heres a scenario for ya, what would you do?

Florida Law requires that you may pull you weapon in this instance, but you must try and retreat all the while being very verble, telling the perp to leave drop the screwdriver ECT,ECT,ECT. After you have backed to the wall and the perp comes over the counter then shoot him. If he leaves let him go.

I don't know who gave JimW his instruction but he sucks big time.
 
we dont have 7-11's around here anymore, they were bought out, but if i worked there, regardless of thier policy, i would be packing! that reminds me, several years ago i read about a 7-11 clerk who was robbed, the clerk had a gun and thwarted the robbery(no shots were fired), 7-11 showed thier gratitude for saving thier money by firing him. sounds like a hell of a place to work huh?
 
A similar scenario happened to a very good friend of mine. He went to 7-11 for 3 years picking up a coffee and going to work. 5 days a week. One day he comes in and someone is robbing the 7-11. He took the guy down from behind and disarmed him.

Police came and arrested the robber. He got free coffee for the next year. Because of the sensitive nature of his job, he had to decline press interviews. Oh well.

But to answer your question Snoopy, I would have drawn on the unlucky robber told him to drop his weapon or he goes down. If he crosses the counter he goes down. If he runs then I report him to the police.

If 7-11 fires me for carrying then I go to Starbucks and work where there are cuter girls and better coffee.... :cool:
 
I'm really surprised by all the responses of giving up the money and the feared outcome if you defended yourself. The state of NY is considered to be a liberal state but here in NY you would not have to back down. You draw and the out come is up to the robber at that point. I'm starting to believe the carry permits in many of the states are useless.

kenny b
 
i worked at a convenience store for a while, didn't carry but i did have a bat behind the counter. ran through the scenario MANY times in my head. guy gets close enough he gets it upside the head.

if i were carrying, and the guy only had a screwdriver, i would still probably just use the bat. seems like less legal hassle in the long run, in todays 'victim' society you never know.

pulling the gun could, i suppose, get you arrested for brandishing in some jurisdictions.
 
Thanks, Kennybs, . . .

"You draw and the out come is up to the robber at that point." Right now the biggest problem we face in this country is not the Democrats (though they do rank high), . . . its not the deficit, . . . its not cancer, . . . alcoholism, smoking, gambling and a bunch of other things.

Simply stated it is accountability. Anyone, anywhere, can do just about any darn thing they want to do, . . . no accountability, . . . no recourse, . . . no feet held to the fire.

It's time to take that back, . . . beginning with this bg. HE decided to be an armed robber. HE pulled the screwdriver. HE said gimme the cash. HE decided of his own free will and personal conscious decision, . . . "I'd rather rob than have a job."

Time to make him accountable. "On the floor, . . . dirtbag, . . . or John Moses Browning's best invention is just liable to help you pay your debt to society, here, now, today. End of sentence!"

I wouldn't shoot him if he decided to run, . . . but at 60, . . . I'm not fighting someone half or 1/3 my age, who is fighting for 20 or 30 bucks of someone else's money. If he crosses the plane in my mind from just a stupid jerk with a screwdriver, . . . to a serious threat to my health and well being, . . . it will be his last earthly crossing. Next one will be to wherever jerks with screwdrivers spend their eternity.

May God bless,
Dwight
 
Whaaat? While you was packing? Why even carry a gun then? If someone threatens violence you have to assume he'll step it up a notch and carry through if allowed. Don't encourage the criminal element by being permissive!
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I know what you're saying ... I even mostly agree with you, my friend. But it's just not reality.

If I felt I was about to get stabbed or if the person didn't back down ... oh yeah! I'd defend myself.

But unless I'm defending my life, drawing a gun at a 7-11 is going to cause me more trouble than it's worth.

Places like 7-11 pretty much have a deal with the criminals; the clerks are unarmed and told not to resist, but there is never very much cash in the register.

If you owned all the 7-11's, would you want all of your clerk's armed? If so, BG's would know about it too and ALWAYS come in packing and/or shooting.

I'm not a "passive public" fan, but I understand why corporation think why they do. Write or wrong, passive is cheaper.

As for me ... I've got a wife, a mortgage, and a kid that depend on me. Not going to endanger that stability for the pleasure of taking 1 2-bit punk off the streets.
 
