Purchasing a shotgun out of state
- Thread starter XDforever
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According to this Iowa has no daft long gun purchasing laws. Doesn't say anything about residency requirements. Mind you, I didn't look hard.
https://www.nraila.org/gun-laws/state-gun-laws/iowa/
Your age has nothing to do with recoil management. 26 and 434 months myself. Shoot an 870 with no fuss. Mind you, if recoil is an issue due to medical reason(tendons intact?), a semi will help that.
And a pistol gripped stock isn't the same thing as a pistol grip only. Enhances control vs losing it altogether. Don't think they're as forgiving LOP wise though.
https://www.nraila.org/gun-laws/state-gun-laws/iowa/
Your age has nothing to do with recoil management. 26 and 434 months myself. Shoot an 870 with no fuss. Mind you, if recoil is an issue due to medical reason(tendons intact?), a semi will help that.
And a pistol gripped stock isn't the same thing as a pistol grip only. Enhances control vs losing it altogether. Don't think they're as forgiving LOP wise though.
dogtown tom
New member
Sure you did, it's in the link to the ATF document on "State of Residence" above.
They will view you as a resident of Iowa, but you'll have difficulty providing the required documents necessary to show your current residence address.
Note that a "mailing address" is not the same as your "current residence address". A PO Box in Texas or having your mail sent to your sisters house in Abilene doesn't make you a resident of Texas.....you actually have to reside at the address you write on the Form 4473.
If your answer to Que2 on the Form 4473 isn't actually your CURRENT residence address.........you commit a violation of Federal law.
Unfortunately, ATF regs/Federal law don't allow many RVer's to legally acquire firearms. (because they cannot provide the required government issued documents showing current residence address)
My current residence address and my mailing address are one in the same. That same address is on my Texas Driver's License and my Texas Concealed Handgun License. I indeed have a residence in Texas and it is my mailing address. My daughter and her two kids rent my home from us.
Like I said, I have not purchased a gun yet or even initiated it yet. I will keep you informed as the summer progresses. I have not ever tried to purchase a gun outside of Texas before. This will be my first test case. I don't know what the trick is to purchase a long gun in Iowa is, but I assure you I do not intend to lie on form 4473. My residence (as I read it) is a 2500 sq foot house in Texas. I simply vacation in Iowa for 5 months or so during the summer.
As to your comment about ATF not allowing RVers to purchase guns, I have had zero trouble purchasing any of my firearms when in Texas. I actually added the XD Mod 2 9mm FDE handgun to my collection shortly before leaving Texas to come to Iowa.
However, if for some reason, the purchase does not work out, I will simply wait until I get back to Texas in October and do it then. No big deal either way.
Thanks for your concern about my purchase.
Joe
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dogtown tom
New member
To be clear, YOU must actually reside in that home to be considered a Texas resident for the purposes of acquiring a firearm. If you rent the house to someone else and YOU do not live there it is not your current residence address.
Your house in Texas is only considered your residence (for the purposes of acquiring firearms) if you actually reside there.
Search this forum and many others and you'll find a surprising number of RVer's who have used an address where they do not actually reside as their "current residence address". Although they may have a drivers license from a state with an address on it.......that does not mean it is their current residence address.
As far as "zero trouble".......several of those RVer's thought they were fine using the address on their drivers license, even if they never lived at that address. As they actually lived full time in their RV, they could not provide a government issued document that showed their name and current address where their RV may have been parked. Using the address on their drivers license instead of their actual current address means they committed a Federal felony when they signed that Form 4473.
No big deal if you actually reside at a Texas address. HUGE deal if you don't.
Dreaming100Straight
New member
The problem for a CA res buying in other states isn't Federal but CA law. If you do buy in another state, you can't bring it back into CA other then by shipping to a FFL who will run it through the CA bc and charge a hefty fee (like $100 on top of the state's $25 fee.)
As for Fed law, you can take possession of the long guns at the dealers in another state, but handguns have to shipped by the selling dealer to the FFL in your home state, which in this case is CA. Then if it isn't on the CA List of Safe Handguns (the infamous roster) and you aren't an exempt person (Law Enforcement) the gun is shipped back to the selling dealer.
