NRA is calling ATF to review the bump stock!!

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Anyone who thinks we're going to wall away from ~60 dead/500 wounded Scot free is delusional.
Personally, I'm fine with the "bump" stock being relegated to the trash pile.
Small price, and effectively useless to a rifleman... except to spray bullets.

Xin Loi.....
 
Small price, and effectively useless to a rifleman... except to spray bullets
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Though I agree, what will we have to give up after the next shooting (it will happen again)? 30rd mags since a rifleman does not need 30rds before a reload? Maybe restrictions on the number of firearms we can own since we can only fire one at a time. Let this slide and it will not end well.
 
Lets face reality. Look at how many people, let alone politicians, have gone over to supporting gun control. The number of casualties in this shooting is beyond my previous imagining:it will not go away from peoples minds. I have previously supported the position of "never give an inch" but in this case, regulations or bans on bump stocks are inevitable. The shooting has already cost us the possibility of de-regulating suppressors and national reciprocity. I understand the principle of not yielding, but what we would be giving up is at the low end of priority imo. I own two bump stocks. They are amusing toys simulating auto fire but sacrificing accuracy. If the NRA quickly endorses regulation of them, they help to disarm our enemies who claim we don't care. The anti gunners will, of course, continue to push for more egregious regulation: but giving up bump stocks will at least mollify some temporarily. When defeat is inevitable, a negotiated peace is often the best alternative. I don't like it, but it is our best hope. I hate to disagree with so many of my brethren, but I think the NRA gave careful consideration to this issue, and made the right choice.
 
mehavey said:
Anyone who thinks we're going to wall away from ~60 dead/500 wounded Scot free is delusional.
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Not at all delusional. There are at least four different Republicans who have the power to stop any gun control cold without relying on any votes from anyone else. Every single one of them is NRA A+ rated.
 
I was going to post this very topic but wasn't sure if it was acceptable or not.
I don't have a dog in this race but a reaction like this is just stupid. Banning the stock, banning the gun, banning the ammo - it's all the same. The problem wasn't the bump stock it was the idiot behind the stock. Yes, the bump stock increases the rate of fire but I have yet to see anyone who can repeatably hit a man size target at 100 yards while using one. I had to tell a guy at the range to move to the 25 yard berm because he was missing the berm at 50 yards. The only reason that so many people were hit is because they filled a football field. He was using a bump stock from over two blocks away and 320 feet above the field. If he was any kind of a shot he could have killed a lot more people firing semi-auto.
When I saw what the NRA-ILA had said I wrote a nice long letter telling them they were betraying their members. If it is ok to outlaw the bump stock, it should be ok to outlaw the rifle and the ammo. None of those items is responsible for the carnage. There was a man making that bump stock work and pointing the rifle at all those people. There is nothing wrong with the tools he used, only the way he used them. He was bad, not the stock or the gun or the ammo. We need to remember that in order to get rid of violence you have to prosecute the violence not the tools used.
 
Setting a bad precedence by sacrificing something. If we do, we will have to again in the future. Unfortunately, these killings are going to happening again and again (the cause is never addressed) and we will have to continue to give ground. The beast will never be full and once we feed it, it will demand more.
 
Typical, NRA compromising on your rights!

I'm glad I'm no longer a member, Wayne needs to go forever before I would even think about joining again!

Maybe they can compromise on any firearm that's black and evil and can hold 30 rounds or more in a detachable box magazine!

Or maybe they can waste more money calling you and sending out more letters asking you for more money! All of you members should send them letters letting them know that you're in a compromise over renewing your membership because they're compromising once again with the wrong people!

Once again I'm disgusted with the NRA! Wouldn't take the membership if it was free!
 
Stroge said:
...THEY SHOULD HAVE ASKED CONGRESS TO TAKE ACTION!!! We need legislation! LAWS! ...
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No, actually we do not.

The point is to keep this a regulatory matter, especially in light of past actions by ATF with regard bump-fire stocks. In Congress, especially right now, political pressure for extravagant solutions will be enormous and difficult to resist.

