Prefered elk cartridge for a 300 yard shot.

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Chain a winch to a convenient tree. Use a bunch of snatch blocks and 1/4" cable. Drag the elk right to you. :)

Cheaper than a new rifle.
 
What bullet is he shooting, or did I miss that?

Upgrading to a good 180gr bullet is probably the easiest answer, as well as spending more time behind the bench. 250-300 yards with a 30-06 and a correct projectile is good elk medicine. The proof is in my freezer ;)


If you can get him onto the shoulder with a Barnes bullet, you really don't lose much meat. I've been very impressed with the lack of shock to the meat with tough bullets, monolithic and bonded.
 
Thanks art, that is sound advice and would never go after elk without a winch around. A 60lb battery and a 40lb winch are much easier to maneuver up and down rough country than a whole elk. We are lazy and don't skin them on the mountain like we should. Only once has one died close enough to use the winch on the atv.
 
well, my 300 weatherby kills elk deader than dead, and if you're not careful, the one behind it as well. great long range gun, hell of a kick though, I usually down load mine into win mag velocities so I stop getting dummy ringed with it.

second choice would be the 264... the flattest trajectory at the cost of bullet weight and initial wound size.
 
Tahuna I love my mark v 300 but I don't shoot uphill. I guess if it was a monster bull I would. The 264 was my long range whitetail buster for years but I shoot the 300 wsm more now. It's more because of the rifle than the caliber. Fil should be able to handle the recoil of the 264 much easier but factory loads now days are very puny. Not saying its any better than the 06 but if he insists on a change it may very well be the best bet for him.
 
Boogershooter, I saw some guys up in Doctor Park above Gunnison who had 1,000 feet of cable on their truck winch. Made life easy to use snatch blocks and haul a whole elk up out of a canyon.

Easy enough to set up an "extension cord" of cable on a reel and tote it along on an atv.
 
Art that is alot of cable. More winch than what we carry. I swapped over to the rope just a couple weeks ago. Allows more length on the spool because of the smaller diameter and no burrs to worry about. I havnt tested mine yet but have seen it used at several mud rides. Seems to be the new thing. Smaller diameter, less weight, and no burrs is hard to overlook.
 
So, to make sure I'm understanding correctly, here's my recap...

FIL, so you don't want to piss him off too much.
He's stubborn, like most of us are.
His spot is a good one.
Elk isn't dying soon enough, which makes it a PITA for you to retrieve.
He's using enough gun (.30/06) but pretty terrible ammo (CoreLokt).

Here's what I would do, if it were me. My advice is free, so it's worth what you paid for it. I do wish you the best of luck, and hope you let us know how it works out.

- I didn't see anywhere where you said what optics he's using. You might consider an upgrade to a larger/more powerful scope to help make 300yds seem closer, and help with accuracy.

- I would sight him in with a 300yd zero, if you're not already, which it sounds like you are.

- If you can find them, I'd use 200gr Accubonds for this job. 180gr Accubonds would be my next choice, followed by 180gr Barnes TSX.

- Since he's not willing to move his spot, I would do everything I could to help his accuracy from his spot. That means setting him up with a good solid rest, maybe even a bench-type setup, depending on how much work it would be to do it.

- I'd make him practice. A lot. Using the same setup you're going to put in his hunting spot. If he won't do that, then I wouldn't take him, period. It's not fair to the animal if we don't do our part. Hang a 10" steel plate at 300yds and make him ping it.

- There is some value in the idea of using more gun, since this application isn't far from the limits of the .30/06. The .325 WSM would be my next choice, followed by the .338 WM, though I do favor short-actions over belted magnums. Only you and he can determine if upgrading is worth it. If upgrading, I would go bigger than a .30" bore size.

- The winch/cable idea mentioned above is a very good one if all else fails. A couple of pulleys and a few hundred feet of 3/16" cable would be worth it, especially if you could carry enough cable to use with an ATV winch. You only get 50ft or so of pulling with the ATV winch, but you can use something like this to help out. You hook your winch cable into the loop, and grip the extension cable with the grab, winch in 50 ft, spool out the winch while sliding the cable grab down the extension cable, and repeat.

Again, best of luck, hope this helps.
 
Boogershooter,

It ain't a cartridge that kills; it's what a bullet destroys that does. A .308 Win will kill the biggest elk that's ever lived just as dead as a .375 H&H Mag assuming bullets from either destroy hearts and or lungs.

Huge elk are killed every year with archery equipment. I'd rather shoot an elk with a .243 Win than with an arrow.

I will tell you that a 160 grain Partition fired from a 7MM Rem Mag will kill elk that weigh better than 900 pounds. One shot through-and-through its chest that destroyed its heart, and he's now on my wall.

