Is the Mosin (91/30) a good survival rifle???

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look for something that uses more readily available ammo. Youve got to figure, if its a SHTF moment, youre going to have to scrounge for whatever ammo you can find, so you want something common.
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Someone, or several someone nearly always give this kind of advice, and everyone nods, and thinks, yep, that's a good idea... but is it, really?

Where you gonna do this "scrounging?" Think that there's going to be any popular calibers left? Think there's going to be ANYTHING left? Good Luck. Unless you're one of the first "scroungers" (and btw, the first "scroungers" are known as "looters" and get shot or shot at) I'd imagine any unguarded ammo supply will get robbed pretty quick.

You're not going to be "the last man on earth" and even if you are, we don't do those discussions at TFL.

The ONLY thing you can count on when civil order breaks down is what you ALREADY HAVE. The rest is fantasy.

I think we've gone far enough down that particular rabbit hole in this thread, fun though it is...
 
The ONLY thing you can count on when civil order breaks down is what you ALREADY HAVE. The rest is fantasy.
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Actually, I agree with that.

But in the few hours you may have to gather up some ammo before the howling mob starts down your street, there's no downside - if your home stash happens to be running a little short - to sourcing a commonly-available caliber where you can ... :)

In this country, for centerfire rifles, that's going to be .223, .308, 30-06 - period.

Trying to source MN ammo in an emergency is the real fantasy. :rolleyes: Skip the Mosin junk. Get an M1.

You can thank me after you've survived the annual mid-August zombie outbreak. :D

John C. runs through home-defense drills with his personal M1.
 
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Seems to me that a survival rifle(s) should be chambered in a commonly available cartridge(s). As in .22 rimfire, 5.56 and .308. Far more easily acquired in "hard times".
 
AGTMAN has the right idea.

As much as I love the M1 I think the M1903A3 is better. Its a tad bit more accurate, and more handloading friendly, mainly its a better candidate for cast bullets. The Springfield also isn't as picky about the ammo (bullet weight and powder choice) as the Garand. Plus you don't have to chase your brass all over several area codes.

I shoot both in the CMP Vintage Rifle matches, I can shoot the 'A3 just about as fast as I can the Garand. You learn to work the bolt, you can make a good smooth bolt gun sound as fast as a gas gun.

That's not saying I'm going to give up my Garand's though.

I use to run sniper schools for the AK NG using the M1C/Ds. The native guardsmen found out that their M1s and stolen guard ammo was pretty handy for hunting Walrus. Somewhere I have a picture of a native shooting caribou with his issue Garand Sniper Rifle.

So many options, so many guns, not enough time to take them each out to play.

Every time I take one of my guns out, I think this is the only gun I really need. Then remind my self, Slaves get what they NEED, freemen get what they WANT.
 
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But in the few hours you may have to gather up some ammo before the howling mob starts down your street,...
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Actually, you may have less time than that. In fact, you may not be able to get more ammo even if the howling mob never gets onto you block...

One of the FIRST things done during an "emergency" is the suspension of legal sales of alchohol and Firearms /ammo. Once this happens, retailers cannot legally sell you any ammo, even if they want to, and the disaster is still miles away.

Buddy Buck at Guns R US might "back door" you a couple boxed (or a case???;)), but if you're caught after the suspension order has been given, then BOTH of you are breaking the law (as it exists at the time), and while a lot of folks will look the other way, IF you run afoul of the right kind of "protector of the people", the BEST you can hope for is to be locked up, until the regular court system is re-established, and gets around to hearing your case. Which will be an unguessable number of days/weeks/possibly months AFTER law and order are restored.

There is an up side to "riding out" a disaster in the custody of the govt, they will, at least, do their best to keep you somewhat fed. Looks bad on their records when prisoners awaiting trial starve to death...:rolleyes:

In this country, for centerfire rifles, that's going to be .223, .308, 30-06 - period.
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Here, I think you are inserting the period just a bit early. I think .30-30 belongs on that list.

