Need a good Home Defense gun!

sandbag said:
Get a 45 ACP revolver and keep the ammo in moon clips.No 3 or 4 year old will know what the moon clips are for or how to load them,but your wife can load up much faster than with a speedloader.S&W makes the regular 22-4 and the Nightguard-I have the 22-4 and switched out the grips for Pachmayrs-makes a great difference in recoil control and saves wear and tear from the skimpy Thunder Ranch grips.
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Horrible idea. Kids are able to figure things out, and leaving any gun out and accessible to young kids is a disaster waiting to happen. Thinking that moon clips will prevent a kid from loading the gun is completely irresponsible.

The gun she is using for home protection should be on her person or locked up. On her person is obviously the better choice, because a gun locked up in the bedroom is useless if someone breaks in while she is in another room.

The kids should also be taught gun safety as soon as they are able to comprehend.
 
SD gun

Whats wrong with an HK P7? Squeeze cock pretty hard for a small child to work, and loaded with 9mm JHP ur sure not UNDER gunned.
 
senior said:
Whats wrong with an HK P7? Squeeze cock pretty hard for a small child to work, and loaded with 9mm JHP ur sure not UNDER gunned.
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Because childproof isn't childproof. Because firearms safety with children means access control and training. Because you simply cannot rely on operational complexity (be it mechanical safeties, squeeze-cockers, moon clips, or anything else) when it comes to small children and firearms.

Guns must be accessible to you, but inaccessible to your children. And your children must be taught what to do if they find a gun (regardless of whether it is in your house or elsewhere).
 
guns

I have not seen to many 2-3 yr old who can squeeze cock the p7. Agreed if the children are older, yes, no safety is safe enough, but as he stated, 2 and 3? Mine are grown now, but at that age I'd doubt they would have had the strength, nor ability to climb to the top shelf of the closet
 
From my experience as a child in the 90s, I can attest that anytime they're left alone, they get into things. And I mean... EVERYTHING. When you say something is off limits, it becomes a mystical thing that children want to get into.

That being said: money best spent is money spent familiarizing yourself with a firearm. There isn't a single gun that woman can't handle, so long as they're taught to use it and are familiarized with it.
 
Guns and Children

That's my biggest horror. I have 2 children, 12 and 7. They are curious little buggers and like someone else said, don't touch to them means when we are not around. So I keep everything locked up in a safe for peace of mind. But I want to keep a gun in the bed room which is probably where I will be if I need to use it. The dilema for me now is how to accomplish that and keeping the kids out of it. I don't want something that I will have to fumble for a combination or key and the thumb sensor boxes, I hear fail to open 30% of the time and are expensive???????????????????????
 
Shooterman, your solution would be this:
A gunsafe that uses a Key or Finger print or if a combination, an obscure number (nobodies birthday or anniversary in your family, I figured out a lot AOL passwords in my family and my father's safe based on that) that you lock up all of your guns in except for one.
That one should stay on your body (concealed or open, your choice) at all times, except for when you're sleeping. And in that case, keep it close by. If you're not a CC permitted resident, then lock that gun up just the same when you leave, or in certain states and jurisdictions in your car's glove box/console. That should keep the kids out of it.

There are several articles that I've read regarding teaching children safe firearms practice and respect when dealing with kids, such as disarming their curiosity or making guns seem like a chore to them. I believe "Cornered Cat" would be the best bet on those articles. But, I don't trust kids (mainly cause I was a troublemaker) to be complete disarmed of curiosity and mischievousness. But, my basic advice up top is solid from my experience as a child.
 
Yes, fingerprints!

Biometric makes a little gun safe that pops open by reading fingerprints. It costs about $275 or so. You can conveniently use the weapons you like without fear of having any little child tragedies.

Biometric.jpg
 
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I would have to agree with carrying around the house, but I don't have any toddlers.

kraigwy
<SNIP>Personally I carry a 642 in my pocket, its pretty tough for my grandkids to get to it without me knowing it. Plus its always available.

A SD pistol/revolver isnt a SD pistol/revolver if its not available.

What good is a SD pistol/revolver setting on the night stand in the bedroom if you are setting on your couch watching TV during a home invasion?
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The Beretta 92FS probably wouldn't be a good choice.

First off, it is very large, especially in grip circumference and trigger reach. Many women (and a lot of men) find it too large to properly fit their hand.

