Home Defense: Rifle vs Shotgun vs Handgun

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I think you might find that difference isn't as big as you think. This link shows Clint Smith comparing a 1911 to an 18" shotgun:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=_APnhoIYeD0
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If you extend your arms like you're at the range they are right.
However moving around you still have to deal with extra length of the shotgun.

Additionally How far back can they tuck that shotgun in for retention? Cause I can bring that handgun WAY the hell back.. I can fire it one handed into your gut at chest-2-chest range while fending you off with 1 hand if I need to.

I can easily fire it from the hip if I need to.. opening doors.. not a problem.
Flash light? hey guess what I can keep it separate and not have to muzzle sweep my brother who came in late and broke a dish in the kitchen.

I can easily operate a phone while holding a handgun.

I could probably go on and on but you get the point.. yes in a fully extended stance your arms make up a lot of the difference in length but I don't necessarily need to do that with a handgun, THATS where the flexibility and maneuverability comes from.



Now with all I just said if all you need to do is hold up in your bedroom and cover the door then their assessment is correct not a huge difference but movement thru the house.. ya I don't buy it.
 
Joe, most of what you mentioned are training issues. If you aren't trained how to retain your rifle and you are trained how to retain your handgun, a handgun is probably a better choice for most.

Having said that, it generally takes a really tight structure much smaller than a house before guys who are well trained in that go to pistols (if they have a long gun available).
 
I see that the OP still hasn't come back to discuss the issue or discuss his experience with the guns in question and how that interacts with the posts in this thread.

Better do that OP, or this is shutting down.
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I hope the OP answers. I'd hate to see the thread shut down as seems informative, at least to me.
 
Let's all be quiet then and see if he shows! :D

Otherwise ....

Shot an AR in a carbine match, yesterday - it is a blast to do. We had a few rifle/handgun transitions. To be repetitive, one should try maneuvering around walls and doors with a long arm to give it a try. Training with the gun is, of course, a good idea.

Oh - OP - where are you? We are interested in your thoughts after reading the discussion?

BTW, for the OP - one guy shot a Mosin-Nagant. With a bolt gun, you get only one shot on a target and have to make a head shot. That's compared to the semis, where you have the usual IDPA target rules. The guy hit almost all the head shots except one really close up one. That's always a kicker, you make the hard shots and screw up the easy one. Of course, the gun was slow to reload for multiple targets. He shot it for grins. He also did the match with a second semi rifle as a more realistic choice.
 
I'll ask the OP, what is your shooting experience with the three platforms and which do you think you handle the best
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I do enjoy carbines in intermediate cartridges, but rifles are good too. Sorry for answering so late.
 
Well, I keep an 870 under the bed with 00 & #4 alternating, a full sized 1911 in .45 ACP in my nightstand and a 4" Model 65 with .357 magnum downstairs by my chair in my living room. Don't really factor my AR & AK into home defense, though I may start using the AK as a truck gun. My neighbor, who is a Constable deputy keeps his AR handy for his home defense. I figure if you at least have something handy that goes "bang", you're off to a decent start over the guy who thinks no firearms and a cell phone to call 911 is the answer.


De gustibus non est disputandum
 
Pistol caliber carbines are quite debatable as are the pistol variants of long guns. It is hard to see what they offer as compared to the 223 chambered regular configuration long arms.

Enjoying them is not the same as having experience with them in situations that simulate home defense.

I'm afraid we are stuck in a naive equipment based endless loop that really doesn't consider the actual application of various weapons in home defense.

Any of the three would work in a short, challenge the bad guy and hope he or she goes away scenario - or in a couple of shots fired and the bad guy goes away or gets put down scenario.

If we look at more prolonged or intensive situations with significant movement entailed, serious weapons manipulation, multiple opponents - then the discussion isn't really touching on them. OH, how about the Reminglock 339 Pistol blaster with underslung 4 gauge shotgun - that doesn't cut it.

You can adequately defend yourself with a good handgun, good pump or semi shotgun or carbine of standard type and with good SD ammo - if you have some idea of how to do it. The mind is more important than the hardware if you have a reasonable platform.

How about we lay out a plan to achieve some competence with a realistic firearm?
 
I'll chime in: I have had a mosin since high school and a pistol since 21. When I moved I decided that I needed something better for the home because whilst handguns are easily maneuverable and I do practice a fair amount with mine, I have read that a long gun is better for home defense and after all the research, I agree. I haven't gotten to an HD course yet, but it is in the intermediate future for sure. So until then I have taken a new shotgun to the range and also practiced "situations" in my home with both weapons.

At the range I am much more consistent with the shotgun as the range gets longer. As far as situations at my house, we have a basement, but I wouldn't ever just go down there to "sweep" the house. The dogs (ferocious wieners) will and have woken us up in the middle of the night and depending on where I hear the sounds dictates the SOP: always call 911 first, second, if they broke through the glass door, just hunker in the room with the shotgun that's right there, if they broke through/picked the lock on the front door it's into the bathroom and cover the stairs(the bathroom door is always open and it's attached to the room, if they are in the basement, cover the stairs. All the scenarios give me the advantage over the intruder.

