwing lead. Having a safe room, with a phone or alternate egress, barricading, etc. If the BGs have to come thru a narrow entrance, one at a time, to get to her, one shot a piece would be enough.

The last few years quality solar powered lighting at very affordable costs have become prevalent. I have one of those units that come on at dusk and last all night on dim on every corner of my house. If they detect movement they go to bright. From inside my house I can see when they go to bright. So far, the only thing that has set them off to bright is the neighbors cats/dogs and the occasional rabbit. Odds are they would spook anyone sneaking around the house at night on top of giving me a heads up.

For less than the price of a new gun, my oldest just bought a set of 4 motion activated HD security cameras that connect to his phone. They alert him whenever they are activated while allowing him to see what/who is there. He uses them at his cabin which is located about 40 miles away after having a rash of break-ins and vandalizings. Come to find out, it was the neighbor's kid doing most of it, even tho he was supposedly "keeping an eye on the place" for us. My son discretely placed them so they were inconspicuous and the neighbor kid denied everything until he was shown the videos.
 
A year ago, we were shopping for a pistol for my wife. She is 67 and had difficulties with my smaller 9mm pistol slides, and could hardly budge the 1911 slide. We went to our local gun store and she tried several pistols. She did the best with the Sig P320, so we got the compact. We also picked up the sub-compact frame. She has about 900-1000 rounds downrange over the last year and has become better at manipulating the slide. Best of luck, as a retired LEO, I've had similar issues over the years with harassment. Sicne retirement, haven't had issues, but I remain prepared as best as I can.
 
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cannonfire,

She's having a mental issue (hold your jokes) where she stops pushing up on the slide stop while racking the slide, so she can't get it to lock open. But if an empty mag is inserted, she can pull it back far enough to lock it open when the empty mag engages the slide stop.
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There's a way past this. Show her how little pressure the slide stop really takes. All she has to do is find the place that puts just a tiny bit of upward pressure on the slide stop and then keep her thumb on that spot -- not "push", not "hold", not "press" -- just keep her thumb right there while she racks the slide as usual.

A lot of times, what happens is that people feel as though they need to push in, or press hard, or do something different with the slide stop. They really don't. Just find the magic spot and keep your thumb on it while racking the slide exactly as they normally would.

As you say, it's very much a mental hurdle. Normal one. Always fun to watch the light bulb suddenly go on for that one! :)

pax
 
Addendum:

To show her how little pressure the slide stop really takes, hold the gun yourself with the slide back and have her toggle the slide stop while you're holding the action open. It's really loose and light, can just be barely flicked and it will move.

Help her notice that it does not click or snick or snap into place. It just wiggles a little.

Then show her how far the slide can move back after the stop has engaged. And show her how that makes the slide stop drop out of position. Explain to her her how it is that she might keep pushing harder and harder on the lock, never feel it get into place and get frustrated that she didn't feel it but might push on it as hard as she can until she's SURE it HAS TO HAVE gone into place, but the slide didn't lock and how could that be?

Help her understand what's happening: the slide is locking in place, briefly, but she isn't feeling it happen. She she keeps trying to do the job after it was already done (by moving the slide even more!) and that undoes her hard work.

This often happens with newbies and it's usually because they were expecting to feel the lock engage or snick or clip into place and it just doesn't do that. Because they expect to feel the sensation of something snapping into position, when that does not happen, they keep pulling back on the slide and undo what they've already done.

So teach her to rack the slide and let go of the slide.

Then teach her to put her thumb on the magic spot, then rack the slide (and let go of the slide) while keeping her thumb on that spot.

That usually does it.

pax
 
Have the fiance watch the following videos and practice the techniques.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LM0kl4PrINs

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Al2rMXpw6c0

Really no reason she shouldn't be able to rack that pistol with some practice.

Edited to add, The S&W Shield has a really stiff slide release. I have one and it really takes a lot of force to get the slide lock to release w/o the mag in place. With an empty mad in place - takes 2 hands / 2 thumbs.

Far easier to the sling shot the slide than use the slide release - on a loaded magazine.

