Re: In what condition do you carry your 1911

Status
Not open for further replies.
It landed smack dab on the muzzle and discharged striking the shooter right in the bridge of his nose as he was bending over in an attempt to try and catch it. This one was a killer and when I inspected the pistol it was still cocked and locked and the spent casing was still in the chamber. Conclusion on this one was, alterations to the sear, sear spring and modifications to the firing pin and spring.

The impact on the muzzle caused a physics phenomenon that a " body in motion tends to stay in motion "

Whoops.

Although I've pretty much distanced myself from the gun boards recently, I was called into this one from afar.

You forgot the other half of that law, oldfart. The one that says that bodies at rest tend to remain at rest.

A muzzle down discharge on a concrete or similarly hard, tough surface would bring the bullet to an immediate and complete stop, the same as it would if fired straight into a concrete wall. If the bullet even clears the muzzle...on which I have a few doubts...it would flatten out and lay there on the floor...inert and harmless because once it stops, there's no force available to cause it to accelerate again.

At most, it would bounce three or four feet high and fall back to the floor...the same as it would if fired into a steel plate as most of us have seen. It certainly wouldn't retain sufficient energy to cause a fatality.

And if the muzzle struck at an angle that would have let the bullet keep going...which is unlikely to cause an inertial firing pin strike...it would have skidded along the floor at a low angle, endangering a foot or maybe even an ankle at most.

This claim tends to put most of everything else you've said in question.

On topic...

There was no intent by Browning or anyone else to continuously maintain the pistol in Condition One. It CAN be of course, but it wasn't specifically meant TO be. If there was any intent at all on Browning's part, it was to use the half cock as a manual safety.

And once again, I will fade back into the shadows.

Cheers all,

T
 
the poor fellow was bending over attempting to catch that falling gun and well with in 3 feet, if not closer, of the rapidly upward accelerating mass of steel headed towards his face that did strike him and it did kill him

Ah! It was the gun that hit him in the head and killed him. I see.

I wasn't there to see it, but...

The 40-ounce pistol would be 75 times the mass/weight of the bullet...which means that it would accelerate at 1/75th the rate, and be moving at about 1/75th the velocity of the bullet. 830 divided by 75 is a little more than 11 fps. After fighting gravity for three feet, that gun probably struck him at around 10 fps. He may have stumbled backward and hit his head on something else as he fell...but it sure wasn't the gun that killed him.

There have been many yarns spun about John Moses Browning over the years and I have read most of yours.

Besides the half cock being mentioned in the 1910 patents...referred to as the "Safety Position"...it's unlikely that Browning cared or even gave it much thought. He gave the US Army what they asked for, and left the incidentals up to them.

Be well.
 
Last edited:
The 40-ounce pistol would be 75 times the mass/weight of the bullet...which means that it would accelerate at 1/75th the rate, and be moving at about 1/75th the velocity of the bullet. 830 divided by 75 is a little more than 11 fps. After fighting gravity for three feet, that gun probably struck him at around 10 fps. He may have stumbled backward and hit his head on something else as he fell...but it sure wasn't the gun that killed him.

An object traveling 11fps upward against gravity can never reach the height of 2 feet.

-TL
 
(Polizie) they made us chamber a round and carry it cocked and locked. Occasionally caused an accidental discharge into the clearing bucket when firearms were being returned to the arms room.

How does carrying a gun loaded, with the safety engaged, "cause" an accidental discharge? If you mean improperly trained soldiers didn't know how the gun works, I could accept that (a buddy witnessed an AD when a soldier tried to "lower the hammer" on a Thompson SMG . . .").
 
Force equal mass times acceleration! High school physics! This getting better than a caliber war! I see all the forum armchair gun experts are just waiting to pounce! They even seem to be calling each other on their smart phones. The even woke up Tuner! LOL
So the numbers are incorrect?

-TL
 
Hello,

Browning carried his with the hammer down on a loaded chamber.

Thinking was still very much in line with the Colt SAA when the 1911 was born.

The thumb safety was added at the behest of the military so that the horse soldier didn't have to decock while getting a spooked mount under control after-action. In other words, it wasn't designed to be constantly-carried like this.

I have read that the big, long spur hammer was designed to be cocked by snagging it on the trousers to cock it. (This is possibly why the half-cock notch was there, too...) I don't know how true this is, but I've tried it and it seems plausible.

I carry mine cocked'n'locked. Time has proven that method safe, and I've no reason to change to less proven methods.

Regards,

Josh
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top