I wonder if this guy will still be a cop, after the DNC

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If you can't keep your emotions in check when dealing with a bunch of obnoxious, smelly, jackasses screaming at you, then you should rethink your career choices.
 
Thanks for correcting me Winston, I saw the video on code pink's website and assumed. My bad.

I see the propaganda and use of force as 2 different issues.

From my earlier post.
Yes I think she deserved it, but use of force isn't based on "who is askin for it"
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Plenty of information you and I don't have either one of us could be right. From what I've seen, I am going to side with johnny law on this one.
 
Thats cool Recon7, I hear you. I have seen excessive force before. That is why I am so against it. And if you were right on who produced the clip. I would be leaning alittle more in the middle on this one. But I would still agree that it was excessive.

Groupes are getting involved in this one. So we will hear what comes of it. I know one thing. I bet that cop wishes there were no cameras or voice recordings............
 
Maybe the cop should have read this :D

And please do give this tired ol' thread a bump down the road when the rest of the facts come out.
 
Attention high-school bullies and pathological liars - win respect and admiration and generous retirement benefits! Apply at your local big-city police department today!

That New York video ... "offensive" doesn't even begin to describe it.
 
I wonder if the cop would be getting so much leeway on these forums if the protester was pro 2a or open carry rather than something left-wing nut?



I get sick when law enforcement gets impugnity for actions that would get you or I thrown in jail. The woman here wasn't "pushed" like some have said but hit. Take a good hockey cross check and let me know how great it feels.

The only time a cop should hit to injure is if his or someone else's life is in jeopardy. I'm not going to reserve judgement because clearly she was posing no danger to anyone in the moments before she was hit and if she had been endangering anyone earlier she would already have been under police control (the cop wouldn't have been chatting with her). If she was doing something illegal she should have been restrained, arrested and charged.



I feel just as strongly about the First Amendment as the 2nd, if not more so. The law enforcement playbook for conventions the last few election cycles at has been to keep protesters cordoned off from public spaces near the event then arrest, arrest, arrest and then see 99% of charges fail in court.

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

I know from experience that it is an absolute PITA having these functions and the accompanying protests in your city; that said, if you don't want the hassle, don't host one.
 
The only time a cop should hit to injure is if his or someone else's life is in jeopardy.
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So the following situations do not require physical force?

1 A man is being arrested for DUI. He refuses to submit to being cuffed, and pulls away from officers. When one grabs him, he pushes the officer away. This is by no means a life threatening situation. Should physical force be used? If not, how should the police make the arrest? Or should they let him go?

2 Four officers are dispatched to a local bar in response to a fight. When the officers arrive, the patrons of the bar pick the officers up and throw them out of the bar. They stand there at the front door, laughing and yelling insults to the cops who are no in the parking lot. They are ordered to disperse and continue taunting. Should force be used? If not, how should police control the situation? Or should the police just give up and leave?

3 A high school asks for police response because the students are outside refusing to go to class because they are protesting a change in the school lunch menu. One student who is standing in the street blocking traffic as a part of the protest is ordered to return to class. She gives the officer the "talk to the hand" gesture and refuses to comply. When he orders her to allow herself to be cuffed, she walks away from the officer. Is force appropriate? If not, how should the officer handle the situation? Or should he simply walk away?

Each of the above incidents are not hypothetical. They are actual calls that I have been present for.
 
If she was doing something illegal she should have been restrained, arrested and charged.
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Police in this video seem to be involved in an operation of some sorts, some kind of transportation of something. The cop we're all talking about appears to be on "Escort" duty: he's keeping the crowd away from the principal vehicle. I'm not quite sure he has the ability to arrest her or restrain her at this point, his job is to keep everyone back. This is likely why they come later on to arrest her, when they were done escorting they were free to detain again.

My speculation: She took a dive. Yes, he hit her, but she's obviously antagonizing it. I believe she might've layed on the ground because she believed she may be arrested there, and how great does it look if the cop who just knocked you out is now simply cuffing your unconscious body? Both parties in this video had an agenda. His was to protect his target from the crowd, hers was to have a cop hit her and get some attention to their cause.


Has anyone considered (my personal observation here) that police seem to focus on the instigators in a crowd control situation? Either mace, striking, etc, whatever force used, they seem to focus on the person who has potential to get the crowd fired into a frenzy. For all we know, this lady might've had 50 Code Pinks right behind her and the cop might've felt that they were all going to rush him? Maybe striking her was him trying to slow down her friends too?
 
Am I the only one that thinks the video was maybe "sped up" for just that instant to make the push look alot more energetic than it really was? I think that the respect people expect the police to show them is a two way street. The moron got what she was begging for.
 
Boy oh boy... one would think jumping to conclusions is the only exercise some people get on this forum.

Please read my post #19 on this thread. A longer video exists that may shed a little light on the subject.

