recoil comparisons
- Thread starter reinert
- Start date
reynolds357
New member
I have problems with switching back and forth from bench rest to hunting. My bench rest rifles actually "free recoil." A few times over the years, habbit has taken over and I have free recoiled some of the boomers. Did not feel good. They all have brakes on them now, so not a huge deal.
I've mentioned this in other threads, but I've come to realize that I prefer shooting rifles with a hard butt plate rather than a soft pad. With a hard plate and good contact with my shoulder, I seem to ride the recoil impulse with my whole upper body. With a soft pad, it seems like the rifle bounces sharply inside the shoulder pocket, making it seem worse.
But, as many have mentioned, recoil is subjective to many factors and many people...
But, as many have mentioned, recoil is subjective to many factors and many people...
I agree that recoil is somewhat subjective and also that stock design and weight has a lot to do with it.
Comparing recoil between cartridge calibers can be a bit misleading because the stock design and overall weight combination has so much more to do with it for closely comparable cartridges unless of course you are comparing a .223 with a .416 Rigby.
Case in point - my friend and I were at the range with our .270s checking out why he hit a deer further back and low than he had aimed. I have a Winchester M70 Supergrade and he had a Remington 700. He and I both shot his and determined that his scope had been loosened or jostled and needed to be rezeroed. I had been shooting my Winchester and shot two rounds with his Remington. What a difference in felt recoil with the same ammo. His M700 had way more recoil than my M70. I hefted the two stocks and found that his rifle was considerably lighter and had an anemic butt pad compared to my Winchester's. I couldn't tell if the stock design and drop were any different - they looked very similar.
After about 8 rounds down range, he decided he wasn't going to shoot anymore because his .270 was hurting his shoulder.
We finished up shooting my Winchester and could have continued long after we ran out of ammo. I don't think either of us could have shot that many rounds with his rifle, the felt recoil was so different. I have shot as many as 50 hand loads in one session with that rifle when I was testing loads.
The caliber and the ammo were the same - the problem was with the weight and the stock design. He had never noticed the recoil when hunting and neither had I, but on the bench, the difference in recoil was enough to make him stop shooting his rifle while we kept on shooting mine.
If two rifles in the same caliber with the same ammo can be so different, if you had a larger caliber and a heavy rifle and a good butt pad, you actually might experience less felt recoil than a smaller caliber with a light and poorly designed stock and pad.
Comparing recoil between cartridge calibers can be a bit misleading because the stock design and overall weight combination has so much more to do with it for closely comparable cartridges unless of course you are comparing a .223 with a .416 Rigby.
Case in point - my friend and I were at the range with our .270s checking out why he hit a deer further back and low than he had aimed. I have a Winchester M70 Supergrade and he had a Remington 700. He and I both shot his and determined that his scope had been loosened or jostled and needed to be rezeroed. I had been shooting my Winchester and shot two rounds with his Remington. What a difference in felt recoil with the same ammo. His M700 had way more recoil than my M70. I hefted the two stocks and found that his rifle was considerably lighter and had an anemic butt pad compared to my Winchester's. I couldn't tell if the stock design and drop were any different - they looked very similar.
After about 8 rounds down range, he decided he wasn't going to shoot anymore because his .270 was hurting his shoulder.
We finished up shooting my Winchester and could have continued long after we ran out of ammo. I don't think either of us could have shot that many rounds with his rifle, the felt recoil was so different. I have shot as many as 50 hand loads in one session with that rifle when I was testing loads.
The caliber and the ammo were the same - the problem was with the weight and the stock design. He had never noticed the recoil when hunting and neither had I, but on the bench, the difference in recoil was enough to make him stop shooting his rifle while we kept on shooting mine.
If two rifles in the same caliber with the same ammo can be so different, if you had a larger caliber and a heavy rifle and a good butt pad, you actually might experience less felt recoil than a smaller caliber with a light and poorly designed stock and pad.
Years ago I bought a Browning A-Bolt Stainless Stalker in .300 Winchester magnum, this was before they came out with the BOSS.
The thing had a rubber butt-pad that was much like tire rubber. Shooting it just a few times would put bruises on my shoulder - but on the other hand, I discovered that it would put the first three rounds out of a cold, clean barrel into 1/2" at 100 yards, every time.
( I was shooting Federal premium 180 grain loads. )
I had read that Magna-Porting would not affect accuracy, so I used this rifle as a test-case.
Pachmayer had just come out with the 'decellerator' pads at that time, so I sent the barreled action off to Magna-Port and had a Pachmayer decellerator pad mounted on the stock while the action was gone.
When I got it all back, it kicked like a .270 and still would put the first three rounds into 1/2" at 100 yards. - And it got noisier, to the point where I could feel the concussion in my bones. - A strange but not altogether unpleasant sensation.
I'm getting ready to buy another A-Bolt, this time in .270 Winchester and you betcha I'm getting it with the BOSS barrel tuner.
The BOSS barrel tuner now comes with two weights, one with a muzzle brake and one without. - I'll use the muzzle brake at the range, and skip it on hunts, where it might injure the guide's hearing and get him whizzed off at me.
When I'm shooting at game, I hardly notice the recoil in any case. At the range though, that's another story.
The thing had a rubber butt-pad that was much like tire rubber. Shooting it just a few times would put bruises on my shoulder - but on the other hand, I discovered that it would put the first three rounds out of a cold, clean barrel into 1/2" at 100 yards, every time.
( I was shooting Federal premium 180 grain loads. )
I had read that Magna-Porting would not affect accuracy, so I used this rifle as a test-case.
