Range report: Walther PPK vs. Sig P232

TheSkunk, thanks for the specific answer. It does seem like your frame is defective, and I am surprised they haven't just replaced it.

I still think you should have realized the gun would not have a slide stop, and that any dissatisfaction with that is on you.

Did SIG say why they won't replace the gun? Have you asked them to replace it?

If I were you, I would strongly consider finding a SIG certified armorer in your local area, and having him assess the issue. If he concurs with the problem, that might give you the leverage you need with SIG customer service.
 
Mr. Skunk, at this point I'd just get rid of the pistol that's given you so much trouble.

Send it back to Sig and tell them to destroy it, you don't want the POS.

Just let it go. Once and for all.

It's time for you to change horses.

Look at other options. There are many good ones out there.

It's time for you to start shooting. :D
 
Where’s Playboypenbuin Gone??

I was so excited to see this post with Playboypenguin as the author! I always thought he had if not the best, some of the best advice and insights out there! A true shooting enthusiast.

Who cares about how much you like or don’t like Sig … Where’s Playboypenbuin Gone??
 
Mr. Skunk, at this point I'd just get rid of the pistol that's given you so much trouble.

Send it back to Sig and tell them to destroy it, you don't want the POS.
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That gun, the sig p232, is on the back burner. My main guns are a Browning HP, Kimber, Sig 226, and the Seecamp. I hit the range once a week. Right now I can buy 600 rounds of Rem 9mm for $125. That is a much better use of my time than screwing with this piece of garbage p232.

I have been able to rebuild, and tune in, all my pistols including an old broomhandle. Lots of problems are in springs, mags, and polishing parts. I guess I am dumbfounded that a gunmaker couldn't see a major machining mistake.
 
In a p232 if there is a double jam, the slide lock is inside the gun, behind the two jammed bullets. You can't get to it.
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Sure you can. I set it up and do it in practice with mine every now and then.

I went to a gun show yesterday and all I got offered was $200 on a trade in. I got $900 in that gun.
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You didnt tell them your name was theskunk did you? They probably knew you from your posts. :)

The gun has been to Sig twice for repair, and still doesn't work. Sig Sauer America is clueless. They just say "It was manufactured to specs".
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Maybe they shot it and had no problems. What exactly did the repair ticket say?

So that brings us back to the other question, have you let anyone else shoot the gun to prove youre not the problem? You said before that you and SIG were the only people to have shot it. You also stated that you had troubles with your other guns not working as well. Can you understand why maybe some of us might have to wonder?


If I were you, I would strongly consider finding a SIG certified armorer in your local area, and having him assess the issue. If he concurs with the problem, that might give you the leverage you need with SIG customer service.
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That s a very good suggestion. It would also allow you to talk to someone in person who actually looked at the gun and could give you some answers, good or bad.
 
If he has been able to rebuild and retune all his guns the way he says, why don't he just fix the Sig himself?? Makes more sense to me than returning the damn thing.
 
IIRC, his P232 is malformed where the chamber meets the frame. He had a picture in another thread. If it is the one I am thinking of, I don't see how he could fix it.
 
RE: Range report: Walther PPK vs. Sig P232 [Playboypenguin]

"I think anyone with larger hands would prefer the P232 over the PPK."

I take a large size glove and find the larger PPK/S more comfortable but harder to shoot accurately. The smaller PPK allows me to curl my small finger under the grip making for a firm foundation hold allowing for greater accuracy. I remove all finger extensions off any pistol mags as they just get in the way (for me). Likewise the short grip boot J-frames are easy to shoot (for me) because I can get my bottom finger under the grip for a more solid support.

Despite my large hands, my older PPKs have never cut me.

I do not use the the PPK decocker function, but I do use the PPK safety for the hammer block, should the gun drop, this should stop an unwanted discharge. PPK takedown is also easier (for me), do it eyes closed.

Flaws:
Sig 230/232: so-so loaded chamber indicator, too large for pocket carry, too large for ankle carry (best ankle guns are 4 inches or less in height), also bottom mag release is inferior to the push button. No safety.

PPK: Safety lever moves in opposite direction to natural downward movement of the 1911...aargh! It is also heavy by todays standards.

In the looks dept the Sig is the clear winner, 007 notwithstanding. The Sig is streamlined, elegant, and just flat out beautiful.

I own both Walther and Sig products, and for the .380 cartridge, the best Sig is the P238, which has replaced the PPK as my BUG. As for the Sig P230/232, there are lots of good 9mm para pistols in a similar or smaller size, so for me it is more of a collectors/range piece as opposed to ccw carry.

Thanks for the write-up, enjoyed reading your observations.
 
In a p232 if there is a double jam, the slide lock is inside the gun, behind the two jammed bullets. You can't get to it.

Sure you can. I set it up and do it in practice with mine every now and then.
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You have no idea of what you are talking about.
 
If he has been able to rebuild and retune all his guns the way he says, why don't he just fix the Sig himself?? Makes more sense to me than returning the damn thing.
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In order to fix it you need to add metal to the breech, make some custom machine tools, and have access to a lathe and mill. It's a $800 job.
 
