New scam (don't fall victim)

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Not a 90% chance that it was a scam. 99.999% chance. He was probably scoring drugs. Lots of successful people (financially speaking) have drug habits to support.

The best thing to do (Monday morning quarterbacking, I know) is to offer to walk into the store and pay for the medicine for him.

One time a man approached me at a gas station with the same old story: "on my way to Texas, don't have enough money, lost my debit card, called the bank and they said the nearest location is Texarkana, AR ... please spot me $5 for gas." I wasn't about to offer to go in the store with him to purchase the gas, as my wife and child were in the car and I would leave them without protection if I went inside. Grudingly handed him a five, got in my car, and drove off. As I recounted the story to my wife she reminded me that it was a federal holiday, and the banks were closed. Damn. :mad:

As I age (and become slightly wiser, though still stupid in the grand scheme of things) I get better at being "rude" to these people, and forcing them to let me pay for the gas or telling them "stand further away from me" as I reach for my money clip. It's just prudent.
 
Sounds like a scam, but...

I, too, am mostly jaded about the sob stories I hear from people but I'm with
P-Killer on this one. Especially in these times when so many people who've never imagined themselves in such desperate financial straits are having to come to terms with being destitute while still surrounded by the trappings of a middle class life style. Don't we all know people who are living day to day like that?
Yes the guy was being an ass but he probably never practiced having to beg before. I certainly wouldn't have gotten close when called over in such a manner but I hope I'm the type of a man who would've offered to walk into the pharmacy with him.
 
Too broad a brush

"Give a man a gun and he'll find that every stranger is a mugger."

Catchy but untrue. Better,"Give SOME men guns and..."
 
Most of the panhandlers I see around here are losers who have drug issues or just can't hold down a real job. I've heard all the approach lines too.

Kid sick at home? Yeah, that'll get my attention. And I like Pete's solution - offer to go into the pharmacy and give him $10 to get the medicines. If they don't like that then the old Russian saying of toughski s**tski applies.

In about the last month some guy had a sign that was asking for donations "for food". Well, he was sitting near a McD's and I needed lunch, so... I figured a pair of cheeseburgers and a coke for about $2.50 might help him out. When I stopped by him, he asked if I could spare change. When I gave him food instead it was like I insulted him [admittedly, not everyone likes McD food] and he reacted badly. So I told him I'd feed it to my dog instead and drove off.

I rarely give money to panhandlers. There were two exceptions though. One fellow tried to dress decently as he could, and always had a mixed breed dog (German Shep and perhaps a Aussie cattle dog - lots of character) with him. One very cold winter morning he had trimmed a blanket down into a "vest" for his dog. The next day I pulled the bike over and handed him $10 plus a couple of small rawhide chew toys for the dog. My g/f gave me a pair of "doggie boots" that belonged to her late boxer and I gave him those, plus about $15 in canned food. He was very appreciative.¹

The other guy I'd give to was a real "Dickens" character. Scruffy coat, fingerless gloves, slacks and a rather well worn top hat. He'd stand at one street corner and in a great voice recite Dickens, Shakespeare or any number of scenes in a play. And he played the part too. The day after 9/11 he was singing patriotic songs on the corner while holding a flag. People were getting out, dashing the two lanes over to give him money. The next day he had a Union Jack and I heard the end of Brittania when he started singing Men of Harlech... and gave him a ten spot. At least he was performing for an appreciative audience.²

¹ The fact that he was poor didn't stop him from trying to take care of his dog and he did make an effort to keep his appearance as neat and trim as he could. Alas, some homeless guy knifed him to death over a 2-lb canned ham. He was well liked downtown - no less than 100 offers came in to care for his dog or adopt it. Apparently he rented a small room on a weekly basis and had very little.
² A reporter interviewed the guy. Lost a child to leukemia, marriage tailspun to divorce, wife maxed the cards out, lost his accounting job. Refused to panhandle but used amatuer stage acting to develop his schtick. Always upbeat too. Even a on a rainy day (while performing "singing in the rain"). He finally got hired to do voice overs for local commercials and is doing okay.
 
I never give money to panhandlers. It just encourages them to get bolder and more aggressive and to keep on begging for money.

I do know a person who has a rather good "tactic" for dealing with panhandlers - he spots them first and before they can approach him, he quickly walks up to them, and asks for some spare change. They don't usually know how to react - but once a guy actually dug into his pocket and gave him some change.
 
common sense is not an absolute item. Common sense is dependent upon the observer and varies considerably person to person. I think if you believe you have a anything absolute that is comon sense, you might need help. If carrying a gun was the common sense thing to do, 95% of the population lacks common sense and those that carry are then demonstrating UNcommon sense it would seem to me.
 