Penal Code 27585
(a) Commencing January 1, 2015, a resident of this state shall not import into this state, bring into this state, or transport into this state, any firearm that he or she purchased or otherwise obtained on or after January 1, 2015, from outside of this state unless he or she first has that firearm delivered to a dealer in this state for delivery to that resident pursuant to the procedures set forth in Section 27540 and Article 1 (commencing with Section 26700) and Article 2 (commencing with Section 26800) of Chapter 2.
Anyhow, if I was to go to NV to do some shooting and bought a nice little Beretta while there, the dealer can sell it and give it to me, but I am in trouble if I drive home with it. It has to be brought into state by delivery to the dealer which the safe bet means shipping via common carrier.
As for Fed law, you can take possession of the long guns at the dealers in another state, but handguns have to shipped by the selling dealer to the FFL in your home state, which in this case is CA. Then if it isn't on the CA List of Safe Handguns (the infamous roster) and you aren't an exempt person (Law Enforcement) the gun is shipped back to the selling dealer.
Penal Code 27585
(a) Commencing January 1, 2015, a resident of this state shall not import into this state, bring into this state, or transport into this state, any firearm that he or she purchased or otherwise obtained on or after January 1, 2015, from outside of this state unless he or she first has that firearm delivered to a dealer in this state for delivery to that resident pursuant to the procedures set forth in Section 27540 and Article 1 (commencing with Section 26700) and Article 2 (commencing with Section 26800) of Chapter 2.
Anyhow, if I was to go to NV to do some shooting and bought a nice little Beretta while there, the dealer can sell it and give it to me, but I am in trouble if I drive home with it. It has to be brought into state by delivery to the dealer which the safe bet means shipping via common carrier.
Blindstitch
New member
Well I'm curious to see how Joe makes out.
I'm pretty sure he's paying taxes on that said home and probably doesn't have a lease for his family living there.
If he finds the shotgun that he wants the only test will be filling out the 4473. If the DOJ says it's good then he's fine. If not then he can buy the shotgun in Texas. No big deal.
I'm pretty sure he's paying taxes on that said home and probably doesn't have a lease for his family living there.
If he finds the shotgun that he wants the only test will be filling out the 4473. If the DOJ says it's good then he's fine. If not then he can buy the shotgun in Texas. No big deal.
dogtown tom
New member
Guess I struck a sore spot pointing out ATF regs huh? Sorry if I hurt your feelings, but my posts were intended to keep you from committing a Federal crime.
But go ahead, knock yourself out.
Paying taxes on a home has nothing to do with a buyer/transferees state of residence or current residence address for the purposes of acquiring a firearm.
The ATF (not DOJ) has already ruled on what is considered a buyers state of residence. And since the buyer is the one to sign the form 4473 only he knows whether his responses are true, correct and complete, and it's the buyers responsibility to read the instructions on every Form 4473.
The FBI NICS is never told the buyers residence address, only "state of residence".
ATF doesn't say "it's good" as to whether a buyer correctly indicated his state of residence on the 4473. They'll never see that 4473 until after the buyer already signed it.
No big deal.
dogtown tom
New member
A dealer in Nevada can only transfer rifles or shotguns to nonresidents....and those firearms must be legal to possess in the buyers state of residence.
Any dealer in Nevada who sells and transfers a handgun (or any firearm other than a rifle or shotgun) to someone who is not a Nevada resident will lose his FFL pretty darn quick.
If you are a Cali resident the NV dealer will not transfer the handgun to you because FEDERAL law prohibits such a transfer. You can pay for it and give him the contact info for your dealer in Cali to receive the transfer.
My word guys - it seems like this is getting off the rails..../ man says he's a TX resident, has a TX drivers license.....and he says he's vacationing in Iowa....why the heck do we care what the laws in CA - or NV - or NY are....
Let him & the Iowa gun dealer figure it out...../ and apparently Bass Pro says it's fine.....
Let him & the Iowa gun dealer figure it out...../ and apparently Bass Pro says it's fine.....
