I'm not afraid of terrorists.

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"I heard bubba say I should be able all be allowed to carry firearms on a plane"

There's already been talk whether a small pistol would pose a threat to a pressurized flying plane. It won't. Therefore bubba on vacation during 9/11 could have proven just the ticket for averting disaster. With a 1911 even moreso...
 
My house in East Jabibby isn't a terrorist target.
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Funny, thats what I thought about mine in Lackawanna at one time.
Just for the record I welcome the FBI here and their wire taps, They even have tiny cameras on some of the telephone polls here in the city.:eek:

kenny b
 
Well for one phone tapping and internet spying without reason is wrong,Idont agree with it.On the other hand i have nothing to hide.As for terrorists being scary,not really.On the other hand everyone is a target,being in Mi you would think pretty safe but there are a few potential places that if were blown up or hijacked could cause economic to the state,such as the automotive industry,then theres the great lakes that they could do something to who knows with these people.Myself i dont worry about it and would love to see them try and take over.Iwould guess if war ever broke out in the states civillians could probably just shoot people out their windows.OOps sorry got a little off subject.Anyway patriot act wrong,but really they already have people in mind to monitor and they want to be able to do so whenever without it leading to a dismissal in court for not having a warrant to do so.
 
The Patirot Act does not bother me, I suppose it would bother people who are doing illegal activities but that wouldn't be me. You conspiracy theory type guys go bananas everytime a new law is put in where the Government doesn't have to have a warrant to do this or that, they have done all of that anyway even before they passed the Patriot Act and similiar laws. You actually think they don't occasionally check people out? American politicians are too stupid to be a Josef Stalin or an Adolf Hitler, corporations own America.
 
Mikeyboy,

You should read a little closer on the Patriot Act. Yes, there is a section about "international terrorism", but there is also a section on "domestic terrorism".
 
Yeah, it all keeps coming back to 9/11 doesn't it? Well here's the thing about 9/11: They had all the information they needed to stop it from happening they just failed to get it all in one room. As Kean said, they failed to connect the dots.
So all your arguments supporting a Federal police state in the context of 9/11 are useless. If they couldn't connect the dots they had, burying them in a sea of dots ain't gonna help matters.

What's going on here is this:
Federal government: We have to violate your rights for your own good.
You: Yes! Keep the bad men away!
Me: Give me liberty or give me death.

See, there is no safety to be gained from throwing away your freedom. Those who would trade their freedom for safety deserve neither and soon lose both.
They are perfectly capable of combating terrorism without resorting to police state tactics.
 
I agree with you to a point GoSlash but my advice is to read how Capitalism works before you start spouting about totalitarian governments. The people in power would not gain anything by making this "police state", this isn't the USSR and it will never be, corporations own America and survive off of materialism.

You should also look at how the lobbying system works. I always get tired of reading all of this conspiracy theories when like I said, the politicians of the world today would not gain anything off of a totalitarian state for the main fact that they do awful things sometimes out of taking money under the table from *insert business, wealthy person, corporation here*. In a totalitarian state there has never been materialism and that is what America thrives off of and what has also made our economy the biggest in the world, massive trade and competition.

Do you understand that?

You are a smart guy though and very creative, you should be a writer, people eat this **** up.
 
gc70,
If terrorists were blowing up school buses in East Jabibby or shooting up shopping centers in South Podunk, the very randomness of the threat would cause a lot more fear in the population.
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Yeah, I've always thought the same thing. Remember when that nutcase was out cruising in his Caprice sniping random civillians along the Eastern seaboard?
I think he did more to terrorize average Americans than the 9/11 hijackers ever did.

Love/hate,
I take umbrage at the word "creative" although I assume you meant well by it. I haven't "created" anything here. This isn't a conspiracy theory. In order for it to be one, I would have to, well....theorize a conspiracy, which I have not put forth.
All I'm saying is that these things are happening and they're not supposed to. That frightens me.
 
I didn't mean insult at all and I like to see free-thinkers that don't look at the smokescreen like sheeple do. I am just trying to explain how there isnt anything to fear from our weak politicians. The old selfish "me me me" philosophy is about on the pre-school level of logic and thats where they are at. America is a country of selfishness and by taking away all of the liberties of civilians, by the way every president, governer, leader whatever becomes a civilian when they are done with their terms, by taking away all of the liberties of civilians does not benefit the ones in "power" at all.

I'm suprised the British people don't gripe about how their arms were taken away by the idiotic parliament, now that's something I would be griping about, and the British politicians didn't put the gun-ban so they could take over with their "police state", they did because they are absolute fools who think it solves the problem of gunshot deaths, and it also helps them look like a good bunch of jolly mates in front the British sheeple. With something as small as the Patriot Act which is flawed yes but it's not that bad and I am sure it will do more help in the future than more harm. Like I said if you aren't doing anything wrong you don't have anything to fear, if you're dealing drugs and talking about it with someone out of the country, then yes you have something to worry about.

The new one with the law allowing the FBI to screen internet chats and phone calls that go out of the country sounds like it's tyrannical but it's really not. Probably a million phone calls a day go out and the only people who are going to be screened are suspicious people who they cant get a warrant on.

If you're just having phone sex with a hit swiss woman you aren't going to be taken away and never found again I am sorry.

Lighten up a bit man, life is too short and certainly too short to worry about petty and weak political decisions. I'd rather concentrate on actual problems.
 
taking away all of the liberties of civilians does not benefit the ones in "power" at all.
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Or so one would think....but what of the Nixon administration's excesses? What about Hoover's excesses? How many countries in the world have made political dissidents disappear?
Politically speaking, there is a motive for elected officials to persecute innocent people who speak out against them.
I submit that it helps the cause of security *not one bit* to lock people up who's guilt you can't prove in a court of law. Ditto for eavesdropping on people when you can't prove reasonable cause in a court of law.
This behavior is ILLEGAL and very few people seem to care about that.
 
