...forget the buzz-word of the week and use the correct words when speaking...the problem is with illegal aliens and illegal entry, not immigration which is both legal and moral...personally I've always detested people who cheat to get what they what instead of doing it honestly...we have enough domestic dishonesty to contend, we don't need to import it from outside...
Remember the problem is illegal ALIENS...
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brianidaho
New member
One that commits a criminal act is a CRIMINAL, not an illegal. Lets call them what they are, criminal aliens, or if in a less pc mode, criminal invaders. I failed PC 101.
Bri
Bri
careful with that; if you've ever driven over the speed limit or drank before turning 21 or had sex before marriage in any one of about 30 states, you're also a criminal. just because there's a law against something doesn't make it wrong. would you like to be forever known as a criminal driver or criminal fornicator?
In either case, the term "illegal immigration" fully applies. It's illegal and it's immigration. I don't get what the problem is.
Guy B. Meredith
New member
There also seems to be confusion between immigrant and alien. Some of both are currently here illegally.
Those that are here legally deserve the courtesy of equal treatment in being permitted entrance. They have done it honestly no matter what their reason for being here, no matter whether what they fled is as bad or worse than the illegals claim brought them here. My wife is here on green card, has to continuously prove she is not a burden to this country and took the pains to do it legally.
Those that are here legally deserve the courtesy of equal treatment in being permitted entrance. They have done it honestly no matter what their reason for being here, no matter whether what they fled is as bad or worse than the illegals claim brought them here. My wife is here on green card, has to continuously prove she is not a burden to this country and took the pains to do it legally.
Blood is thicker than water.
Say what ever you want but that is the answer.
Of course you can argue that point by taking into account the various religions that are now in conflict around the globe, and their blood is the same.
North vs the South (civil war) in America, Crazy.:barf:
Alien is a correct word and immigration is still in good standing.
Unless you are some liberal who wants to be politically correct.
Webster is my backup. Until they want to reprint the English language and reduce it to half of the words being used, like they did in China in the last decade.
WU
Say what ever you want but that is the answer.
Of course you can argue that point by taking into account the various religions that are now in conflict around the globe, and their blood is the same.
North vs the South (civil war) in America, Crazy.:barf:
Alien is a correct word and immigration is still in good standing.
Unless you are some liberal who wants to be politically correct.
Webster is my backup. Until they want to reprint the English language and reduce it to half of the words being used, like they did in China in the last decade.
WU
steelheart
Moderator
It goes deeper than that - the problem is damn no-load politicians who refuse to do the job that we elected them to do (protect our borders).
Harley Quinn
Moderator
Mexican flag and American Flag
Pretty interesting
Saw this on the web with picture's I could not get the pictures to post here but you get the idea...
*****
03/28 : Student protest in Whittier area students from Pioneer, California and Whittier high schools walked out of classes to protest the proposed federal immigration bill March 27, 2006. The protestors put up the Mexican flag over the American flag flying upside down at Montebello High.
Meanwhile: Mexico Cheers Passage of Immigration Bill
Like I said: Welcome to reconquista.
I predict this stunt will be the nail in the coffin of any guest-worker/amnesty plan on the table in Washington . The image of the American flag subsumed to another and turned upside down on American soil is already spreading on Internet forums and via e-mail. Pass this along to every American citizen in your address books and to every representative in the state and federal government. If you choose to remain uninvolved do not be amazed when you no longer have a nation to call your own nor anything you have worked for left since it will be "redistributed" to the activists while you are so peacefully staying out of the "fray". Check history, it is full of nations/empires that disappeared when its citizens no longer held their core beliefs and values. One person CAN make a difference. One plus one plus one plus one plus one plus one.........
The battle for our secure borders and immigration laws that actually mean something, however, hasn't even begun.
*****
What do you think?
HQ
Pretty interesting
Saw this on the web with picture's I could not get the pictures to post here but you get the idea...
