Question someone's NFA item, Yes or No?
- Thread starter 1911rocks
- Start date
jaguarxk120
New member
A public range it would fall on the owner of range to ask. At a private range you are already there as a member thus all members know the rules and would have proper documention with them.
Willie Lowman
New member
If you want to ask about something like that you should not be rude about how you ask.
Something like "Hey buddy, nice MP5! Is that a dealer sample or a transferable?" If they say one way or the other, they probably have the proper paperwork for it. If the response is "Wha? Dealer sample? Transferable? What do you mean?" They probably don't have papers for it.
Or you could run into someone who is sick of those stupid questions that will tell you that they are a CIA assassin or something crazy just to watch your reaction.
Something like "Hey buddy, nice MP5! Is that a dealer sample or a transferable?" If they say one way or the other, they probably have the proper paperwork for it. If the response is "Wha? Dealer sample? Transferable? What do you mean?" They probably don't have papers for it.
Or you could run into someone who is sick of those stupid questions that will tell you that they are a CIA assassin or something crazy just to watch your reaction.
Chipperman
New member
I've never had anyone ask about the legal status of mine. If a stranger came up and asked to see my Forms, they would be met with a hairy eyeball, and a question of, "Who wants to know?"
When people see me shooting my machine guns, they usually smile and keep their distance. When I stop to load mags, they will either say nothing or say, "Cool gun", or a similar remark.
When people see me shooting my machine guns, they usually smile and keep their distance. When I stop to load mags, they will either say nothing or say, "Cool gun", or a similar remark.
richmondtx
New member
I think its rude to poke your nose in someone else's business. If the range allows NFA, I mind my own business, let the person shooting have their fun and compliment them as they are part of a very unique and distinctive club...folks...its NFA...it ain't cheap nor is it easy to acquire these weapons. I've shot my NFA goodies, others have as well without ever a question or glance. We have a policy at our private NFA range...toough guys, curious guys and jerks get thrown out by the owner period...without refunds. We pre-pay for a year, a year in advance and he only has 300 members, the waiting list is huge.
We had one guy who became a LEO (Deputy Sheriff) and he was a member of the range, who decided that he wanted to see paperwork from everyone one shooting two months ago...well everyone had their paperwork, per our range rules and we all knew this guy, but he wanted to be difficult about it. The irony is that the range falls outside his jurisdiction as he was a LEO for a neighboring county. The owner threw him out for harassing patrons without cause and told him to show up with a warrant or keep his butt off private property. Most of my friends are LEOs and they don't know anything about NFA law...heck one of my high school friends is an agent with BATFE and he says that the agents aren't walking encyclopedias on NFA law either. The avg. LEO isn't going to know a Form 1 from a Form 4...they aren't going to know if the forms are real or fake..the only way to find out is to call the NFA Branch and run the serial. I for one keep copies of my forms with my NFA toys, the originals are in a fire proof water tight vault.
We had one guy who became a LEO (Deputy Sheriff) and he was a member of the range, who decided that he wanted to see paperwork from everyone one shooting two months ago...well everyone had their paperwork, per our range rules and we all knew this guy, but he wanted to be difficult about it. The irony is that the range falls outside his jurisdiction as he was a LEO for a neighboring county. The owner threw him out for harassing patrons without cause and told him to show up with a warrant or keep his butt off private property. Most of my friends are LEOs and they don't know anything about NFA law...heck one of my high school friends is an agent with BATFE and he says that the agents aren't walking encyclopedias on NFA law either. The avg. LEO isn't going to know a Form 1 from a Form 4...they aren't going to know if the forms are real or fake..the only way to find out is to call the NFA Branch and run the serial. I for one keep copies of my forms with my NFA toys, the originals are in a fire proof water tight vault.
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David Hineline
New member
I would most likely go over and say. I will show you mine if you show me yours. Anything else would be equal to going to you and getting the serial number off your 1911 and calling the police to see if it's stolen.
Even as a LEO, I always assumed something like that was legal unless I had reason not to. Machineguns are legal in this state, and I really had no more cause to ask for papers than I would have had to check the registration of the cars in the parking lot.
As a private citizen, I have NO authority to ask anything or do anything unless the item is illegal on its face (e.g. if machineguns were illegal), in which case I have the duty as a citizen to report a what I believe is a crime. (Not all citizens would do that, and maybe I wouldn't either, but technically it should be done.)
Jim
As a private citizen, I have NO authority to ask anything or do anything unless the item is illegal on its face (e.g. if machineguns were illegal), in which case I have the duty as a citizen to report a what I believe is a crime. (Not all citizens would do that, and maybe I wouldn't either, but technically it should be done.)
Jim
Forty.Five
New member
It's no ones business but the person shooting. I would leave them alone, as long as the range says you can't use NFA items there.
Don't your forms have personal information on them? Unless its LE asking, I don't see any reason to afford someone like that an answer. If someone wants to call the cops about it, and report "i'm not sure if this guy's gun is legal, can you come ask him?", go for it but you may not get any support.
Chipperman
New member
Yes they do have personal info on them. As stated above, even LEOs don't have a real legal right to see them, as they are tax forms.
With that said, if I were ever accosted at the range by a LEO who would not back down, I would probably end up showing the forms. In a case like that, it's not worth being in the right if you end up in the back of a cruiser for it.
I am assuming that this is a shooting in the USA where NFA are legal scenario? I would be just as likely to ask if the guns he was shooting were stolen, that if the wife who was shooting with him was also his sister or if the car he arrived in was hot. It really is none of my business if he is legal or not as long as he is behaving in a safe manner.
On the other hand for example, if his silencer was made from a coke bottle or some other dubious material I might ask if the $200 tax he paid with the ATF form 1 was worth the cost of the materials. If he gave me a blank look which indicated that he was not aware of the legal requirements, then I would politely explain that while title 2 weapons are legal in most states, the routine ATF authorization also comes along with a $200 tax and there are nasty fines and jail time for those who evade registration or the tax.
Ranb
From my search of the FL statues (790.001), silencers are only mentioned (as weapons) to define them as firearms. I saw nothing that requires their registration in FL law.
Looking at; http://www.leg.state.fl.us/statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&URL=Ch0790/ch0790.htm I see that silencers are not mentioned as a weapon that is banned except when registered. What am I missing?
Even if the law says a silencer has to be registered, a person will has the right to refuse to show the ATF form that it is registered on. Showing it is usually the easiest way to avoid arrest and is something I would do when questioned by the police in a state where registration is required. I live in WA where registration of silencers is not required, but I ended up showing my form 1's to the TSA so they would let me on the plane with silencers in my checked luggage. I was not in the mood to tell them to pack sand, that day.
Ranb