Second, the safety operates in the opposite way as the 1911 she is familiar with. On the 1911, up is safe and down is fire. On the Beretta, down is safe and up is fire. You don't want her fumbling with the safety when fractions of a second could mean life or death.

1. If she's able to shoot the 1911 well, but has trouble working the slide, she is probably using the wrong technique. Many women simply can't muscle the slide like many men are able to because of the difference in upper body strength between the two sexes.

http://www.corneredcat.com/RunGun/rack.aspx

2. If she has difficulty with follow-up shots with a .45 ACP 1911, the money would be better served by several boxes of ammunition and more practice.

I don't see the need for another gun here unless those two steps fail.
__________________
A liberal firearms owner and Second Amendment supporter from New Jersey (yes, we do exist).

Sig Sauer P6
Ruger Mark II "NRA Endowment" special edition
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Jersey EMT,

The reason I mentioned the Beretta is that my wife, who is pretty small, prefers the Beretta over the other handguns we have to be her 'night-stand" gun. She says it feels better than my .45's and .40's, and she really likes the idea that she can basically disarm the pistol with the saftey. You made a very good point of the opposite way the 1911 saftey is engaged. For my wife, that's a non factor because she hasn't fired any 1911's.

Remember when some president said "A chicken in every pot!"? Well, if I had a say, there would be a .45 ACP in every house. Minus the criminal's, of course! :)
 
Your best bet, and least expensive, is to invest in a sturdy pistol safe to hold one of the handguns at the ready. Children must never observe the parent retreiving the gun except in extremis to eliminate their curiosity about "the gun box".

If it's just the 1911's slide she has trouble with, a 9mm may be much easier for her to operate. There are a slew of good, used 9mm pistols available out there. I'd suggest getting her an S&W metal framed pistol or if she can shoot one well, a Beretta 92FS.

You might look for a clean Beretta Model 85 .380 pistol with the tip-up barrel for loading & unloading. These are single-stack magazines and grip size is good for women.
ber_cheetah_380_tip.jpg


I think S&W is still making their Model 908 for now. It's a good size for women and has a magazine disconnector too.
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You didn't say what kind of Colt .38 revolver you had. Presuming it's an Official Police or Police Positive Special and not a snubby, the pistol safe makes the most sense. Children do grow faster than you think and they get curious, so relying on hiding the gun or simply keeping speedloaders at hand won't work.
 
Second, the safety operates in the opposite way as the 1911 she is familiar with. On the 1911, up is safe and down is fire. On the Beretta, down is safe and up is fire. You don't want her fumbling with the safety when fractions of a second could mean life or death.
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As you noted, physical differences may make one gun or another too large or too small for a woman's hands. But to say that a woman will "fumble" the safety on her gun over the difference between the 1911 and Beretta is somewhat insulting.

It's possible to happen, but if she has her own gun and practices with it, it'll become easy for her.
 
Shooterman said:
That's my biggest horror. I have 2 children, 12 and 7. They are curious little buggers and like someone else said, don't touch to them means when we are not around. So I keep everything locked up in a safe for peace of mind. But I want to keep a gun in the bed room which is probably where I will be if I need to use it. The dilema for me now is how to accomplish that and keeping the kids out of it. I don't want something that I will have to fumble for a combination or key and the thumb sensor boxes, I hear fail to open 30% of the time and are expensive?
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Try looking at it this way... use the gun vault or pistol box to store the gun when you are not at home. Before bedtime, retreive the gun and stow it in the desired location (e.g. nightstand drawer). If worried you'll leave it there, put your car/house keys next to the gun so you see it every morning before leaving.
 
BillCA said:
As you noted, physical differences may make one gun or another too large or too small for a woman's hands. But to say that a woman will "fumble" the safety on her gun over the difference between the 1911 and Beretta is somewhat insulting.

It's possible to happen, but if she has her own gun and practices with it, it'll become easy for her.
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How is it insulting? If someone is used to a 1911, switching to a gun who safety operates in the opposite way, like the Beretta, they are going to need enough practice to become accustomed to it. This is regardless of whether it is a man or a woman.

Even if a Beretta 92 or another gun with a similar safety switch becomes "her" gun, you still run into the problem of what happens if, for whatever reason, she needs to use the 1911 or he needs to use her gun.
 
