Running gun battle in Denver
- Thread starter jimpeel
- Start date
Playboypenguin
Moderator
Ummm...I am sorry but I am afraid I would consider someone that would chase a home invader down a public highway while exchanging gufire almost as big a menace as the burglar.
oldbillthundercheif
Moderator
The wild west is still alive, I guess.
Richard Hanson
New member
So, now we are to consider a courageous citizen attempting to help the police apprehend a dangerous criminal to be nearly as significant a hazard to the public safety as the lawless? I would gladly have a man of such character and temperament as my neighbor. Indeed, if most men where predisposed to act in a similar manner then crime would be largely extinguished.
Best Regards,
Richard
Best Regards,
Richard
Jim Watson
New member
I don't think it smart. If I had successfully repelled boarders, I would not be thinking of jumping in my car in pursuit. With my luck, a police roadblock would catch me and the crooks escape while I explained myself.
I would be planning on working on my marksmanship after leaving the "home invaders" able to flee.
I wonder about the background of the parties. Maybe the resident was chasing them down to recover illicit property or get revenge for something he could not put in a police report. I recall the Mark Moritz "93% Rule". He said that in L.A. that it did not matter who won a shootout 93% of the time because there would be an undesirable element out of circulation either way.
I would be planning on working on my marksmanship after leaving the "home invaders" able to flee.
I wonder about the background of the parties. Maybe the resident was chasing them down to recover illicit property or get revenge for something he could not put in a police report. I recall the Mark Moritz "93% Rule". He said that in L.A. that it did not matter who won a shootout 93% of the time because there would be an undesirable element out of circulation either way.
Considering how it doesn't say the police arrested the man, I'm figuring it most likely went a little something like this: Bad guys are getting away, so he hops in the car to keep the cops updated on their position. Bad guys start shooting him, he starts firing back.
At least I hope that's what happened, because anyone who would open fire first (barring seeing a gun in the car pointed at you) would be a bit un-hinged in my opinion.
At least I hope that's what happened, because anyone who would open fire first (barring seeing a gun in the car pointed at you) would be a bit un-hinged in my opinion.
Playboypenguin
Moderator
That is a whole lot of assuming, and even if you are correct when the bad guys started shooting and you are n a following car in a public place you remove their reason for firing by falling back. You do not return wild fire from a moving vehicle in a public area putting the lives of innocents for miles around in danger.
"I don't think it smart. If I had successfully repelled boarders, I would not be thinking of jumping in my car in pursuit."
Exactly. I took a defensive shotgun course once from a retired police officer (a *phenomenal* shooter) and he said that if you can get the bad guy to leave your house without having to shoot and before he has harmed anyone, you have won the confrontation in every measurable way, and you should count your lucky stars.
Tim
Exactly. I took a defensive shotgun course once from a retired police officer (a *phenomenal* shooter) and he said that if you can get the bad guy to leave your house without having to shoot and before he has harmed anyone, you have won the confrontation in every measurable way, and you should count your lucky stars.
Tim
It depends on what happened during the home invasion, and if his local cops are like my local cops, running them down yourself, or at least keeping them in sight until they cops show up, is the only way they would get caught. But, heck, the new thing to do is let them go on to do more home invasions.
badbob
badbob
JuanCarlos
New member
+1
Life is not an action movie. Every round fired is a chance that somebody who is neither you nor the bad guy dies.
Once you're chasing after them, it's no longer a defensive gun use. It's crap like this that convinces people that private gun ownership is a bad idea.
Playboypenguin
Moderator
The fact that they fled when confronted instead of shooting at that time shows a reluctance to kill someone so turning it into a gun battle from the window of a moving car in a public area is not a good idea no matter how you look at it.
That's not necessarily true. If he is simply following them in order to be able to continue to update the police with their whereabouts, then he is, as I understand it, within his rights. After that, depending on what state he's in, he may use his firearm defensively. (I.e. for states where your car is included in your domain).
JuanCarlos
New member
I wasn't speaking legally, really. I'm sure it's entirely possible he broke no laws. I just think that once you start chasing somebody you're no longer strictly "defending" yourself...he finished defending himself when the bad guys left his house.
That's not to say that defending others (which, theoretically, he was doing by trying to ensure these guys got caught before they did this again) isn't worthwhile. But I'd say that at some point you have an obligation to limit the risk to other innocent bystanders...and once they start shooting at you that's done by falling back, not returning fire. You have to weigh the potential harm of them possibly striking again against the potential harm of trading gunfire in a public place, and decide what the least dangerous option to your fellow citizens is.
Granted, this isn't something you're going to be able to do rationally in such a situation...I realize this. That's why I'd be unlikely to grab my gun, jump in the car, and follow the guys in the first place...that's the kind of thing that's just as likely to get people killed as get criminals caught. Shoot them before they leave, or accept that they got away but that you're okay.
Life is not a Jerry Bruckheimer film.
That's not to say that defending others (which, theoretically, he was doing by trying to ensure these guys got caught before they did this again) isn't worthwhile. But I'd say that at some point you have an obligation to limit the risk to other innocent bystanders...and once they start shooting at you that's done by falling back, not returning fire. You have to weigh the potential harm of them possibly striking again against the potential harm of trading gunfire in a public place, and decide what the least dangerous option to your fellow citizens is.
Granted, this isn't something you're going to be able to do rationally in such a situation...I realize this. That's why I'd be unlikely to grab my gun, jump in the car, and follow the guys in the first place...that's the kind of thing that's just as likely to get people killed as get criminals caught. Shoot them before they leave, or accept that they got away but that you're okay.
Life is not a Jerry Bruckheimer film.
Too little information for all this pontificating. How about we leave the moralizing until more verifiable information is released? This is THE SAME THING that we accuse the Liberals and MSM of doing. Taking a little information, and drawing pious conclusions from it. Pretty soon, this thread won't need what happened, as it will devolve into petty issues not even remotely concerned with the actual facts.
Remember the uproar on the old farmer who followed the three who were stealing gasoline? That one was also replete with spurious commentary condemning him. That the initial report was flawed, incomplete, and in some cases, just wrong, didn't seem to stop many of these same posters from "augmenting" the story to make their moral point clear.
Remember the uproar on the old farmer who followed the three who were stealing gasoline? That one was also replete with spurious commentary condemning him. That the initial report was flawed, incomplete, and in some cases, just wrong, didn't seem to stop many of these same posters from "augmenting" the story to make their moral point clear.