*****
03/28 : Student protest in Whittier area students from Pioneer, California and Whittier high schools walked out of classes to protest the proposed federal immigration bill March 27, 2006. The protestors put up the Mexican flag over the American flag flying upside down at Montebello High.
Meanwhile: Mexico Cheers Passage of Immigration Bill
Like I said: Welcome to reconquista.
I predict this stunt will be the nail in the coffin of any guest-worker/amnesty plan on the table in Washington . The image of the American flag subsumed to another and turned upside down on American soil is already spreading on Internet forums and via e-mail. Pass this along to every American citizen in your address books and to every representative in the state and federal government. If you choose to remain uninvolved do not be amazed when you no longer have a nation to call your own nor anything you have worked for left since it will be "redistributed" to the activists while you are so peacefully staying out of the "fray". Check history, it is full of nations/empires that disappeared when its citizens no longer held their core beliefs and values. One person CAN make a difference. One plus one plus one plus one plus one plus one.........
The battle for our secure borders and immigration laws that actually mean something, however, hasn't even begun.
*****
What do you think?
HQ
Harley Quinn
Moderator
Ray of hope, the Catholic Church.
Hi All,
What do you think?
******
Cardinal urges immigrants not to support May 1 boycott
The Associated Press
Last Updated 6:33 am PDT Monday, April 17, 2006
LOS ANGELES (AP) - Cardinal Roger Mahony, an outspoken supporter of congressional proposals to allow illegal immigrants to become citizens, is urging immigrants not to participate in a worker and student boycott planned for May 1.
The planned boycott, coming on the heels of massive nationwide protests, calls on students and workers to stay home in support of immigrant rights.
"I believe that we can make May 1st a win-win day here in Southern California: go to work, go to school, and then join thousands of us at a major rally afterward," Mahony said in a statement released late Sunday.
Mahony suggested employers and schools set aside an hour on May 1 to discuss immigration reform. He also suggested they encourage employees and students to write letters to Congress urging sweeping reform.
He said parents should discuss the issue at home, but "persuade your students to go to school on May 1st, and to remain there throughout the school day."
Nativo Lopez, president of the Mexican-American Political Association, a leading organizer of the May 1 boycott, said he respected the Cardinal's opinion but wouldn't let it alter plans.
"We can respect his opinion, and I'm sure he can respect ours," Lopez said. "But we're going to pursue our strategy of the Great American Boycott, outside the comfort zone of those in political power."
*****
What do you feel about this statement? Might help if we get some level headed minds working on this, and try not to esculate it into where it is headed???
HQ
Hi All,
What do you think?
******
Cardinal urges immigrants not to support May 1 boycott
The Associated Press
Last Updated 6:33 am PDT Monday, April 17, 2006
LOS ANGELES (AP) - Cardinal Roger Mahony, an outspoken supporter of congressional proposals to allow illegal immigrants to become citizens, is urging immigrants not to participate in a worker and student boycott planned for May 1.
The planned boycott, coming on the heels of massive nationwide protests, calls on students and workers to stay home in support of immigrant rights.
"I believe that we can make May 1st a win-win day here in Southern California: go to work, go to school, and then join thousands of us at a major rally afterward," Mahony said in a statement released late Sunday.
Mahony suggested employers and schools set aside an hour on May 1 to discuss immigration reform. He also suggested they encourage employees and students to write letters to Congress urging sweeping reform.
He said parents should discuss the issue at home, but "persuade your students to go to school on May 1st, and to remain there throughout the school day."
Nativo Lopez, president of the Mexican-American Political Association, a leading organizer of the May 1 boycott, said he respected the Cardinal's opinion but wouldn't let it alter plans.
"We can respect his opinion, and I'm sure he can respect ours," Lopez said. "But we're going to pursue our strategy of the Great American Boycott, outside the comfort zone of those in political power."
*****
What do you feel about this statement? Might help if we get some level headed minds working on this, and try not to esculate it into where it is headed???