BillCA said:
If it's just the 1911's slide she has trouble with, a 9mm may be much easier for her to operate. There are a slew of good, used 9mm pistols available out there. I'd suggest getting her an S&W metal framed pistol or if she can shoot one well, a Beretta 92FS.

You might look for a clean Beretta Model 85 .380 pistol with the tip-up barrel for loading & unloading. These are single-stack magazines and grip size is good for women.
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Unless arthritis or some other physical problem prevents her from racking the slide of a semiauto, most likely she was never taught how to do it properly. It doesn't require much strength at all with proper technique.

Women are built differently then men. What works for men (just using upper body strength to muscle the slide) often does not work for women. I've never come across a female shooter who was unable to rack the slide even on semiautos with rather heavy recoil springs after being taught proper technique.
 
So you've gotten some good feedback already. I understand your desire to ensure that your kids are safe from mischief with the gun, and I think that is absolutely correct. Expecting they won't find things, or expecting they'll always do exactly what you told them when they do, isn't good enough for me. If anything happens, and these things do, you can never take it back!

In addition to keeping the gun securely stored with the ammo in a way it can be accessed quickly (say in a quick access safe), your wife could also CCW in the house. In this way the gun is always in her sight and under her control, and she can also access it extremely quickly.

An all-steel, small-medium, 2-3 inch barrel revolver with .38+P will be fine to carry concealed on a belt all day, and is very simple/reliable to operate under stress. Ruger SP101, S&W 640, S&W 64 (6-shots), would all be likely suspects. I have heard some good things about the new Ruger LCR as being a soft shooter for its light weight, but haven't tried it.
 
Gunslinger kids?

The colt fits well but I have a 2 and 3 yr old in the house and would like something that she can load quickly when needed.
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I just had to smile at the image, if not the concept.

What child cannot understand how to load moon-clips? If a child can open a revolver, he or she is plenty smart enough to load, close and fire it. When presented with any object, tool, toy, whatever, children are infinitely resourceful and imaginative.

If you hide the gun around the house, your children WILL know where it is by the time they are five. Guaranteed. They see where you go and where you don't go. They are little information sponges, soaking up EVERYTHING. That's why young of any species learn so fast.

In most circumstances, the best home defense firearm is a shotgun. Easier to aim than any handgun and twice as powerful for the recoil.

Storage in a lockbox, with the box attached to the inside of a closet wall and two of three keys on a neck-chain around your necks, 24-7, even while showering, and the spare stored away from the home (where you keep your fire insurance papers, etc.)

If you can manage it, a dog in the 50 to 75 lb range is the single best home-defense measure available to most folks. If you invest half as much training time in the dog as you do your gun(s) you will reap benefits of 1) safety, 2) companionship for you AND your children 3) education for your kids about taking care of someone/something (not just being taken care of, as they are) 4) fun exercise and 5) cheap psychiatry (few humans are better listeners than a dog). The dog will alert you to an intruder faster than most alarms and are a deterrent in themselves. While they do present a concealed-carry problem, they do pack themselves, so adjusting an uncomfortable holster while jogging is rarely a problem.

Good luck, God bless.

Lost Sheep
 
OP...
Take your wife to a range that rents them and let her find one that fits her hands/dexterity...then let her shoot a few to determine the caliber that she likes as well. That way she will feel comfortable with it and will be able to use it more effeciently.
That said, my wife liked the M&P better than the XD, but did like them both.
 
If a safe is the route you choose for the guns you have, Harbor Freight has some modestly priced digital safes that are just right for a handgun. You can even pick them up and move them if need be. Not "theft proof" in that condition but kid proof as long as they don't have the combo, which can be changed if they see you do it.

The guns you have sound good, as long as she (as with anyone) practices with them. Maybe a snubbie or compact auto in the future to ccw in the house or when she goes outside. You should check, here ccw is legal w/o a permit on property you own.
 
moonclip safety

I understand the criticism of what I said about moonclips-I have a 4 year old grandaughter who likes guns-she has cap pistols-so I actually don't have any handguns accesible to her.I keep the 22-4 in a nightstand with the moonclip separate when she's over.And I DON'T let her see where either.
Usually it's just my wiafe and myself,so no issue.
I always had to carry firearms and educated my son and daughter about the potential dangers early on.When they started having friends over,I never left a gun in the house unlocked(except my service weapon which I always carried).
 
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