Pachmayer had just come out with the 'decellerator' pads at that time, so I sent the barreled action off to Magna-Port and had a Pachmayer decellerator pad mounted on the stock while the action was gone.
When I got it all back, it kicked like a .270 and still would put the first three rounds into 1/2" at 100 yards. - And it got noisier, to the point where I could feel the concussion in my bones. - A strange but not altogether unpleasant sensation.
I'm getting ready to buy another A-Bolt, this time in .270 Winchester and you betcha I'm getting it with the BOSS barrel tuner.
The BOSS barrel tuner now comes with two weights, one with a muzzle brake and one without. - I'll use the muzzle brake at the range, and skip it on hunts, where it might injure the guide's hearing and get him whizzed off at me.
When I'm shooting at game, I hardly notice the recoil in any case. At the range though, that's another story.
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When I'm looking at a deer through my 6-18x50 scope on top of my .300 win mag I don't flinch... My guess is that's caused by me shaking too much ( adrenaline?) Now when I shoot the gun at a target I don't even waste my time trying to make an accurate shot. I squeeze the trigger and send one down range just to get the kick out of the way and remind myself that the gun isn't going to hurt me. After that I can shoot accurately 20 or so times with no trouble. I've never shot more than that due to the cost of .300 win mag ammo.
Sometimes in the course of shooting a BPCR match, a 40 shot day is not uncommon. When I'm engaged in such a shooting event, most of the shooting is done off of X-sticks, with some offhand involved. I shoot a Shiloh Long Range Express model, in 45/90 cal. The stock is quite straight; better for dealing with recoil. 85 grains of black powder behind a 540 grain bullet will provide pretty good recoil. I use a Rand Elite recoil shield (pad) when I'm shooting off of the sticks, and just my shoulder (no pad) when shooting offhand.
The rifle has a traditional shotgun butt plate, and it provides a fair/good amount of flat surface to distribute the felt recoil as best it can. If I tuck into the rifle consistently the same for each shot (off the sticks), I have no problem with recoil as I focus on the shot; kind of like a hunting scenario. The Rand pad handles the rest of the recoil situation very well, IMHO.
On the offhand, standing and shooting presents it's own recoil dealings, and I can deal with it just fine without the pad for the string of shots. I can "bear down" better without the Rand pad, and again, the shots are more in the realm of a "hunting" shot, without recoil being anticipated...too much... (I'm pretty much an average built guy, 5' 10" @ 170 lbs.).
In this thread, I don't believe anyone has mentioned the mercury recoil dampeners available these days. I've never talked to anyone who has used the system, and I've read mixed reviews on them. The one thing about them that would be unfavorable to me in a hunting rifle, is that they are rather heavy (from what I've read). Along with the drilling and installing the system, unless there's already a hole through the stock to accommodate the unit, they seem rather spendy, at least to me. Anyone use one? I see Midway offers them, made by Graco.
Been a fun thread,
reinert
The rifle has a traditional shotgun butt plate, and it provides a fair/good amount of flat surface to distribute the felt recoil as best it can. If I tuck into the rifle consistently the same for each shot (off the sticks), I have no problem with recoil as I focus on the shot; kind of like a hunting scenario. The Rand pad handles the rest of the recoil situation very well, IMHO.
On the offhand, standing and shooting presents it's own recoil dealings, and I can deal with it just fine without the pad for the string of shots. I can "bear down" better without the Rand pad, and again, the shots are more in the realm of a "hunting" shot, without recoil being anticipated...too much... (I'm pretty much an average built guy, 5' 10" @ 170 lbs.).
In this thread, I don't believe anyone has mentioned the mercury recoil dampeners available these days. I've never talked to anyone who has used the system, and I've read mixed reviews on them. The one thing about them that would be unfavorable to me in a hunting rifle, is that they are rather heavy (from what I've read). Along with the drilling and installing the system, unless there's already a hole through the stock to accommodate the unit, they seem rather spendy, at least to me. Anyone use one? I see Midway offers them, made by Graco.
Been a fun thread,
reinert
Brian Pfleuger
Moderator Emeritus
Nobody feels recoil when they're shooting at an animal. 
Brian Pfleuger
Moderator Emeritus
Yes, but the problem comes in practicing with that gun. A great many folks flinch by habit because they've practiced flinching. Or, they don't practice because they don't like the gun because it kicks too hard. Neither is good for accuracy.
reynolds357
New member
I am not so sure about not feeling recoil when shooting an animal. I shot a turkey with a 3 1/2" mag from the first 3 1/2" shotgun Mossberg built. The gun was notorious for recoil. It hurt no matter what you were shooting it at.
As has been stated, this issue is multifactorial. (1) the shooter's perception of discomfort from recoil - some are much more tolerant than others; (2) stock and recoil pad design will greatly affect comfort level; (3) action - I have little discomfort from firing 12 ga slugs from my Rem 1100, but don't like them much from my sons' 870 or Ithaca pumps. I also never had any problem w. long range sessions with a Garand. (4) purpose: if you are looking at dangerous game that require a powerful cartridge, pick what you need but don't expect to have long sighting-in sessions or practices - e.g., you won't get off too many rounds at a grizzly anyway. Most of all pay attention to stock fit and adequate good quality recoil pads.
Brian Pfleuger
Moderator Emeritus
I must say... I put a LimbSaver slip on recoil pad on my dad's .30-06 which previously had only a metal butt plate. World of difference. LoP is better AND I get a full 1" of squishy pad. It's like a whole new gun.
Brian Pfleuger
Moderator Emeritus
reynolds357
New member
By the way, that was the last time I shot that gun. I sold it a few days later. They were rare and a hot commodity at that time. I had shot it a few times practicing, but was wearing a recoil pad on my shoulder.