Iraq bans Blackwater operations, all Blackwater personnel told to leave immediately

In a nutshell Musk...

I don't care for civilian "soldiers" in a combat zone...that includes mercs, CIA cum State Dep't types, Air America air commando types, USAID, etc...it appears to me that the contracting firms, who get billion dollar contracts, accept this risk of being accused of what would be a violation of the Geneva Convention, but they don't care, they are not subject to military tribunal, therefore they are running hog wild in a country where for every step forward the military makes, these cowboys set us back a thousand yards with their abuses...the average GI Joe will and has paid dearly for mis-stepping over their, and these bastards just get re-assigned somewhere else for some R&R , spending all their ill gotten gains on whatever it is professional assassins spend money on when on R&R ...and like I said...these guys don't die...they sold their souls a long time ago...therefore, they don't know what sacrificing for God and country is all about.

P.S. No offense will be taken by anything you or anyone else may have to say in Blackwater's, Triple Canopy's, etc, et al, ad nauseum's defense.
 
AlNamVet,

Wow...while I respect your opinion and am thankfull for your service, I have to disagree with your point of view.

Most folks who go out on security detail privately have been in law enforcement, military or what have you. These folks have been trained in first-line action, combat...killing people. Only later did they take steps on security and armed guard detail for high-profile individuals.

These people get out of the military and what? There isn't really any civilian job that they can do to fully express their skills, their training. Heck, a lot of them have a hard time finding a job that doesn't include this type of work.

They put their lives on the line at some point, just like you did. And, they put their lives on the line every day when they step out of the green zone to protect someone or to transport some good that requires such security. Can you blame them for wanting to get more than a soldiers wage? For wanting something more than a soldier's abandonment by their government? I can't.

Often times, these guys have additional training above and beyond a typical grunt in the military. Is that not worth an additional income? They do not have the backing of the military. Is that not worth an additional income? If they get in trouble, they can not call for an armored division backup. If they get into trouble, they can not call on the Air Force for air support. If they get shot or mamed, they can not call for military Med-EVAC. These guys are out there alone. They may have others from their company waiting to go help them, but it is nothing on the level of what the military has on hand to reinforce a platoon or squad in trouble. I can't blame them for getting paid more, for reacting with more deadly force and having a more itchy trigger in the line of fire than military personnel.
 
Those are the risks they have accepted...

war is hell, and if you didn't get your fill while in the miliary, then mercenary work is for you...while I respect your point of view, I cannot accept the fact that these guys operate OUTSIDE of any justice system...military or otherwise...and they know it...their employers know it...everyone knows it...what they get paid has absolutely nothing to do with what I am saying...if anything, scrap these contractor "contracts", and split the savings with the boots on the ground and in the air...you will have higher retention, an experienced force getting paid what they should, and you will eliminate the risk takers who are outside the law...a well paid and experienced combat soldier will want to stay well within the established rules of conduct, if only to keep earning that livable wage that he cannot earn at this time because it's being squandered on paying these guns for hire. These merc types are not your average Joe...they are some of the sickest people one can find outside of the military, perhaps even more psychopathic than the Legionnaires...these guys are NOT patriots, and whatever love of God and country they ever had was thrown by the way side when they left the military and signed up to be "civilian security contractors"...I say boochit...they are killers for hire., they are motivated by only one thing...the money...nothing more.
 
I say boochit...they are killers for hire., they are motivated by only one thing...the money...nothing more.
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The same could be said for many politicians.

So, do you disagree with the fact that these men are still held accountable by Geneva Conventions and International Law? They can not be held in a military tribunal, but they can be prosecuted in Federal Court.