A license to carry a firearm is not a license to use it. Under Florida law, you can use deadly force only if you reasonably believe yourself or another person to be in danger of death or serious personal injury, or to prevent the imminent commission of a forcible felony (such as rape, robbery or carjacking). There are two important concepts to remember: The first is the "Duty To Retreat"; this means that if you can avoid the danger by running away, then run away, no matter how you may feel that this affects your honor. The second is the "Castle Doctrine", which means that you do NOT have a "Duty To Retreat" when in your own home or place of business; you can stand your ground and defend your premises and possessions even if you could avoid personal danger by running away
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Ok JimW this should help clarify the use of Deadly Force laws in Florida the following is the link to the site which is very reputable and you will see it qouted quite often by members here.
http://www.packing.org/state/index.jsp/florida
 
Personally, I'd pull and shoot. He's engaging in aggravated robbery of your store or your place of employment. He is threatening you with a weapon that can conceivably be considered lethal. Seems like a justifiable shoot, to me. If the local laws are against that, and the prosecutor is a headhunter and pursues it, I'd be thinking of a jury nullification -- any reasonable judge or jury would toss the case. I mean, laws like that are so f****d up that's why there's that whole concept of jury nullification in the first place.
 
If the jackass came in to rob me and threaten my life with a screwdriver, I'd draw my weapon, aim for his COM or CNS, and politely advise him that he brought the wrong tool with him for a gunfight. I also would try to detain him for the police; but if he ran, I'm not going to give chase - just give the police a good description and last known direction of travel.

I would do a quick draw and shoot the screwdriver out of his hand. All of this I would do with out aiming, like the movies.
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:rolleyes:

-38SnubFan
 
Watching the video shots on TV of some 15 or so robberies of convince stores and seeing everything from BG shooting up the place and escapes to BG lays his gun on counter and Shop keeper picks it up and shoots BG to employee pulls gun from under counter and BG drops ball bat as she chases him out of store while emptying the mag to BG can’t open register so he tries to carry it of out of store and employee whacks him with a bottle of Cherry Vodka……… Well just too many real-life scenarios with varied outcomes.

Bottom line is it’s on tape, so as long as your reaction is justifiable why be concerned. As to Company policy’s I’d carry anyway. I mean what’s a 7-11 Corp guy gonna do, fire you? If you break their store policy all that can happen is you lose your job. If you’re a hero and shoot the guy then that won’t happen, if you are shot and the BG flees and maybe you wounded them, then what? 7-11 gonna sue you? Nope, you were in fear of loosing your life. Will they pay for your defense? Yep, they can’t afford the bad publicity.

I like to keep in mind the real possibility that if the SHTF it’s probably on tape, be it parking lot or inside a building. With that approach I have acceptable back-up to my story and all I need do is follow the rules of the State for using deadly force.

(but we don't have any 7-11's around here anymore. They closed due to the high incidence of robbery).
 
all that can happen is you lose your job. If you’re a hero and shoot the guy then that won’t happen, if you are shot and the BG flees and maybe you wounded them, then what? 7-11 gonna sue you? Nope, you were in fear of loosing your life. Will they pay for your defense? Yep, they can’t afford the bad publicity.
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I agree that carrying is better than not but a bunch of this is incorrect.

1. If you shoot and are a hero you will still be fired because you acted contrary to 7-11 policy.
2. You will not be sued by 7-11 but you may be by the robber or the robber's family.
3. 7-11 will not pay for your defense because you acted contrary to 7-11 policy.
4. They're not afraid of bad publicity from firing you or not paying your defense, they care about MONEY. They're afraid that THEY will be sued by the robber/robber's family. By cutting all ties with you (firing you) and because you acted contrary to their policy, they can say that they have no responsibility for your actions and therefore be virtually immune from liability with respect to the robber.
 
Personally, I step back as far as possible and draw. Tell him to drop the screwdriver. If he moves towards me, he gets STOPPED. If he runs, I go lock front doors and call 911. A screwdriver can certainly kill. And I am NOT going to die or be injured while I am armed if I can help it PERIOD.
 
Just a side note. I was in a rush when I typed the reply above.