You have no idea of what you are talking about.
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I believe its you that needs to do some homework.

I even told you how to do it (post #37), but I see you didnt bother to try, or we wouldnt still be going on about it.

I learned to do the same thing with my PPK's (they dont have external slide stops either) a long time back, and it just carried over to my P230's.

Give it a shot, and I think youll see its in fact, very easy, once youve done it a couple of times.

In order to fix it you need to add metal to the breech, make some custom machine tools, and have access to a lathe and mill. It's a $800 job.
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It would sure be nice if someone who has a similar P232 could take a pic of their breach face, to compare.

Im having a real hard time believing SIG would return the gun to you "twice" with a manufacturing defect, that you claim is that blatant, and especially if they shot the gun and had all the troubles you seem to be having.
 
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P7: Now this just shows how different opinions can be...I would not own one of those ugly and convoluted guns to save my life.
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The P7 is my favorite carry pistol. For perspective, I also like a Glock 19 and Walther PPQ 9mm.

I don't know what convoluted means since the pistol is very simple to operate with no safety selector and the same trigger pull each time. Looks-wise I like it.

That all being said, when I run, it is on the heavy side and I am not sure what do do. I have an LCP but I prefer larger pistols. I have two German PPKs and one stainless Interarms, and three P232s - two black alloy and one stainless.

I started as a PPK person but the lack of safety on the Sig is an improvement. The Sig is lighter and has better sights. I don't see the debate - the Sig is better. The Bond connection of the PPK used to matter to me, but then I figured out that I know more about guns than the author of the books.

I know some have said that the Sig is "large for a 380" and I have wondered about that myself. In the end, weight is what matters more than size. Also size is what makes a gun shootable. I may look at the P232 again and compare it to my Nano 9mm.
 
old thread

Old thread, but here's a comment or two.

I did not see where anybody commented on the weight of the alloy framed P232, which I think is somewhere in the neighborhood of 19 ozs empty. That is significantly less than the all steel PPK or P232 and makes the alloy SIG very portable, will not sag a pocket, and so on. I am not sure if the alloy framed, blue steel P232 is still produced, but it is very convenient to tote. (Granted not a priority on a carry gun, but for a second or third gun, notable).

The P232 is one for the few handguns that my agency authorizes as a BUG, , and I have seen quite a few in action on the line. There has been much discussion about clearing failures (double jams?!??!!!), but my observations have been that the dang things (P232's) are as reliable as bricks. Any probs we've had have all been traced back to cruddy guns ( they get toted in the oddest manners as BUG's) or bad mags.

I find them a pain to work on, small frame, and a pre-tensioned assembly needs to fit back in there on reassembly.

Sleek and sinister looking, pistol, I like'em.
 
I did not see where anybody commented on the weight of the alloy framed P232,
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Post number 5, (obviously written by a well informed and eloquent member ;) ), mentioned the alloy weight difference.

The P232 is one for the few handguns that my agency authorizes as a BUG
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Depending on the agency, both guns have a history of official use. The Beretta 84 and Sphinx AT-380 have also seen official LE approval for both primary or BUG use.

Sleek and sinister looking, pistol, I like'em.
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I'm a huge fan as well, but not all P232s can be called sinister looking. :D Here's "cute" and "sinister" together.

 
PPK/S "Slide bite"

I have an Interarms PPK/S and it WAS a "slide biter"! I managed to eliminate it by carefully removing the "teeth" from the bottom of the slide carefully with a whet stone. This is easily done and touchup cold bluing will hide the bare metal and keep the webbing between thumb and index finger from getting slashed! I also loathe the "finger rest" magazines and like holding my pinkie under the "flat bottomed" mags comfortably. The 3 finger grip is comfortable with the "flat bottomed" magazines for me.

My huge bitch with the weapon for defense use is, the "DA" first pull is waaay too heavy! I haven't tried to disassemble the trigger linkage so that the parts can be polished/honed for less linkage/slide friction. I think this is what is making the "DA" pull a jillion pounds. Anyone had this reduced? The DA pull on my Ruger LC380 is very good, albeit a long pull, but much nicer on first shot. The group size is too large on the LC380 due to "windage" slop in the slide/frame fit I think, so it looks like it will never shoot decent groups for better than 3" groups at around 5-10 yards! Suggestions anyone?

Anyone know a gunsmith that is REALLY familiar with easing DA trigger pull on the PPK/S?
 
Hi W5,

I have both the 232 and PPK. I am not vexed by the triggers on either FOR THEIR PURPOSE.

These are close in combat defense pistols. All I need the triggers to do is make the PPK go bang. If I am aiming, I am too far away. These are not IDPA or PPSC contenduhs.

As Robert Heinlein noted: " Get the first shot off fast. That gives you time to make your second shot perfect."
 
Other than being featured for sale in Gun Digests of years past, has anyone here ever seen or handled one in the flesh so to speak and/or shot a SIG 230 in .22 LR?
 
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