I hate to say this cuz I'll sound like a Glock fanboy - but GLOCK. I have no experience with the single stacks Glocks but the 26/27, 19/23, 17/22, and 30/21 are far easier to manipulate.

My advice for her, having the gun in front of me, ignore the slide release altogether. Pretend it's not there. With a loaded mag - sling shot that gun. Empty mag, release the mag, sling shot the slide, push the empty mag back into the gun.
 
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The advice given, to use both hands to push-pull the gun and slide is good advice. Practice with an unloaded gun until she’s got it down pat.

From a home security standpoint I have installed the “Blink” camera system; a wireless Wi-fi system. When armed the camera will detect motion, save a 5 second video clip (repeating that step when motion is still detected) I’ve been able to check my cameras while I’ve been in South America visiting with the wife’s family.

Yet another home defense option is one of the New Mossberg or Remington short barreled Firearms. I have the Mossberg Shockwave in 20 Gauge; loaded with #4 buckshot. I chose the 20 Gauge; my wife is capable of working the action. Nothing says (to a bad guy) oh hell I am in trouble when he or she hears the pump shotgun action being cycled!

iipsrv.fcgi


The BATFE has “ruled” that these shotguns are (1) Firearms and (2) are not NFA Firearms! I really enjoy shooting mine!
 
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Here's something I recently recently read:

Springfield Armory claims the XD-E 9mm is easier to rack than similar pistols.
From SA's website:

The Low Effort Slide (L.E.S.) requires 27% less effort to manipulate compared to striker-fired handguns in the same class.
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Maybe she could try one out at a local gun store?



BTW, long guns (rifle or shotgun) are NOT good home defense weapons.
I mean they're great IF you know you are about to be attacked.
Or in the event of a war.
Or a zombie apocalypse.

But criminals seldom tell you when they plan to attack.
They strike when you least expect.

The handgun is the gun you're going to have on you when you really need it.
The long gun will most likely be in the other room, or in the safe, or under the bed, or in the gun cabinet, or in the closet, etc...when you really need it.


Think about it:

You go to check the mail-box...are you going to have your rifle or shotgun with you?

You take the dog out for a walk, or for than last pee of the night...are you going to have your rifle or shotgun with you?

You are working in the garage on your car or truck or bike...are you going to have your rifle or shotgun by your side?

You're watching TV and you have to use the bathroom.
While in the bathroom you hear glass breaking, or a door being forced.
Did you bring your rifle or shotgun to the bathroom with you?

Your watching TV and you get hungry.
You go to the kitchen to make yourself a snack.
Did you bring your rifle or shotgun with you to the kitchen?

You're on the deck or porch sipping a cold drink with some friends...do you have your rifle or shotgun by your side?

You were watering your lawn and forgot to shut the water off.
Do you take your rifle or shotgun outside with you to shut the water off?

You're mowing the lawn.
Are you carrying your rifle or shotgun with you?

You're taking the garbage out, or taking to the garbage can to the end of the driveway...do you have your rifle or shotgun with you?




I'm sure you get my point....
You can always have a handgun on your side or in your pocket.
The long gun will NOT be with you when you really need it.





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My personal racking maneuver is simple.

Stand with left shoulder facing down range, face aimed to right, pistol aimed down range.
Lock right hand on grip, grasp slide with entire left hand.

Push hands together using shoulder strength.

I have never heard of such a thing. Really. A couple things come to mind.

Maybe you have a 'special' person in your neighborhood who gets a thrill out of this.
Maybe you have pissed someone off who is now stalking you. You are a cop, right? Some people would do that, regardless of your jurisdiction.
Dog? Ridiculous. Buy a dog just so he can bark? Dogs aren't tools. They are living things that deserve better.
Used or new da semiautomatic or glock? This is no time to fart around with keeping a gun around with loaded magazine but empty chamber.
Motion lights? Very helpful. He won't trip in the dark.


Suggestions.