Theohazard
New member
What is your deal? Dogtown is giving you good advice. You have stated that you don't currently reside in your house in Texas. You're renting out that house and you're currently living in an RV in Iowa. So for the purpose of buying a firearm per federal law, you're a resident of Iowa.XDforever said:
If you go to buy a firearm and you use your Texas address as your state of residence, you'll be committing a felony; it doesn't matter what address is on your drivers license. And yet you're somehow upset about Tom pointing this out?
At this point you're breaking forum rules by stating your intent to commit a felony. Not only that, but I wouldn't recommend openly stating your intent to commit a felony on a public forum.
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Theohazard
New member
Neither of those things make any difference when it comes to federal law regarding residency requirements for buying a firearm. It doesn't matter what's on your drivers license; it doesn't matter where you pay taxes; it doesn't matter where your state home of record is; it doesn't matter how many homes you own or where they are. All that matters is where you currently reside. Yes, you can use your drivers license to prove your residence, but if that address on your license isn't actually where you currently reside, then you can't use that address on the 4473.Blindstitch said:
The OP has stated that he's currently living in an RV in Iowa and he's renting out his home in Texas. That means he's currently a resident of Iowa for the purpose of buying a firearm per federal law.
No. How will they automatically know if he's lying on the 4473 or not? He can easily lie on the form and claim his Texas residence as his current address, even though he's renting out that home and he doesn't currently live there.Blindstitch said:
Sure, it's highly unlikely that he'll get caught, but it's still a felony. And there's no automatic way for an authority to determine that he's lying about his address without an actual investigation.
I've had more than one customer fill out the 4473, pass their background check, and then right before I finished the sale they casually mention that they don't actually reside at the address they put on the 4473 (even though that's one of the first questions I ask before I have them start the form). At that point I have to stop the sale and sort things out, because they just admitted to me that they lied on the 4473.
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Blindstitch
New member
Sounds more like we have a list of guys that should get a hold of the ATF and have them address people who temporarily reside in RV's.
Nobody here wants a felony for being a legal gun owner just trying to practice their right.
Sounds like you better go home and sleep in your house for how ever long the ATF thinks is required to call your house your residence.
If an RV is parked in a garage or barn at your residence are you living there?
Nobody here wants a felony for being a legal gun owner just trying to practice their right.
Sounds like you better go home and sleep in your house for how ever long the ATF thinks is required to call your house your residence.
If an RV is parked in a garage or barn at your residence are you living there?
Theohazard
New member
The issue isn't whether people who live in RVs are residents of that state, the issue is being able to prove it. The ATF doesn't "address" people, generally the state does. The problem is that it's often hard to get the state to recognize an RV as a residence and issue you the appropriate documentation to prove it.
At our shop, we've had customers who lived in RVs. Our state allowed them to use the address of their RV's parking spot as their official address, and this satisfied the federal residency requirements for the 4473.
At our shop, we've had customers who lived in RVs. Our state allowed them to use the address of their RV's parking spot as their official address, and this satisfied the federal residency requirements for the 4473.
Theohazard
New member
I have a question for you: What you wrote here makes it look like you actually live in your RV even when you're in Texas. Are you simply using your house as a mailing address but not actually physically living there? Do you rent your house out even when you're in Texas and live in your RV instead? If that's the case, you committed a federal felony each time you bought a gun and put that address on the 4473.XDforever said:
We are at the address in question for at least 5 months out of the year.
My goodness, I never thought asking a simple question about purchasing a shotgun out of state would have brought this firestorm down upon my head. I am perfectly legal in Texas. My question only pertained to buying a gun out of state.
Thank you guys, Dogtown, and Theohazard, for pointing out the intricacies of the form 4473. I do believe I get it.
Can we now move on?
Joe
My goodness, I never thought asking a simple question about purchasing a shotgun out of state would have brought this firestorm down upon my head. I am perfectly legal in Texas. My question only pertained to buying a gun out of state.
Thank you guys, Dogtown, and Theohazard, for pointing out the intricacies of the form 4473. I do believe I get it.
Can we now move on?
Joe
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