Your father-in-law already has what might be the best North American big game cartridge. My advice is to get him more range time. I will guarantee you that if he puts an '06 bullet through equipment necessary for topside blood flow, he will be quartering elk. Nothing living remains in that condition without oxygenated blood to its brain. That's biological fact, and we can't change biology.
 
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The new Boone & Crockett record Yukon moose, the largest of North America's three species of moose, was killed a couple years ago by Mr. Heinz Naef of Dawson City, Yukon with a .303 British: http://www.adn.com/article/20140205/world-record-moose-shot-yukon

It ain't what cartridge you're using, it's what bullets from the cartridge you're using destroy. Nothing living remains in that condition for more than seconds without its heart and/or lungs working. Without oxygenated blood, brains stop working before you can get your quartering saw out.
 
I completely agree that he needs more range time. Problem is he thinks that 2 or 3 shots at a 16 inch gong at 300 yards is good enough. He'd rather tell stories about all the great shots he's made over the years. His optics are quite capable. Thanks for all the helpful opinions.
 
Sometimes when I read stuff like this I wonder if the father in law has a thread going somewhere about the son in law.
 
Honestly, none of the rifles will do what your FIL wants it to do any better than his .30-06. What you have to change is your FIL, and where he shoots his elk. If elk are dropping off into the nasty terrain after being shot, you have to change where he's shooting them.
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I have to agree. It's like stopping a car by shooting a hole in the gas tank. Unless you break the chassis or kill the engine, it's not going down until it bleeds out. Doesn't really matter what caliber you use that's passing through the ribs. I just don't see that much meat on the shoulder that's worth taking a bleed-out shot to save, but the simple truth is, he can't have it both ways. If he wants to save that extra pound of burger meat on the shoulder, he's going to have to go down in the ravine and recover it.
 
Getting elk back to the vehicle is the toughest part of the hunt, no doubt. When I first started hunting them in the early 90's we used to ground skin, quarter, and then pack each quarter out on a pack frame. If there were four of us, that equaled one trip, if there were only two of us we made two trips. For the last 7 or so years we now still ground skin them but use the gutless method, leaving I don't know how many pounds of worthless bones behind. If your divide the lose meat between the hind quarters front shoulders you can easily pack out and entire elk in three trips with each pack load weighing in the 80 pound range. Sounds like a lot but with a good pack it is truly not all that hard. Only twice in my time hunting elk have we been able to get the vehicle right up to the animal(s), and I hope for it every year but it's just not that common where we hunt.
 
IF it was me I would go with a tried and true 30-06. That is an all american round!

Most any thing that you can shoot accuratly enough to hit at 300 yards will have the power to be effective if a vital is hit.
 
I've had good luck taking Wyoming bulls with my .308 rifle but my longest shot was approx. 225 yards. I suggest a rifle chambered for 7mm Remington MAG for those long shots. Recoil is about the same as a 30-06 which isn't too bad at all.

Jack
 
I've stayed out of this discussion since I'm not much of an elk hunter but since it's staying close to the top, I'll give my opinion.
I've only shot 5 elk before health and money took elk hunting out of my life. Two of them were under 100 yards with the 7mm Rem mag and it performed quite well. The other 3 were 300 yards plus with the 300 Win mag. As far as I'm concerned, the 300 WM is the top choice. It hammers the elk with more authority(perceived) than the smaller calibers. Immediate bullet effect is more apparent(my experience) and the animals were obviously showing signs of being hit.
In addition, the 300WM is all the gun I can handle well so the answer is plain. I've watched guys hitting all over the target with 338 Win mags and bigger while commenting the rifle was "good to 400 yards". My Son killed his first bull with one shot from a 30/06 while one of the .338 guys fired 5 times and the guides spent half the night finding it.
 
So every year, more or less, your FIL reliably bags an elk. And nearly every time, it falls into a ravine, making recovery difficult.

Man.....I wish I had that problem.........
 
Arizona I know I should appreciate the opportunities I have and truely I do. It's just a hard pill to swallow when he isn't willing to make any changes that would make my family's trip much more enjoyable. Glad the old fart is still hunting.
 
We always used to try and get our elk out whole - until one year we had no choice but to quarter and drag/pack one out due to terrain and blowdown. It turned out to be the easiest and quickest recovery we'd ever done...and left us wondering why we ever tried to get one of those beasts out in one piece. Since then we've only tried to get one animal out whole, just because there was a road we could drive in on 300 yds downhill from the kill site. And then we had to call for help to get in into the truck bed because the boy and I of us couldn't quite do it. If help hadn't been only 20 minutes away it would have been butchered right there. It's really easier that way.
 
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