If you're not in the major urban gun control areas lots of little stores hardware stores, and in some places even gas stations & grocery stores have a few boxes of ammo on their shelves. .22 (in the days when you could get them) some mixture of shotgun shells, and a box or 3 of rifle ammo. Often there's some .223 or .308, '06, maybe, but there's almost always a box of .30-30. It may be 25 years old, but its there...;)

There's still a lot of folks out there that don't have the AR bug, or the milsurp bug, or even any kind of gun bug at all, but do hunt, and have a deer rifle, and a shotgun. The rifle they pick up when disaster strikes is going to be the one that they have, and that's a Win/Marlin .30-30 levergun in millions of homes, still today.
 
Has everyone forgotten the panic after Sandy Hook? That's the closest thing to a full fledged SHTF panic run on guns and ammo I've seen in my lifetime. I well recall how the most popular rounds were the first things to disappear. Go to any store that sold ammo, and the shelves were almost completely bare, except for 12 ga, .270 Win, and .17 HMR (at least in this area). And the most popular round of all time, .22lr, has not fully recovered after over 5 years. I'm finally seeing more of it, but it sure doesn't cost 3 or 4 cents a round anymore.

The lesson I took home from this, is that all those guy telling us to buy something in a very common caliber, "because it will be the only thing you can find after SHTF", are wrong. No, when there is a mass panic that makes people try to stock up on guns/ammo, the most common calibers will be the first thing to disappear.

If things deteriorate to the point you can "scrounge" door to door in abandoned houses, then if there's ammo in the house, the gun that it fits is probably laying around too.
 
Looks like this thread is starting to fall deep down the rabbit hole.

The only ammo easily carried is 22lr even in 500 round packs.
Lets assume you show up at a store and there's a sign that says everythings free and there's boxes of your favorite 20 round packs (not 223/556, 7.62x39). Lets say Winchester/Remington/Federal. You're looking at almost a full milk crate or backpack for 500 rounds unless you dump it into lose rounds.

Even 12 gauge would be a milk crate and weigh over 30 pounds.

Survival would probably come down to carrying 150 or less rounds if nomadic. Who knows if you're walled up in a house in the country.

And this is off the thought of hunting for food, possibly a bit for defense but no zombies or any other thought involving shooting people live or undead.

A survival guide and basic trapping skills would go far.
 
* * * Survival would probably come down to carrying 150 or less rounds if nomadic. Who knows if you're walled up in a house in the country.
And this is off the thought of hunting for food, possibly a bit for defense but no zombies or any other thought involving shooting people live or undead.
A survival guide and basic trapping skills would go far.
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Dudenal, you're being way too rational for this thread. ;)

You're going to spoil it for all the Mosin fanboys who image themselves as becoming some sort of hero-sniper in their pet SHTF scenario - ala Enemy at the Gates. :rolleyes: ... And where's the fun in that? :D

Seriously, you Mosin dudenals. Get rid of that junk. Sell the ammo. Invest in something realistic for a realistic scenario ...

You can thank Clint later.



IBTL. :cool:
 
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So you should stop being a Mosin fanboy and start being a Garand fanboy?
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Well, "fanboy" really doesn't apply since the choice is so clear.

Aside from collectibility, which I'll acknowledge is a fine reason to get one, the MN as a fighting weapon is junk compared to the M1 Garand - in any configuration: Mini-G, Tanker, or full-size.

This one shoots as good as it looks.

CMP 7.62/.308 HRA Special M1.
 
I thought he was more interested in having a milsurp rifle, with the additional use of being a survival rifle.

But if a survival, or more accurately, utility rifle is his top priority, then his budget can get him pretty close to owning an AR15. He could at least get the major pieces purchased with 400.

The real joy is having all the mags, ammunition, replacement parts and accessories you could ever dream of available almost anywhere in the USA. You'll be able to stockpile anything you need for your AR needs for the rest of your life.
 
Again- the utility of the Mosin as a survival tool depends on what you'd envision surviving with one.

As a battle rifle for surviving armed engagements, it falls far short.
As a very basic "pull-trigger-go-boom" rifle, it can hunt, it can handle large critter defense, and it can serve in a limited capacity for other defensive scenarios.

It would handle extreme conditions better than many cheap commercial rifles.
You could easily break it down for maintenance in the field.
It has sufficient power.
Accuracy in a good one can be quite good.