HQ
If the illegals want to be allowed to be here why don't we grant them that, by sending them to workcamps wearing orange jumpsuits and doing our hard laborwork for FREE.
Bottom line, these illegals have NO right to protest. This BS needs to be stopped, why is Congress even entertaining the thought of giving all of these borderhoppers their citizenship when others who have legally and rightfully obtained their citizenship in the past by actually earning it!
Bottom line, these illegals have NO right to protest. This BS needs to be stopped, why is Congress even entertaining the thought of giving all of these borderhoppers their citizenship when others who have legally and rightfully obtained their citizenship in the past by actually earning it!
Destructo6
New member
Every alien who applies for admission is considered an immigrant until he can prove that he is a non-immigrant.
An alien who enters without inspection (ie jumps the fence) is considered an applicant for admission.
Therefore "illegal alien", "undocumented immigrant", and "undocumented alien" all mean the same.
That's the rub, though. If some Joe alien jumps the fence for the first time and has no criminal history, he will be charged and removed administratively, not criminally.
FirstFreedom
Moderator
actually I prefer *illegal criminal invaders*.
Scott Conklin
New member
Considering how loud the angry buzz is becoming almost everywhere I'd say "Likely Potential Targets" is going to be the most applicable label, if they keep it up.
One of my favorite Presidents, historical figure and American icon, Theodore Roosevelt, said it best:
"In the first place, we should insist that if the immigrant who comes here in good faith becomes an American and assimilates himself to us, he shall be treated on an exact equality with everyone else, for it is an outrage to discriminate against any such man because of creed, or birthplace, or origin. But this is predicated upon the person's becoming in every facet an American, and nothing but an American.
There can be no divided allegiance here. Any man who says he is an American, but something else also, isn't an American at all. We have room for but one flag, the American flag. We have room for but one language here, and that is the English language. And we have room for but one sole loyalty and that is a loyalty to the American people." Theodore Roosevelt 1907
He was right then and he is right now! And we should be shouting this from the rooftops to those who would come here and to those we elect to assure this message is cut in stone at all of our borders so that there is no misunderstanding.
"In the first place, we should insist that if the immigrant who comes here in good faith becomes an American and assimilates himself to us, he shall be treated on an exact equality with everyone else, for it is an outrage to discriminate against any such man because of creed, or birthplace, or origin. But this is predicated upon the person's becoming in every facet an American, and nothing but an American.
There can be no divided allegiance here. Any man who says he is an American, but something else also, isn't an American at all. We have room for but one flag, the American flag. We have room for but one language here, and that is the English language. And we have room for but one sole loyalty and that is a loyalty to the American people." Theodore Roosevelt 1907
He was right then and he is right now! And we should be shouting this from the rooftops to those who would come here and to those we elect to assure this message is cut in stone at all of our borders so that there is no misunderstanding.
Right now it is useless to argue endlessly about how we should treat the 11 to 12 million illegal aliens in the U.S., since anything but forced deportation (something very unlikely to happen) will encourage more illegals to find a way here. I think the solution is simple: really secure the borders (fences, troops, walls, maybe even minefields) so that we know that the flood of illegals is stopped. Then we can have a national discussion of what to do with those already here. It may not be ideal, but if we really are confident that we have stopped future illegal aliens from making it to our country, some type of amnesty or liberal guest worker program might seem acceptable to most U.S. citizens. So many of the illegals are married to U.S. citizens, or have given birth to children who are citizens, or are so old and frail that our sense of humanity would keep us from forcibly sending them back to Mexico that letting them stay with some legal status may be a good compromise. What is really discouraging is that neither political party has the guts to even propose really securing the borders. Even the House bill that has sparked the huge demonstrations only calls for a fence 700 miles long, not the full 2,000 needed to really shut down the illegal travel to the U.S. I suggest sending a simple message to our Federal legislators: Secure the border, then we can decide what to do with those already here!
