Open Carry California

W

woodguru

New member
Open carry is already legal in California, and those guys openly carrying in Starbucks on the San Francisco peninsula are opening a can I'd rather see left alone. It wasn't in the anti gun public eye and it needs to be left under their radar.

The guys doing it ... wear big stupid looking Glocks with two mags on the holster that stick five inches out to the side. They look uncomfortable and conspicuous and it makes people uncomfortable that someone makes such a big issue about it.

Meanwhile when I have had a reason to make sure I am armed I carry in the 3:30/4:00 tilted forward and nobody even notices I'm carrying a gun. I'm sure it's because I'm comfortable with it that even when someone sees it they are unconcerned as well.

My point is that low key use of this open carry oversight from another era is in order. It's my opinion that it's just plain stupid to bring attention to this in a state known for it's strong anti gun activism. Having a right doesn't mean it has to be unnecessarily pushed

I have to say I didn't even know you could open carry in this state until I saw a piece on it, and then I was irritated that guys would try to make a point out of an issue they will lose for everyone if they make too big a deal out of it.

I had a police and sheriff departments documented case of extortion and seriously threatening incidents and carried everywhere I went for almost two years because I was in very real danger. I am getting my CWP as a result but carried in as low key a manner as I could regardless. Once I realized I could legally open carry instead of covering the gun with a sweatshirt or rugby shirt I exposed it and kept a mag accessible to my left hand for easy loading.

I called the police department and asked what the department's take on open carry is. They told me if a citizen in a Starbuck's or a store were to call it in it is up to the individual officers that respond. They said as long as I'm calm and do as I'm told it shouldn't result in any problems but that I might be proned if I got an excitable officer.
 
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I've seen the news with the Starbucks carriers. It did seem a bit overplayed by many of the bearers of handguns--cocked and locked 1911s looking like they were ready for an IPSC shoot with extra magazines strapped all over!

To me an open carry shouldn't look too tactical. A nice leather holster like this would suit me fine:

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And, actually, I wouldn't mind carrying the SW 41 open. It's a nice classic handgun that I think looks very appealing:

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When the democrat bill banning open carry came up for a vote here in kalifornia my wife figured out where all the local schools were located and strapped on her J frame. We went to Costco, Trader Joe's, and the movies. No one said a word or noticed. We took a few pictures. It was a non-event. My advice is to make sure you know where all the schools are located.
 
Low Key

This setup fits perfectly to where I forget I have it on.

The pistol is a Beretta model 86 that is smaller than it looks. The holster will hold a mag but it makes the thickness profile fatter.

P1030661.jpg
 
open carry is a right, people acting a fool because they see someone legally carrying a gun does not mean people should not open carry. it means we need to educate people, which is what these people carrying at Starbucks are doing.
 
Teirst said:
...it means we need to educate people, which is what these people carrying at Starbucks are doing.
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Which they pretty much failed to do. And as a result, the RKBA community had to scurry to get the bill banning unloaded open carry defeated -- which it just managed to do, by one vote in the second house (it passed handily in the first).

And remember, open carry isn't legal in California. Unloaded open carry is legal. But it used to be that openly carrying a loaded gun was legal. That all changed when a bunch of Black Panthers annoyed too many of the wrong people by exercising their right to openly carry loaded guns.
 
The real shame is that in a country where you are supposed to be "innocent until proven guilty" it is assumed that "an armed man is a criminal", the US Constitution be damned.
 
Here we go again :rolleyes:.

I wasn't aware that being stupid and open carrying was any different than being stupid and carrying concealed (ie: wearing one of those CCW badges, printing on your wife beater, being loud "CAN YOU SEE MY GUN, STEVE??? OK GOOD I HOPE NO ONE ELSE CAN" etc etc).

When done properly, open carry serves as a very tangible argument to many anti-gun arguments. The same is true for concealed carry. When done improperly, it does not help us. The same is true for concealed carry.