Frankly, while it would not be my first, second, or third choice, between it & a Garand as a general hunter/critter defender, I'd take the Mosin.
Much simpler, not as ammo-sensitive in bullet weights, and easier to tote in hand over long periods.

Since the Garand keeps getting itself interjected into this MOSIN thread, I'll go so far as to say I would not choose a Garand as a survival tool in any context- hunting, extreme environments, or gun battles.

And it really has NO place in answering the original question about MOSIN RIFLES.

The question posed was not "Which is better- Mosin or Garand?", it was "Is the Mosin a good survival rifle?"

Why that has to bring in extended commentary on irrelevant Garands is a puzzlement.
Denis
 
* * * Frankly, * * * between it & a Garand as a general hunter/critter defender, I'd take the Mosin. Much simpler, not as ammo-sensitive in bullet weights, and easier to tote in hand over long periods.
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:rolleyes: The Garand is as "simple" as a 30-cal autoloader can get and still be reliable in the field. As far as the alleged bullet/ammo "sensitivity" complaint goes, that bugaboo was eliminated when Schuster Mfg invented their adjustable M1 gas plug, which allows you to regulate the M1's gas system to any 30-06 ammo. The Mini-Gs thrive on it with any power level of '06 ammo.

Focus on the facts, my dudenal. It ain't rocket science.

Since the Garand keeps getting itself interjected into this MOSIN thread, I'll go so far as to say I would not choose a Garand as a survival tool in any context- hunting, extreme environments, or gun battles.
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Well, that choice is all on you, Scooter. :cool:
 
You seem to feel an irresistible compulsion to insert your Garand into posts that have nothing to do with Garands.
And then you revert to the level of a pissy 4-year-old when somebody tells you your pet is out of place.

Again- This thread has nothing to do with Garands.
And if you try to tell me you can break one down for quick field-strip cleaning at 30 below zero as simply as pulling the trigger & hauling the bolt assembly out, you're delusional.

The Mosin is infinitely simpler to operate (fewer critical parts), not sensitive to ammo (ready to go as is without additional money spent on design modifications), has no gas system to go bad, and can continue operating in conditions that would shut a Garand down.

I've owned a Garand. It's long gone.
I still have four Mosins.
Far from being the best boltgun in the world, but also far from being the worst in sheer survival situation outside a military context.

I've conversed with the guy on Life Below Zero whose wife regularly uses Mosins for subsistence hunting in some of the worst extreme cold conditions that man can live in.
He recommends no semi-auto, his wife uses her Mosin because it works through 30-below temps, snow, glaciers, ice water, and so on.
They've tried other guns, and keep coming back to the Mosin.
The Garand has no place in his life.

By all means keep your beloved rifle.
Just do us a favor & stop endlessly inserting it into threads where it doesn't belong.

Nobody asked you anything at all about Garands.
Denis
 
Wow, this got sooo many responses!:D


Lets assume you show up at a store and there's a sign that says everythings free and there's boxes of your favorite 20 round packs (not 223/556, 7.62x39).
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Just so you know mosins shoot 7.62x54R cartridges, not x39 which most ak's/sks rifles shoot. Thanks anyway.

Also I do agree with many that too many Garands have been inserted into this thread!

This thread, too, has gone far too deep down the rabbit hole, and I'm thinking that maybe we should kill it?:confused:;)

Thanks, guys. Really appreciate it!
 
I think it has basically morphed into the other thread.

When I replied to this thread I honestly thought I was replying to your other thread... Which is a milsurp for survival.
 
The Garand is as "simple" as a 30-cal autoloader can get and still be reliable in the field. As far as the alleged bullet/ammo "sensitivity" complaint goes, that bugaboo was eliminated when Schuster Mfg invented their adjustable M1 gas plug, which allows you to regulate the M1's gas system to any 30-06 ammo. The Mini-Gs thrive on it with any power level of '06 ammo.

Focus on the facts, my dudenal. It ain't rocket science.
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The AK and SKS are 30 caliber rifles and I bet they are more reliable than the Garand ever thought about being. And they don't need an adjustable gas plug to keep from bending the Op Rod.

And what is with the childish "dudenal"? Your profile says you are a LEO. Do you work with juveniles or middle schoolers? Why do you refer to the posters here like that?
 
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