The golf cart was to transport an arrestee... one that the Code Pink (or other protesters) were chanting for the cops to let him go. Police in the "confrontation" video appear to be trying to open a path for the transport of the arrestee.

Now... you've arrested someone, stuffed him into a small open vehicle to be taken to detention. The crowd is closing in yelling "let him go". A Sgt or LT orders the officers on crowd control duty to move the people back. Just how do they do that?

First it's a verbal command (yelled or issued over a PA). Sometimes the line of officers will be saying "get back...back up". But what do they do when the crowd doesn't move? Mostly it's get in their face time with a 36" long 1.75" diameter riot baton at chest level and start pushing them back. But some protesters are grabby types and reach for the baton. Technique is to rapidly shove out the baton and withdraw it - a "strike" move. It has the force of a good shove or palm strike.

If a protester grabs the baton... he's going to regret it. SOP is to rotate the stick vertical, then shove the upperhand forward and down. The other hand comes upwards and repeats. The motion almost looks like cranking a bicycle's pedals. The recipient usually gets a facial or collarbone strike (hard, we're not playing at this point). If he goes down, "at the line", SOP is to move the line forward so that officers behind the line can arrest the fool.

In this case, cops were trying to move the crowd. Perhaps Mz.Pink got too close and the officer used his push-strike tactic without engaging her body at all. She fails to back up and tells him to do it again. I'll repeat my warning here:

Never ask a cop for something you don't want.

That especially goes in regards to nightsticks, tasers and firearms.

Keep in mind the cops there are not aware of the overall crowd situation. 20 or 30 people closing in and shouting "Set him free!" will, to the front line cops, look like everyone in the crowd is ready to surge forward.
 
Hmmm maybe the cop got transfered from the NYPD to the DPD. For the DNC convention.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u_xAB...eature=related
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There is another video here that shows the contact in slow motion.

The cop deliberately targeted the rider from yards away and moved into the rider's path. You can see him about 2 seconds before contact grip his hands together to push the rider off his bike.

ABC news reports they have his badge & gun while they investigate. Baring some new evidence of a crime by the cyclist, there's only one thing more they need, IMO. The officer's resignation.
 
I don't know if I agree that the cop should loose his job. I think that his past service record should be taken into account, if he's never exercised any poor judgement in the past then hand out an appropriate punishment, but I don't know that it should cost him his career. He knocked the guy off a bike, if it was premeditated I don't think he would have done it in front of a parade (or what ever it was). If he has done this in the past more than once, maybe he's not right for the job. I'm not a cop, but I really wonder why he did it. Did he know the guy? I'd like to hear the other side.
 
Comon, divemedic, it's right there in the quote you used...should not 'hit to injure'. Doesn't say or even imply they can't or shouldn't use force when it's needed to do their jobs. In the two examples put forth so far both officers hit to punish and/or injure the civilians. Unacceptable. Period.
 
Just my two cents after looking at the video numerous times. The woman concerned was in no position to block movement of the vehicle. She was much too far to the right. Policeman in question was far ahead of others in line. I am going to assume a few things here that seem implied from the video. Policeman had already moved woman back once. Woman must have said something that enraged the policeman. The look on the policeman's face to me says a lot. He appears to be reacting out of anger rather than simply doing his job. Excessive force? In this instance, I would have to say yes. The woman posed no physical threat to the officer and was not in a position to obstruct the vehicle. If the officer cannot maintain his cool in a situation such as this he has no need to be in the line there. IMHO the officer in question needs a reprimand and additional training.
 
In the two examples put forth so far both officers hit to punish and/or injure the civilians. Unacceptable. Period.
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Where is the proof of that? Not in the video. I am not saying it didn't happen, but it is obvious on this board that there are people who will blame LEOs for whatever happens, and there are also those who would excuse LEOs no matter what happens. The truth is somewhere in the middle.
 
The truth is somewhere in the middle.
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Not in every case.

If you can't recognize what's right before your eyes, then I'm not sure what anyone could say to persuade you. What could it take?

The conduct of these officers is despicable, especially in contrast to the conduct black Ann Arbor Police Officer I was standing ten feet away from while he was tasked with crowd control to protect a Ku Klux Klan rally from hundreds of angry protesters as vile racial insults were hurled at him from not only the Klan behind him, but the protesters in front of him.

He was absolutely unflappable, showing not the slightest change in his stern expression and sharp eyes.
 
What caused the LEO to use force? Or are you alleging that the LEO has no authority under any circumstances to use force? Since we do not see what came before, how can you know what happened? Now, the NYC cop was wrong, but that is outside the scope of this thread, there is another thread on that incident. Different cop, different town, different PD, different circumstances.
 
The circus always comes to town with the DNC.
Amusing that these same people crying foul with regards to free speech were the same ones that drove the FoxNews reporters forcefully from their interview areas.
If the Democrats lose this election, stand the hell by. The circus will be coming to a street corner near you.
 
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