Well concealed Infrared game trail cameras covering property that he has invaded in the past. Full wireless system if you can get a self powered one, otherwise, do you have plenty of external outlets that he can't reach? Got a friend who can stay in the home in the dark when you aren't home?
Indoor Lights on timers?
Motion sensor alarms around doors? Plenty of them around, battery operated. Cheap.
RAISE YOUR INSURANCE COVERAGE ON ALL PROPERTY. RAISE LIFE INSURANCE.
Paint bricks or cinder blocks black, scatter them in dark areas. Put tent stakes in with about two inches above ground, separate them widely so he won't fall on another when he trips. Trip wires? Strobe light with motion sensor. Who cares if the wind triggers it? get a full sized revolver for interim, place guns strategically. Would a bathroom be a safe place to escape to? Keep revolver there, other guns elsewhere.

FIND OUT IF HE IS HARASSING ANYONE ELSE. FILE OFFICIAL REPORT WITH BOTH POLICE AND SHERIFF THAT YOU AND YOUR NEIGHBORHOOD ARE BEING STALKED. ABSOLUTELY ESSENTIAL THAT THE COMPLAINT IS STALKING.

Fantasy.

Motion sensor operation propane cannon. Trip wire flares.
 
cannonfire said:
^^^ I know where you're getting at lol... I have witnessed it once and I've also had one of the neighborhood kids act out in front of his friends, yelling " *blank* 12" repeatedly. I walked to my mailbox and smiled and he hauled it down the street. I do believe it happens when they see my patrol car not in the driveway (I know, its usually in the garage but i had to take the motorcycle apart, and its in pieces, so that has to get cleaned up to get the patrol car in the garage).

I do trust her that this occurring while I'm away. We had another incident that occurred while I was on the phone with her and needless to say the curiosity and then the terror seemed real. I deal with crazy/mentally ill/paranoid people on the daily and though yes, I am biased, she isn't claiming people are crawling through locked windows lol. But the thought of her maybe imagining things has gone through my head but I don't believe that is the case.


Taking people's advise (this is a gun board so I will keep it to firearms and training) she now carries her Shield in a holster around the house when I'm not home and has a spare mag with her also (loaded with 124 grain HST). After practicing techniques, she is able to manipulate the slide enough to load and unload a round. She's having a mental issue (hold your jokes) where she stops pushing up on the slide stop while racking the slide, so she can't get it to lock open. But if an empty mag is inserted, she can pull it back far enough to lock it open when the empty mag engages the slide stop. There is also a loaded SP5k in the bedroom as well.

Thanks again for everybody's comments and concerns. It does mean a lot that people show their concern. Obviously training is never complete but she has vastly improved with everyone's recommendations. Thanks again.
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Thank you for the update. Sounds like it is working out.

One other idea in case her hand strength weakens in the future:

Ruger or Browning .22 with best ammo available and bolt this onto the slide:
https://www.tandemkross.com/halo-Charging-Ring-for-the-Ruger-Mark-IV-Mark-III-2245_p_294.html

Its for competition but I have seen 7-8 year old children able to rack the pistol without problem with them.

EDIT: the wife also has bad hands. She has a Beretta Storm compact and is able to manipulate it without difficulty.
 
Wishoot said:
First thing, I'd install security cameras.

Second, take her to a range that rents and let her choose a gun.
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Amen to that, Simply Safe will camera the heck out of the house.

Also, having cameras visible around the house tend to keep scumbags away...
they see the cameras and know they're more likely to get caught.
Add more LED lighting as well.

Next, get a BIG DOG, if you got a house, and a fence, you need a DOG in that backyard.
Dazzling Urbanites tend to avoid houses with dogs because they bring too much attention...
and a lot of 'em are just flat out afraid of dogs.

And evidently your gal is a looker, so you might want to invest in Burglar Bars as well.
Definitely those nice big iron screen doors front & back. Actually LOCK them when
you enter instead of leaving them open because you're home. Double-key deadbolts.

Atlanta is a bit of a PIT, and it doesn't help that you are a LEO, that actually
makes you MORE of a target. You are in a combat zone, act like it.
 
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