And, they, just as military, simply follow orders. Do they really want to get into a firefight? I don't think so. Our govt hires them. They follow orders, just as military men do. Yes, perhaps for the cash, but not everyone who joins the military makes a career out of it. Do they lose their honor and commitment to their country when they leave the military after running their contract and moving onto private, higher paid employment here in the states? Heck even one of the selling points of the military and one of their recruiting tools is the idea that you can get a free education and make a bunch of money when you get out. They taunt you with signing bonuses and other goodies hoping you will sign up. Not that there is anything wrong with that. Just that it is the way it is.

Many companies here at home are paid for their services and goods by the government. Are they any less American than folks who work for the government here in the states? Colt is a private company. They sell their goods to the government. Are their employees any less American than the guy who works for the government and decides to buy those goods from Colt for the government?

Seems to me you are saying that anyone who works outside of a government agency holds no care for or commitment to our country. One of our country's basis is capitalism. To work outside of the government is a standard. You could of course have a bigger government and hire everyone...
 
Not at all....

they do what they do for money...if they did it for a hundred dollars a day, I would feel the same...the private sector and capitalism is one thing...warfare is a soldier's thing...not a civilian adventure a lot of these servicemen and women do what they do already for the low salaries; imagine a much higher salary for the professional soldier, and how that would positively impact on our retention, reduced training costs, morale, and families back home not having to depend on food stamps to supplement what the old man/gal gets at present...get rid of them, take the money saved, and pay the real warriors for their sacrifices with the new found money...the money is obviously their...just don't give it to mercs.
 
So, when 100's of 1000's of civilians took up arms in the Revolutionary War to stand against a foreign power, Britain, you are saying that was wrong? When 100's of 1000's took up arms to defeat the south, free the slaves and create one nation during the Civil War, you are saying that was wrong? Take a walk on Bunker Hill (you aren't too far from there) and tell me it was wrong. When a small group got together and created the militia, to go outside of the typical military combat of "Line Em Up and Shoot. Whichever side has more lines wins." and attack the enemy in the Civil War with unorthodox methods revolutionizing combat and leading our country to a method of combat that ultimately won the war; that was wrong?

Throughout history, war has been waged by politicians and faught by civilians. The idea of Military has just made a way for it to be a bit more organized, but it is still the duty of everyone, including civilians, to fight for what is right.

Under your guise, we should all turn in our handguns because security is a police thing and they should be the only ones to provide it to us. Under that argument, we should not have the right to defend ourselves even here at home.
 
they are some of the sickest people one can find outside of the military, perhaps even more psychopathic than the Legionnaires...
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Wow, that's just stupid. So you're calling every single contractor a sick psychopath. And as if that's not enough, for some reason you also include the Foreign Legion to that description. I'd like to see you tell them that to their faces. But I must admit, you're one tough internet commando:eek:

I agree with CrazyIvan007. Why should they not become contractors when they leave the military? Why should they not do what they do best? If they weren't needed, they would not be paid so much money.
 
This is why we

have a military...I stand by my assessments...have a problem with it, Xin Loi.


Not an internet commando...just one who has been their and done that.

BTW...that was uncalled for Sylvanus:(
 
I said that, just came up with it...pretty good eh? :) If someone did in fact say it before, I never heard it. But, thanks for bundling me with such greatness...hehe.
 
Personally I have no problem with these guys going to defend the lives of private interests. What is the main message of the military's recruiters? Serve your country, AND LEARN SKILLS THAT YOU CAN USE WHEN YOU GET OUT IN ORDER TO MAKE A LIVING.

If a guy who has spent years of his life learning how to be invisible or shut down an adversary decides to do that as a career, hey, let him do it. If these companies do something wrong, the bad press will put them out of business quicker than the threat of getting kicked out. I think this will only help them in the end.
 
Whats the big deal, its THEIR country, they can toss who they want.
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I agree. If Iraq is to be an independent country (that is the goal, right?) then they need to make their own internal decisions.

If they ask the rest of the coalition forces to leave, we should honor that request as well.
 
Orrrrrrrr....

they will go back into the military and ply their trade under strict oversight...that is, if they are not too old or have any mental defects;)
 
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