Be it remembered that in the mid 1960s the political climate in the wake of the assassinations of JFK, RFK, and MLK was such that it would have been pretty much impossible to avoid some version of the Gun Control Act of 1968. But adroit political maneuvering was able to ameliorate some of the worst provisions of the law as originally proposed.

jrinne0430 said:
...The NRA and some RINOs decided to play politics...
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Of course it's politics. It's always been politics; it's politics now; and forever shall be politics -- world without end. That's how decisions are made as a group composed of people with disparate interests, beliefs, and values.

The reality is that we live in a pluralistic, political society, and not everyone thinks as we do. People have varying beliefs, values, needs, wants and fears. People have differing views on the proper role government. So while we may be using the tools the Constitution, our laws and our system give us to promote our vision of how things should be, others may and will be using those same tools to promote their visions.

The Constitution, our laws, and our system give us resource and remedies. We can associate with others who think as we do and exercise what political power that association gives us to influence legislation. We have the opportunity to try to join with enough other people we can elect legislators and other public officials who we consider more attuned to our interests. And we can seek redress in court. And others who believe differently have the same opportunities.

Success will depend on political acumen. Holding one's breath until turning blue isn't a very effective strategy.
 
Small price, and effectively useless to a rifleman...
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2A only covers riflemen?

For ATFE to regulate this they need to change definition of a machine gun. Obama would have loved to ban, but it does not meet definition. If they are allowed to redefine there will be decades of consequences in regard to every minute ambiguity.
 
For ATFE to regulate this they need to change definition of a machine gun.
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That's not within their ability. They can't rewrite law, they can only issue opinion letters based on their interpretation.
I think it's a mistake to ask the ATF to review bump stocks. This should be a decision for Congress.
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I disagree. I think the best course of action is to do nothing, but given the choice between a BATF ruling and a new anti-gun law, I think the BATF ruling is preferable.

1. BATF has been known to reverse their rulings. Laws are hard to undo.
2. If the folks screaming for a new law can be placated while BATF deliberates, it could provide a very useful cooling off period. Those are really important because most anti-gun legislation needs fresh, raw emotion to pass. Once things cool down then facts and logic tend to prevail.
3. It would reinforce the NRA mantra that we have all the gun laws we need, they just need to be enforced.
 
Sorry guys. Those bump stocks nominally put out 3-4,000 rounds inside of 10 minutes last Sunday.
No amount of "scientific/explanatory logic" will make a hill of beans difference at this point. It's toast.
' You'd better hope that's all we lose as this thing plays out
 
Good point John.
I think you're right a ATF reversal would likely be the cleanest way of doing it.
They could target very specific products rather than try to rewrite comprehensive language that only specifically targets what you want without loop holes or unexpected consequences.

Not that I want even that to happen.
 
I think the best course of action is to do nothing...
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I love doing nothing. Inaction in the face of fresh and persuasive information keeps one from making blunders that were plain in hindsight.

Doing nothing saves us from destructive error. To paraphrase Edmund Burke don't just do something, stand there.
 
I have made phone calls (to include my reps), sent emails, letters, posts, spreading the word, etc.. I will put up a fight as I know more bans and regulations will follow after the next shooting.
 
That's not within their ability. They can't rewrite law, they can only issue opinion letters based on their interpretation.
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Legally it isn't, but congress has shown an incredible ability to ignore significant oversteps of the executive branch when it allows them to avoid going on record on controversial subjects, especially when powerful and organized interest groups are involved.

Maybe 80-90% of Americans may agree with banning bump stocks, but the remaining 10-20% are key to Republicans winning the next election. They won't vote Democrat, but they might stay home. Anything Republicans can do to avoid a recorded vote will be done. Democrats will surely go along.
 
It seems amazing to me how many people are willing to "throw a bone" to the gun grabbers when it doesn't affect them directly.....this time. Me, I'm ready to reset the laws back to 1933.
 
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