I have no doubt it was a scam. Someone in a 40k dollar truck would know people, have friends or have SOME way of pawning off something. Call me extremely skeptical, but I also have a direct experience. I was pulled over at an interstate gas station filling up when a couple pulled up and gave me a somewhat similar sob story. They had to get to VA to attend to their sick daughter. There's always some type of a big sob story. Well, get this...about a year or so later I was there filling up again. Guess who showed up with the same exact story? Hmmm, guess they couldn't remember me from a year ago after they'd told their sob story to a couple thousand people.

Funny enough, someone hit me up as I was walking into the gun store just a few days ago. I didn't even acknowledge him, just kept on walking.
 
There ARE ways to be safe and charitable at the same time!

People on this forum sometimes have a very one sided perspective on life. How's the saying go?
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We're not talking about philisophical perspectives on life. We're talking about having your car blocked by an aggressive individual who demands you come to his window so he can ask for money. Being charitable or not in THAT SPECIFIC incident is what this thread is about.

While you're opening your wallet and figuring out a safe way to give him ten dollars, I'd being calling 911 and informing the dispatcher that an individual blocked my car to preven me from leaving while he demanded money.

The scam was the pretext he used to solicit money.

The act of using his vehicle to detain his selected victim, IMO, was a form of physical violence that hasn't attracted much interest on this thread. Everyone's still agruing about whether it was a scam or not.

I guess we all have our priorities.

Just my thoughts on the matter.:cool:
 
Nnobby45 said:
I guess we all have our priorities.
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One of those priorities is to ignore information contrary to the point we wish to make.

Every one of your objections has been answered, but I'll do it again.

ONE:
Nnobby45 said:
We're talking about having your car blocked by an aggressive individual who demands you come to his window so he can ask for money. Being charitable or not in THAT SPECIFIC incident is what this thread is about.
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Peetzakilla said:
On the other hand, I've been there. What some people call "agressive" COULD have been poor foresight. Afterall, most people live in condition white, almost everyone on this board acknowledges that fact. If you were condition white, you're not thinking about muggers and thieves and you're not thinking about LOOKING like a mugger or a thief. "Gee, I better pull up 20 feet out so I don't block this guy in, don't want him thinking that I'm a mugger!" What you'd be thinking is "Hey! There's a guy! He'll understand! I'll pull up quick before he leaves! He's probably got kids, he might have $10 he can give me. God this is embarresing, I hope he doesn't know me somehow. God, I feel like an idiot."
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TWO:
Nnobby45 said:
While you're opening your wallet and figuring out a safe way to give him ten dollars,
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Peetzakilla said:
If you read my previous posts you'll see that I would have no intentions of going anywhere near the guys truck.
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Peetzakilla said:
Personally, I would have told the guy that I'd meet him at the pharmacy and go in with him to cover the difference. That would have completely solved the issue. It would be instantly clear that it was either a scam or not. However, KingEdward is not obliged to do what I would do. He acted in a reasonable way, consistent with a responsible armed citizen.
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THREE:
Nnobby45 said:
The scam was the pretext he used to solicit money.
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Purely an assumption. Likely, yes. Absolute? No. See post #52 reference above.


FOUR:
Nnobby45 said:
I guess we all have our priorities.
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Yes, we do. Considering that most of us have never been robbed, mugged or threatened for money, I wonder why so many of our priorities are to err toward assumption of violence?
Some of us have been mugged, etc., I understand that. MOST of us have been solicited for money by scam artists, I understand that.
Apparently, most of us have NOT been in a situation where we can see and feel where this guy MAY have been coming from.
I have.
 
Expensive truck was probably leased and he may have defaulted and moved on leaving the repo people with no knowledge of how to track him down.

The economy has I believe given rise to a great deal of begging that comes close to demanding money with menaces.
 
I'm not going to argue that this guy was or wasn't scamming the OP.
I'm also not going to deny that people out there do scam people.
But I am going to ask: have you ever had to call up a family member or friend and ask them for some money to buy groceries for the week? That's far more humiliating than asking a stranger for money.
 
Thomme has a point. :( And a lot more people are facing this humiliating need now than a few years ago.

Unfortunately that's still the right thing to do, though. Your family and friends know you and should be willing to help. If they aren't available (which will be the case at times), the local churches are often helpful. A former priest of mine was also involved in helping poor people in suburban LA, and the churches there (many of whom agreed about and cooperated about very little else) had a deal going where they shared information about those who came around looking for help, and about resources. People who really needed help tended to get more and better help this way, while scammers and serial beggars telling different stories to different churches got spotted.

I don't give money to people on the street, but I often will buy a beggar a meal or some clothes. I don't like being scammed any more than anyone else, but when push comes to shove, I'd rather be scammed then turn away someone in real need.