I'm not suggesting that people don't have a right to carry in a fashion that I think is "improper", I'm only saying that it doesn't help us make the argument for gun rights.

What is improper OCing? Like concealed carrying, use common sense. Don't touch the gun, don't rest your hand on it, don't be loud and obnoxious, keep an open stance and polite mannerisms, don't dress like ANY stereotype, wear a nice retention holster, etc etc.

EDIT: See fiddletown's post on how to NOT open carry :p

It did seem a bit overplayed by many of the bearers of handguns--cocked and locked 1911s looking like they were ready for an IPSC shoot with extra magazines strapped all over!
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Bringing up the 1911 cocked-and-locked thing again? There is more to this than that.
 
SwampYankee said:
The real shame is that in a country where you are supposed to be "innocent until proven guilty" it is assumed that "an armed man is a criminal", the US Constitution be damned.
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Are you saying that there's something about being innocent until proven guilty in the Constitution? If so, where might that be?

And in California, at least, a person openly carrying a gun is a criminal unless the gun is not loaded. So wearing a gun openly in California would be probable cause to detain the individual to determine whether or not the gun is loaded. Upon determining that the gun is not loaded, of course an LEO can then determine that no crime was committed. But that can not be determined until the gun has been examined.
 
fiddletown said:
And in California, at least, a person openly carrying a gun is a criminal unless the gun is not loaded. So wearing a gun openly in California would be probable cause to detain the individual to determine whether or not the gun is loaded. Upon determining that the gun is not loaded, of course an LEO can then determine that no crime was committed. But that can not be determined until the gun has been examined.
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Man I feel bad for you guys out there.

Here in MI, loaded OC is legal. Obviously, it is illegal to be OCing and be a felon. MI is also not a "stop and ID" state, meaning that police can ask for your ID but you do not have to give it to them (this is different if you have committed a crime, obviously). Many OCers in MI have been stopped, disarmed, put in a police car, and ID'd under the argument that the police do not know if you're a felon, so they can stop you to make sure you're not committing the crime of being a felon in possession of a firearm. Some OC'ers refused to provide ID because they don't have to. This has caused some problems. There is an Attorney General opinion that states that carrying a firearm in the open is not probable cause, so there is no obligation to provide ID. Some unlucky jurisdictions have been successfully sued for unlawful Terry Stops in which the cop used the "I need to make sure you're not a felon" argument when asking for ID and then detaining a person who does not provide ID.

It saddens me that in CA, you can be stopped to "make sure the gun isn't loaded" when there is no probable cause to believe the gun might be loaded :(
 
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Sefner wrote: "It saddens me that in CA, you can be stopped to "make sure the gun isn't loaded" when there is no probable cause to believe the gun might be loaded."

Sefner, that's just the tip of the iceburg in this pathetic excuse for free a state. :mad: I've live here all my life and I've seen the long, slow degeneration of this state into terminal liberalism and I don't think there's a chance of a snowball in hell it'll change unless the courts force it to.
 
Standing Wolf said:
Those who are afraid to exercise their civil rights don't still have them.
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Care to provide some examples?

On the other hand, it used to be legal to openly carry a loaded gun in California.
 
I have to say I didn't even know you could open carry in this state until I saw a piece on it, and then I was irritated that guys would try to make a point out of an issue they will lose for everyone if they make too big a deal out of it.
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You are a living contradiction, my friend.

You didn't know it was legal 'till you saw it on TV, you were against them doing it in a way that informed you of your legal ability to open carry, but admit to doing it yourself?

Good grief. .

Daryl
 
You truly can't open carry legally unless you are way out in the wilderness of CA. The 1000 ft gun free school zone prohibits the free exercise of open carry. Plan out a route to open carry going through LA for instance:

http://maps.google.com/maps?client=s...d=0CDEQtgMwAA#
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Alaska:

That map is a huge exaggeration, and is a gross distortion of reality.

