Pelosi and Illegal Immigration

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BoringAccountant

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Rep. Pelosi criticizes border fence...

Can someone please argue her side for me? I am not sure why a fence is a bad idea. Her one line argument against it mentioned in this article states that it divides communities in the rural southwest. I am sure she has other reasons for not wanting it, so please someone help explain her side.

I just don't see any rational (this is based on me not knowing her whole argument yet) thought to why a fence is a bad idea, other than the price in dollars it may cost, compared to the price it costs us Americans to raise and educate illegal immigrants.
 
Why stop at a fence? Why not build a giant cement wall - and let's make sure that it goes at least 40 feet under the ground so them pesky illegals can't tunnel past them.

Turrets for sniper nests every 200 yards.

In WWI, the "cowards" who hid in craters and holes during the (suicidal) infantry charges quickly realized that phosgene and chlorine gas had a tendency to settle in low places.

Dig a giant trench on the Mexico side of the wall and pump _____ in it.
 
The dual fence with road between will work along with sensors and patrols,
something must be done as the problem will only increase with time.

The senator is playing for votes as usual.

The question I always have is how many can the USA take in, what is an
end number that would satisfy the cheap/slave labor crowd. Increased
population at our current rate will break the system in time and I believe
we see signs of that now.
 
I don't see it as viable or necessary

unless we are prepared to build a fence along the Canadian border as well, and while we are at it, along the Alaskan/Canadian border...what a waste of time worrying about border fences...don't we have some sort of war we need to focus on right now?:rolleyes:
 
Why stop at a fence? Why not build a giant cement wall - and let's make sure that it goes at least 40 feet under the ground so them pesky illegals can't tunnel past them.

Turrets for sniper nests every 200 yards.

In WWI, the "cowards" who hid in craters and holes during the (suicidal) infantry charges quickly realized that phosgene and chlorine gas had a tendency to settle in low places.

Dig a giant trench on the Mexico side of the wall and pump _____ in it.
Click to expand...

I like the idea and I think we could cut the cost a lot by using the Illegals to build it. Pick them up and sentence them to 6 weeks on the fence and then deport them. In fact I bet we could pay someone on the Mexican side of the border to house them for a 6 week stay while they worked on the fence. Let’s face it their government is really only interested in the money they send back so I’m sure some sort of deal could be worked out. We pay them to house them and it cost us a whole lot less than if we kept them here.

There is no question that the “cost” of a wall is a red herring. It’s a bogus argument. I’ll bet you that if the Dems / liberals could get the legislation to confiscate all the guns in the country they would be on it so fast it would give you whiplash. Despite the cost of sending officers to every one of 200+ million doors in the country to collect all the privately owned firearms. So the “cost” is not the issue. There is some other agenda lurking in the background.

Frankly I think we should build a wall about 70 feet high and sink it about an equal distance underground and make it wide enough to put a 4 lane road on top of it. The cost would still be less than what they are costing us now.
 
does she have a fence around her home? does she have armed security? if yes to both, she is a proven hypocrite!:D
 
Alnamvet...

Even though illegals come from all sides of the country when they enter, Mexico is a prime spot for them to cross, I mean that shouldnt be a disputed fact, so why not start where the main problem rests?
Second, don't skirt the issue about illegal immigration, I know there is a war going on, but that does not negate the fact we have a serious problem with illegal immigration.
 
The dual fence with road between will work along with sensors and patrols,
something must be done as the problem will only increase with time.
Click to expand...

Already law, funded,and underway and the 'Virtual wall' is built but has software bugs that still need worked out (at the great frustration of more then a few).

I believe Madmag said it quite well:
One of the best ways to help Mexico is to secure our borders and force the pressure to build in Mexico to the point where the Mexican people demand better government.
Click to expand...
 
I don't buy it Dan

Prime spot....a little up north...a lot down south...it's all illegal if it's done without proper documentation...so the bottom line is a fence on ALL US continental borders or no fence at all...and let me skirt this issue again...we have more pressing issues than to try to deport upwards of 200+ million people (will never ever happen) and build a Berlin like wall on our southern border (which ain't gonna' happen either)...just plain ignorant as far as I'm concerned, to think that building a fence can be possible, given the state of the world as a whole today, building a fence should be the last thing on our radar, if at all. That's my take on this matter, and I'm stickin' to it.
 
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I am against a fence ONLY for the fact that it would be the preceived solution to all the immigration problems.

Let's say a nice 8-foot tall fence is built. Congress gives speeches saying that now the borders are secured and they solved the immigration problem and now they can concentrate on other things. Funding for border patrol and ICE gets cut (immigration problem is solved, so why give them more money), enforcement begins to get lax, states become more open to the illegal immigrants still there.