Anyone is welcome to chastise/criticize, but I think that works best for me/us.

Edit: was writing this whilst you posted Glenn, does this count as a "semi" realistic plan?
 
Sounds pretty decent. Not exploring and hunkering down with a long arm is quite reasonable, esp. if you do practice with it.

That plan works with a carbine, or shotgun. I have both. I prefer the carbine for ease of use and larger capacity. I've done some shotgun training and feel comfortable with it. So it's a matter of experential preference.
 
Reloading is the sticky part. Which is why I may have only put some 100rds or more through the shotgun, I've loaded probably 3 times that much. Like I said, though, hopefully going to take a practical course soon and my hope is that they will have other guns to try than just the ones I bring.

Edit: had to think a little more, the round count is probably closer to 200 actually...
 
When you watch footage of a SWAT type team entering a hostile situation it is common to see all three, handguns,tactical shotguns and high capacity SBR's employed. So I guess the correct answer is have al three available with the correct rounds for home defense loaded.
 
Would be neat to see a shoot out between a rifle, shotgun and handgun in a typical house. Wonder who would clear the house first? If the shotgun was altered to shoot from the hil with a short as possible barrel, it just might win. But I thing modification's would be pretty extensive for it to do well. For rifles, the only one's having a chance would be AR type rifles if for no other reason than they are semi-auto. The handgun in any form would not need anything in the way of altering. I would for myself rather a semi-auto also. Fire power. My carry gun is a Shield 9c, single stack, 8 rds. That trump's a revolver with six rounds, BTW, my preference in handgun's is DA Revolver's. In my headboard is my choice for home defense, a P89 Ruger. Bit longer barrel, double stack magazine, heavier. The double stack mag make's the difference in my view. 16 rds ves 8 in my Shield. Shield hide's better and much lighter to carry all day. The Ruger on the other hand give's much needed fire power. I would hate to have to stop after 8 rds and change magazines! Fast as they can be changed, it's a lot faster to go to the extra 8 rds of the Ruger and then when it take's the same amount of time to load another 16 rds as another 8 in the Shield. Big factor in favor of a radically cut down shotgun is it will get anyone's attention! Rack in a round with a pump shotgun and the fight is probably in most case's be done!

I saw on the computer somewhere a head board that holds a full size shotgun. Pretty quick to get out but still have that length problem. If you actually need more than 5 rds to end the assault or run the guy off, you need more than the gun. You need to learn how to use it. I just though, on a cutdown shotgun it might not be an issue as with the full size shotgun. Cut the barrel down on a pump and the shot opens a lot quicker. Leave the barrel long and deal with the choke and the pattern tighten's up some. If the bad guy is in close enough, you could shoot poorly with the choked gun. Of course for changing someone's mind, there's nothing like blowing the gate off the hinges!
 
Don, read one of your earlier posts in this thread about cutting down a shotgun and then only using the pistol grip with no stock. I would recommend looking into accuracy and usability/operability of a pistol grip only shotgun.

I researched this heavily when I purchased my shotgun and read many posts, articles, and threads about the use of shotguns with a pistol grip only. In fact there was a user here on this forum that trained security guards in the use of "sawed off" shotguns and said how it could be made to work, but was the dumbest idea he'd ever seen and trained. Wish I could find that for ya, but if someone remembers that post just post it or pm me and I'll add it.
 
I agree with PlatinumCore16, on this one.
IME, any light 12 gauge SG, even with low
brass bird-shot, kicks like a mule on crack.
Add a pistol grip to that, and you're asking for
some serious recoil, especially when you're
firing buckshot loads.

That thing Linda Hamilton did with the riot gun
in T2 looked real cool, but in real life, it doesn't
work like the movies. I would highly recommend you
borrow somebody's 12G SXS Coach Gun, with a shoulder
stock, and cut loose with a few rounds, before you consider
putting a pistol grip on a shotgun.
 
I'll stick with my Sig handgun.
If I wanted to "clear the house" without regard to walls, water pipes, wires, gas lines or the neighbors, I'd pull out the rifle. Not going to happen.
 
I guess the correct answer is have al three available with the correct rounds for home defense loaded.
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I think, as I have been saying repeatedly, that they know how to use all of them appropriately.

No one real would suggest a pistol grip shotgun as optimal for the untrained home defender.

We are still in the loop of hardware over software.

It's mindset, tactics and THEN equipment.

How does a shotgun clear the house first? The shotgun doesn't do it by itself. It is the user, for God's sake.

I just hope for some readers of the thread, they get the takeaaway message that the magic equipment gun isn't the place to start. For the rest, enjoy the equipment fantasy. Boy - I'm cranky on this one.
 
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