California law only makes it illegal to have a gun within 1,000 ft of a K-12 school. Many of the dots on that map are not such schools. They include things like numerous daycares, beauty salon schools, language schools, trade schools from truck driving to film school, Art schools, Seminaries, even an Islamic Learning Center.

For colleges there is no 1,000 ft rule. You just cannot bring your gun onto the campus of the school.

In any event, the situation is not as bad as that map makes it out to be.

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Open carry is already legal in California, and those guys openly carrying in Starbucks on the San Francisco peninsula are opening a can I'd rather see left alone. It wasn't in the anti gun public eye and it needs to be left under their radar.

The guys doing it ... wear big stupid looking Glocks with two mags on the holster that stick five inches out to the side. They look uncomfortable and conspicuous and it makes people uncomfortable that someone makes such a big issue about it.
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Woodguru:

Actually, you have not researched this subject well. Because of the efforts of these men, the Sunnyvale Police Department put out a memo to its officers explaining to them that it is perfectly legal to open carry. The men are not causing any problems whatsoever.

You can read the police memo here:

http://www.opencarryradio.com/documents/Sunnyvale_California_Memo_18_Sep_09.pdf


You do have a point, though, about open carrying large black pistols like the Glock. Those fellows are open carrying big evil looking guns like Glock 17's and Beretta 92's If one does open carry, it would be preferable that one instead carry a smaller handgun. The pistol will not cause as much alarm among the general public, if it is just a little handgun.

When ignorant people see someone with a large, menacing black gun, and they are going to assume that the person is up to no good. When people think of Glocks, this is often what they think of:

50-cent-50-cent-gun-10763682.jpg


So instead, carry a gun with a shiny nickel finish. A deluxe wood grip, and fancy engraving on the gun would be nice things too. People will not associate that type of handgun with bad guys.

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SO to clarify (because i have a hard time understanding/believing it) I can OPEN carry my gun, as long as im not within 1K feet of a school, LEGALLY anywhere in California?:confused:
 
You cannot open carry at airports in California. The within 1,000 ft school restriction is only on k-12 grade schools. However, at colleges and universities, you cannot open carry on the school campus itself.

Government buildings and the property they are on are also a big no-no. Don't ever go to the post office open carrying. You cannot carry any weapons of any kind into a post office.

Keep in mind that shopping malls are generally private property, and as property owners, they can forbid guns being on their property. They can thus ask you to leave. And if you refuse to leave, you can then be arrested for trespassing, and or disorderly conduct.

Tasers are perfectly legal to own and carry concealed in California, and their ownership is not regulated at all by the state. However, you still have to avoid going onto school or other government property carrying them.

I always take my Taser with me when I visit California.

Keep in mind too, that the handgun has to be unloaded. Any rounds at all in the gun, and you are breaking the law and can be arrested. So ammo has to be carried separately. The ammo itself can even actually be carried concealed.

There is a real good tutorial on open carry in California that you can view on You Tube here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1szBxnAEsMw

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And remember, open carry isn't legal in California. Unloaded open carry is legal. But it used to be that openly carrying a loaded gun was legal. That all changed when a bunch of Black Panthers annoyed too many of the wrong people by exercising their right to openly carry loaded guns.
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Exactly. What most people don't connect is that the RIGHT to be armed was removed by racist liberals that wanted to make sure that blacks were unarmed. All anti-gun people are racists, they may spew their party lines about the laws are for "protecting the people from gun crime", but who is being disarmed in their minds? What do those criminals look like? I'm sure they are thinking about

50-cent-50-cent-gun-10763682.jpg


That's the reason that cheap firearms were restricted, so that poor blacks and browns couldn't afford a gun. When blacks marched armed, racists enact laws to disarm them. The only affect from those laws has been an increase in violence and crime as the criminals know that they are the top dogs.

The fact that politicians are uncomfortable around armed voters should tell you something. A RIGHT is a RIGHT and the government is expressly forbidden from infringing them, we the people need to reclaim our government by voting in people that will stand by that sentiment.
 
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