A coworker was carrying a firearm on a job for the company where I currently work. It was suggested by his management that the type of job he was doing made a firearm a useful accessory.

He had a negligent discharge which resulted in a fatality. The circumstances of the case were such that my coworker was not criminally liable. The family of the dead person sued the company in civil court, NOT my coworker--HE doesn't have any money. The case stalled because there was no evidence that his management had actually suggested or even knew that he was carrying a firearm while on company business.

When an email surfaced that showed both were true, the company settled out of court for 4 million. Now we have a strict no firearms policy. Not even locked in your vehicle on the company parking lot. Not even if you have a CHL permit.

It's all about money. Companies don't care anything about their employees--only their liability.
 
...."Do you really want to do that?"

I was working in my Pap's Chevron station here in Arizona when I was 18. I got stuck with the night shift. We didn't do a lot of night business...it was an old-style service station..8 pumps, soda cooler, cigarettes, and oil. Pap being Pap, he wanted me there to clean the station at night, and might as well sell a few gallons of gas while I was at it.

I was out hosing down the lot at around 2:00am when a guy walked into the lot. He was REAL scrubby, and the smell of old beer and urine preceeded him.

I was carrying my Smith & Wesson Model 66 snubby in an old Bianchi IWB holster, just to the right of my belt buckle. CCW Permits didn't exist here yet, but CCW was legal on private property with the permission of the owner, or lessor of the property. Obviously, I had permission!

I went inside, behind the counter and waited for "stinky" to get through with what he wanted. He asked for a pack of Bugler tobacco and some matches. I set them on the counter, and when I did, he opened up his jacket, and showed me a cheap sheath knife, and told me he wanted the money.

I stepped back a step, lifted MY shirt with my left hand, and put my hand on the stock of my .357, and asked..."Do you really want to do that?"

"Uh...Uh...Uh...$hit...you ain't supposed to have a gun!" he said as he back-pedalled to the door, and tripped over the wheel cart with all the oil on it.

I never saw him again...
 
Honestly;if you care more about liability than your life,your CCW is useless.Screw 7-11.Do you want to die or fight a court case against the victims family? I don't know about any State law that you have to be attacked with only a gun or knife to defend yourself,I'm no expert but that doesn't follow most lethal force laws.If someone attacks with any object baseball bat,tire iron,stabbing intsrument screwdriver etc.You fear for your life,you have met lethal force requirements in most States.Some require an attempt to retreat,but that is not always practical.You may have a hard time explaining you shot someone for trying to stab you with a pencil,although potentially deady.
However,a screwdriver is an intimidating dangerous make shift weapon as deadly as any dirk/stilletto.
 
Quote:
"If you owned all the 7-11's, would you want all of your clerk's armed? If so, BG's would know about it too and ALWAYS come in packing and/or shooting."


Trust me if the bad guy's thought all 7-11 employees were armed,it would be the last place they would be visiting.
 
What Would You Do?

A different slant, here in Texas the owner can carry handgun in plain sight on his premises, his employees may if he permits them to, in which case the BG likely gives the place a wide berth.

On the other hand you might get in a stance to draw, announce, "I am armed and you drop the screwdriver and lay face down on the floor". The BG will likely tear down the door exiting the scene.

And then you may just have to shoot him if he pursues the matter,
 
I would also like to add.There is nothing wrong with finding out what reprecusions there is to certain actions.If you are more concerned with being sued by the Bad guy's family after defending yourself,you will cause yourself to delay in reacting to defending yourself.After a quick sum up of the situation you need to decide what action you will take.This happens in mili-seconds in your mind when the SHTF.Start to think about a civil suit as a well as a grand jury when you should be thinking of saving your arse,you may just wind up getting killed.It should not be difficult to determine when you need to defend yourself.There are too many "what if" scenerios and variables you will not be able to have them all worked out before something happens.
 
Obviously it depends on your states laws - you'd be stopping him from aggravated robbery, justified in Texas with the use of deadly force. If you live in a liberal county *sigh*, I don't know how well this would go over with a jury. I think it's an easy call, he's commiting armed robbery on you - but with a crappy weapon. You pull and let him know what's going to happen if he moves while you wait 30 minutes for the cops to arrive. :) He makes a lunge with a sharp, pointed, metal object at you - it's an easy call.
 
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