The new one with the law allowing the FBI to screen internet chats and phone calls that go out of the country sounds like it's tyrannical but it's really not. Probably a million phone calls a day go out and the only people who are going to be screened are suspicious people who they cant get a warrant on.

If you're just having phone sex with a hit swiss woman you aren't going to be taken away and never found again I am sorry.
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Let's say your worst nightmare comes true in 2008. Hillary wins the presidency. And let's say she's every bit what you think she is. Naturally, every conservative in the country will want her OUT and will be campaigning furiously.

But she's the president, and she has the power to abuse the Patriot Act. Suddenly, every former Republican senator and representative trying to get back in his seat but who is also a frustrated sex closet case is "overheard" having a polite conversation with Swiss Miss.

You don't think politicians will abuse our lack of rights? I want some of what you're taking.

I live in a fairly populated area and not all that far from a nuclear power plant. I am not and never was in the least bit afraid of terrorists. Might I die due to one? Sure. I might die from a meteor falling on my head, too.

Osama could've knelt on his rug and stayed head-down pointed at Mecca until the end of time for the US to come to a fiery end, but he could never have imagined a success like the Patriot Act. The reason he hasn't been caught and hasn't tried new attacks is he's retired. Mission Accomplished, as they say.
 
GoSlash27 - Don't be afraid; be aware..! Maybe, lay off the "Xanax" while you read world events; or maybe a bit of "Lithium Leveling" might help, I don't know...
I do know that we Americans including yourself, have (and some of us have fought for...) this outstanding and foremost right to speak freely and do as we please, within reason.
I find it highly offensive that you "Be-Little" other folks feelings as you have... Above all else, it absolutely disgusts me that you can even draw a rough parallel between our great Nation and N. Korea?! "Good Lord Guy, since it's so Freakin' Bad here in America, just go somewhere else (Please...) where you don't have to be afraid of your Government. I happen to Love mine; "Flawed Yes; better ANYWHERE ELSE; not a chance in Hell these days my "Fine Free (But truly warped..!) fellow American.

Eric Howland
Savannah, GA.
 
I think they will abuse their power and have ever since the beggining of civilization, and I think that it shows a very weak individual to let power go to his or her head. I don't fear terrorists and I don't our own government, and certainly don't give them credit to be cunning enough to create a police state that both has totalitarian control and benefits their greedy ways and the businesses they work for. You all give way too much credit to these ignorant people in "power". I hope Hillary doesn't win because that would be a definite disgrace to the word President, and not that several Presidents havent already done that but this would be a new low.

I am not against a woman being President at all and I think with a strong woman it could be a nice change, but Hillary is a joke, a fool and far leftist liberal. Not a very positive combination.
 
Go Slash27
I wasn't saying that because Clinton did it that it was ok that Bush did too. You made statements implying that the secret wiretaps and spying on internet usage only started because of Bush. I merely pointed out that it started long before that.
I don't like the fact that either party wants to have control over us commoners.
Many of the things that Bush is getting the most bashing over is basically following the Clinton "agenda" Increased spending,Free trade,defense of marraige act etc.
If you want to complain about how bad of a job the Repubs are doing don't try to tell me the Dems would do better. Last election the only thing the Dems could say in their favor was that Bush was bad .They had nothing to offer as to what they would do differently.If the Dems want to win they need to have something to offer other than ranting and name calling about how bad the hate filled white supremacist homophobic Fundies are.
 
You made statements implying that the secret wiretaps and spying on internet usage only started because of Bush.
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No I didn't. :) However, such activities were hidden and dangerous because they'd be subject to criminal charges if discovered. The difference is that now they're doing it out in the open with no fear of reprisal.

Also, you did not see me at any point imply that the Dems were any better or more desirable. I'd really appreciate it if folks would quit trying to pigeonhole me as a partisan.

I don't know how to say it any clearer: We have no friends in Washington! The Dems are not on our side. The Republicans are not on our side. They are all politicians and thus seek to attain authority. That's it! That's all they do.

Back to the subject at hand....even if the current administration didn't abuse their power (too late IMO) they have clearly set a precedent for future administrations. It's "okay" for the Feds to trample the Bill of Rights if it's a reeeally good reason .
This is a dangerous mindset and I do not condone it.
 
I love how we can debate the legality of wiretaps that used to be under some (secret) judicial review...that now aren't. Judicial review. Check and balances. Sounds like the scales tipped in favor of someone who's not prone to playing by the rules. Lets worry about hillary though, cuz she might abuse the power...ok. Good to know it's people like me & slash that are crazy...cuz if it were the rest of the world I'd start to worry.
 
Let's say your worst nightmare comes true in 2008. Hillary wins the presidency. And let's say she's every bit what you think she is. Naturally, every conservative in the country will want her OUT and will be campaigning furiously.
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Disclaimer: This is a hypothetical scenario, stated for purposes of illustrating a point. It does not necessarily reflect the political views of its author.
 
I knew it!! I knew it!! .45's a left wing hippie liberal hate amurica first terrorist loving freedom hating commie pigdog...where's your burning flag, terrorist?

Actually, given everyone in power's current stance, I would not be suprised in the least if hillary became the biggest 'conservacrat' in town, maybe even speaking at the next repub nat convention...Seriously though, that chick's crazy, it's in her eyes. To say nothing the f'd up things she's said offhand (anyone catch the 'plantation' comment at I think the black caucus? good stuff)...
 
Hillary is ill, and just look at Kerry and his wife, or Howard Dean, Nancy Palosie looks totally freaked out, and babbles on about nothing.

It's called LIBERALISM:D
 
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