The border would secure itself if we punished anyone who hires an illegal. They would go home under their own power and we wouldn't have to pay a dime other than procecution of employers. Then it would only take a few high profile ones to make the point.
If we want them back then set up a system that works.
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If we want them back then set up a system that works.
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And how would that work? I used to run a landscape company and I've hired dozens of people over the years without checking documentation. Some of them were obviously natural born Americans and some of the hispanic guys were at least legal residents. Was I supposed to run their SSNs before allowing them to jump in the back of the truck? Why? Why should it be my responsibility to find out how this guy who's going to spend six hours planting trees for me arrived in this country?
How am I supposed to tell? Oh, language? What about the Puerto Ricans? They are born United States citizens yet many of them don't speak a word of English nor have any obligation to do so. Oh yeah, so instead of fixing the problem at the core you put the pressure on small business owners that simply want to get work done.
Nightflurry
Inactive
The easier solution is to just severely punish companies that knowingly hire illegals. Make it mandatory for the company to check on the applicants status. If they knowingly hire an undocumented worker slap say.. $15,000 per worker hired in violation? (Use the procedes for border security)
Enforce it too. If the illegals can't get any work then they'll likely consider moving back, plus less would be coming in. Forced deportation just isn't going to happen even if it should.
Enforce it too. If the illegals can't get any work then they'll likely consider moving back, plus less would be coming in. Forced deportation just isn't going to happen even if it should.
I am sure you would find a way if it was 10,000 and or two years
So for you to get cheap labor we should have to pay for their medical and welfare along with the 30% that fill our prisons? Not to mention all those laws they break that kill people here. I am sure you like it but what about the rest of us that have to pay for your cheap labor?I have a nephew who is taking engineering in college. Because of the over abundance of cheap labor here he is lucky to find a job in the summer. Seems that 30% of all construction is now done by illegals. Or how about the kids that are getting out of high school? Would you rather they work or get to messing with dope because there are no jobs for them?
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I'm sorry, cheap labor? I have never, not once, ever paid an undocumented worker a penny less than I did a fully documented one. If they choose not to fill out 1099s that is their problem, not mine. I don't want to pay for their welfare but I also don't want to pay for the welfare of some white guy that can legally get a job but he'd rather sit on his fat ass drinking Old Style and watching TV all day. I hired people that were willing to work. If they worked hard they got hired again. If they didn't work hard - and not surprisingly the documented ones were the laziest ones since the undocumented ones know the only way for them to get more work is to work their asses off - they didn't get rehired.
Don't give me bull**** about a shortage of jobs. If your nephew can't find work it's because he's not looking hard enough or he needs to swallow his pride and flip burgers or clean toilets. I have never had a problem finding work in Atlanta, Tampa, Miami, Los Angeles, San Francisco, or Chicago - all cities with high concentrations of illegal immigrants. Work is available for every single able bodied adult in this country.
I don't see how you guys could seriously advocate punishing small business owners for hiring who they choose. Sounds pretty socialist to me.
Don't give me bull**** about a shortage of jobs. If your nephew can't find work it's because he's not looking hard enough or he needs to swallow his pride and flip burgers or clean toilets. I have never had a problem finding work in Atlanta, Tampa, Miami, Los Angeles, San Francisco, or Chicago - all cities with high concentrations of illegal immigrants. Work is available for every single able bodied adult in this country.
I don't see how you guys could seriously advocate punishing small business owners for hiring who they choose. Sounds pretty socialist to me.
So you pay their Social Security taxes then?
I got to hand it to you Red You break the law hiring these guys and you assist in breaking the law by not paying taxes on their earnings
Your type of work won't give an adult a living wage so people who are going to school or just getting started in work would fit but they probably don't work hard enough for you
Heck all this time I thought you were a flaming liberal, now I see when it comes to your bread basket you can slave drive as good as any Republican. Is this any way to treat your fellow man?
So are you hiding your business income along with the taxes from your employees?
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