Then the immigrants figure out how to build a 9-foot ladder and dig tunnels. Since the BP is lacking funds and had to cut patrols, the immigration problem comes back. Again American citizens start complaining like we are now but this time it is harder to get our government to do something because they have already fixed the problem before. "We already built a fence, what more do you want!"

We need a comprehensive immigration PACKAGE.
 
I'll go along with El Barto with an Alnamvet twist...

allow the undocumented here already to stay, and pay, say a $5000 fine/cost of documetation fee...small price when you figure that many of these undocumented paid a hell of a lot more to crooked "coyotes"...this fee could be spread out over a period of time, say, when they become eligible to become naturalized US citizens, all that's owed must be paid up. Now we can refocus our attention on assisting countries to the south and coming up with a immigration package that would make it unattractive to enter the US undocumented...sounds simple, eh?;)
 
I calculated it out once, and I believe if a wall was built that cost $1 million dollars per mile (which is what it cost Israel to build a wall), it would still only cost less than half of 1% of ONE year's defense budget to build.

My plan to stop illegal immigration would be to build a wall to keep new arrivals out as the first step. Of the 12 million already here illegally, I would not round them up, but as they come into contact with the system, simply deport them then.

For example, if an illegal is arrested for DUI, deport him after he is determined to be illegal. If one gets appendicitis, deport him when he leaves the hospital. You could work the 12 million number down very quickly without any round up.
 
My calculations

assuming there are 200 million undocumented, would yield about one trillion dollars in revenue added to our treasury...this is the more humanitarian and most fiscally responsible approach...$5000 buys you amnesty, documents, and future citizenship...
 
assuming there are 200 million undocumented, would yield about one trillion dollars in revenue added to our treasury...this is the more humanitarian and most fiscally responsible approach...$5000 buys you amnesty, documents, and future citizenship...
Click to expand...

I think 200 million is a typo. There's only 300 million folks in the US, and somewhere between 100-150 million in Mexico.

Also... the $5000 number is a joke. It will be "pro-rated" indefinitely and/or sent to collections with no results.

Finally - Are we the type of country that sells citizenship? Or do you actually pledge your loyalty and fidelity to the rule of law here? Doesn't seem the best way to start a law-abiding relationship by granting amnesty to folks for breaking our laws in the first place.
 
200 million?
Fine? Why would they pay your stinking fine any more readily than they would apply for a visa?
I don't understand how the stupid gubmint can continue to try to keep people from speeding in their cars, parking illegally, hunting out of season, peeing in public, not putting nutrition labels on popcorn, etc. Too many people break the laws so we should just forget about them and hope for the best.
 
Yep....20,000,000 undocumented...

Sorry...100 billion dollars generated....$5000 is no joke...heck, it costs 6-8 times as much to keep someone encarcerated for a year on a misdemeanor...not counting the legal costs for defense attorneys, appeals, etc...yep...can be done...and, it's not buying legal status, it's paying for the illegal status that they are in for committing that most horrific crime of undocumented entry in the US...eligibility to become a citizen would be contingent on paying the $5000 "fine"...I think most, if not all, would jump at the chance of having their very lives finally documented and legal within our borders...it's a no brainer for those with the ability to look at the big picture.;)
 
allow the undocumented here already to stay, and pay, say a $5000 fine/cost of documetation fee
Click to expand...

$5K to buy off a very serious crime??? My wife and I pay half that annually in bridge tolls. Run a red light and get caught illegally in the diamond lane in California and you’ll pay nearly $1K. Get a DUI and in the end, it will cost you $20K. If we were to let them stay, the fine needs to be $100K just to make a dent in the services they’ll get in a lifetime. $5K doesn’t even pay for the time I’ve spent thinking about the issue.

BTW: Just in case this isn’t yet clear the 200m number is wrong. Government admits to 25m, more likely 40m or 50m here.
 
If the illegals and the people who hire them were put together in jails along the southern border for lengthy periods at a time before being released, then the problem would go away. Do sting operation towards businesses which hire illegals. It's time.
 
That's what you get for living in Cali

drinking and driving, driving in the diamond lane, and running red lights....oh, and having to take the toll roads...haven't you and your spouse learned a lesson by now? Now, to get back on topic...$5000 may see like a slap on the wrist, but I'd like to see what the cost would be to deport, encarcerate, every single undocumented, and build a wall on our southern, northern, and Alaskan/Canadian border...do the math high rolling Bonnie & Clyde from Cali.;)
 
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