However, if the beggar is aggressive or threatening, no. They might not mean it, but I won't take that chance. The only occasion where one tried to do more than talk mean, I found a policeman. (Was in the 1990s before I got a cell phone.)
 
Sakeneko, I never feel bad giving them money, but if I've got left over food, they get it. I've given some homeless folk the weirdest things: beer battered onion rings, afghan food, bread pudding... you name it. But in instances where it's "I need money for such and such" I'm generally willing to spare a couple of bucks. Or at least I would when I was still working.
 
Can't say I blame the original poster for his response. I've dealt with beggars, druggies, alcholics and thieves for years. I only give to recognized charities with a good track record.
 
40k truck? Step off!

I have no sympathy for someone in a $40k truck I could never afford.

Just like people who bought homes they couldn't possibly afford.

Blocking your exit was an aggressive, provocative act.

Sell that outrageously expensive truck, drive something affordable and
you wouldn't be in that situation, if it was even true.

As a young man, I once walked about 10 miles home rather than ask
a stranger for the 5 cents I was short for subway fare.

Your encounter sounds like a suburban version of the Bernard Goetz subway story.

You handled it correctly and kept a cool head. Kudos to you.
 
I wonder why so many of our priorities are to err toward assumption of violence?
Click to expand...

I've been wondering why you don't in this specific instance.

I can see that winning the argument is important to you. OK, you're the winner.
 
erring on the safe side is a good thing. There've been encounters with people in my past that I've reacted rather absurdly too. The "homeless man" wrapping his arm around my shoulder walking with me, dropping the "n-word" constantly and acting like I was his best friend. My response "I gotta get to my train!" and hopping a median near Grand Station in Chicago to get away.

It's a perfectly apt way to react, but a lot of people condemn anyone who asks for help as a scam artist, simply because they've never had to put themselves in the same place.
 
OK, this is not tactics, but I have to share.

I just have to share my experience. Experiences, actually.

I was painting my entryway when a guy knocked on my front door and asked me for $20 to buy gas so he could get home (about 50 miles away). He was handicapped (I don't remember if it was hearing impaired or could not speak--it was a three or four years ago), and told (wrote) a good line about starting a taxidermy business and having a good work history with a local (to his home) business. I gave him $20. I figured I could spare the money even if he was scamming me and I am (was) a soft touch. He promised faithfully to mail me the money.

No letter came.

A couple of weeks later, I was in my office when one of my co-workers came upstairs looking for our boss (who has our building posted "No Soliciting", by the way). There was a guy downstairs who was needing gas money. Our boss wasn't there, but another co-worker and I went downstairs to find out what's up. I recognized the guy right away. I informed my co-worker that he was a scam artist. He didn't believe me right away, but I told him to just keep him occupied.

I went outside and saw the same truck, and the passenger side window was open. So I opened the glove compartment and found the registration and a business card from a local charitable group which helps the handicapped. I noted that his fuel gauge was low, but with the ignition off, I don't know if it was reading true or not.

I went back inside where my co-worker and he were still talking. I walked up to the other side of the scammer, plopped the papers on the counter and joined the conversation. He did not remember me.

He went through his spiel with me and I reminded him that I had given him $20 two weeks ago and accused him of running a scam. He denied it and was insulted. He said he tried to come back to pay me, but could not remember where I lived. He began to leave and I told him he would want to take his papers with him. He was incensed that I would have the nerve to go into his vehicle. I told him he could have the papers as soon as I photocopied them, which I did.

He said he was so insulted that he would be back the next day with my $20. He never showed.

I did call the organization whose business card he had. Yep, they knew him. They had helped him, too. But they do not give money any more. They do have vouchers for a few gallons of gas, food and clothing. But this guy was not interested in that stuff so much.

So, I called the police to let them know this scammer was out there and to file a complaint. As it turns out, there is no law against doing what he is doing. He wheedles money from someone by lying and it is not a criminal act. If someone gives him money, that's a gift. Fraud laws require a bit more.

His truck was registered to a lady, evidently his mother. I considered driving out there to let her know what her son is doing, but thought that was just investing too much into this jerk, so passed on that idea.

I am not that soft a touch any more. But I do recognize that there are people out there who are genuinely in need and at their wit's end how to make it from day to day and here to there. So, sometimes I will give the benefit of the doubt, still. But less now than before.

So, scammers steal from more than thier primary victims. They steal from people they never met, other people with real needs. They do this by making charitable people less willing to give.

Pity.

Lost Sheep
 
I wonder why so many of our priorities are to err toward assumption of violence?
Click to expand...
Momma taught me that "An ounce of prevention beats a pound of cure..."
in this case it may beat having to double tap someone with JHP ammo and the ensuing hours of hassle with the "blue crew"...

Pop always said "Prior planning prevents P*** poor performance"...
Both of those cliches fit the realm of tactics and training so well!
Brent
 
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