Gov/public school: social engineering?

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jesus christ

THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A GAY AGENDA

whatever you think the "gay agenda" is, it's a lie perpetuated by politicians to get you to vote. that's it. there is no gay agenda. it doesn't exist. gay people are not the borg, there's no single autonomous opinion or goal.


There is no gay agenda. Whoever told you there was has lied to you.

The existence of homosexuality in other animal species was discovered through science. It's fact. Any claims to the contrary are either flat out lies or the inane ramblings of ignorant people who prefer to stick their fingers in their ears instead of understanding the real world around them.

And it doesn't look like the book is off the shelves. For now it just looks like either homophobes or bible thumpers - or some combination thereof - trying to push their "agenda" on the minds of impressionable children that don't know when they're being lied to. But if it does get removed then the people who actually care about the education of those children will fight to get it put back.

Parents like that are trying to squelch knowledge. Trying to keep their children stupid. If it takes the federal government stepping in and giving those kids a chance to see the real world and not the fantasy land their parents have conjured up for them then so be it. It'll be the fault of the parents who refused to accept that knowledge and rational thought are important to raising intelligent children. All because of their "agenda".
 
Well, I disagree with you that a book that promotes a gay agenda is science
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Exactly what is this gay agenda you speak of? Its abook about two penguins, who raised another baby penquins. Your kids will not "catch the gay" from reading a book. Who knows, mabey they will pick up a little tolerance, and be entertained along the way.

I think its sad that today, in 21st century America, we still cant teach science in school. I graduated high school 10 years ago, and I what science I know, I learned in college.

The dumbing down of America continues...
 
Parents like that are trying to squelch knowledge. Trying to keep their children stupid.
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How does taking a book about penguins off a library shelf make children ignorant of homosexuality? I know what homosexuality is, and did not read about it in elementary school.
 
I do not see the problem with this supposed "gay" penguin book. Its not like the two penguins are frequenting gay bars, and wearing leather chaps. All fooling aside, has anyone here actually read the book, or are we just taking the word of some sanctimonious religious nuts who sees a gay agenda in all children books. Maybe they should be asking themselves why they see a "gay" agenda in children books. It seems to be a personal issue. Maybe we should stop passing judgment until we fully understand what is at play here.

To add: I have yet to see a gay agenda being taught at schools, maybe people are confusing teaching tolerance with being gay. Tolerance is in short supply in today's world, so I find it worthy that teachers are trying to promote a fuller understanding of the human condition than trying to teach worn out religious dogma. This segments to my other point that their is a fundamentalist religious agenda being pressed on school boards across the country. Which reminds me of the other extremist groups around the world that press their religious ideology on a society. I am afraid we are heading down the same worn path.
 
Maybe we should stop passing judgment until we fully understand what is at play here.
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A very big +1 from me. Thats one of the smartest things I've read on the internet in a very long time. Thank you!
 
This entire thread is yet another example of what happens when the school becomes a babysittter. At any rate. A book was removed from a library because ONE person complained and this was WRONG. ONE person complained and got the Pledge of Allegiance by removed from the school and this was RIGHT. Seems to be quite of bit of picking and choosing these days as to what is and is not right...............................

I think I answered my own question though. According to the public school anything containing or implying GOD is wrong by defualt and heaven forbid our kids hear about GOD or that there might be HELL to pay(pun intended) if they go out and commit a mass murder/suicide. Right and wrong is relative and they can kill some one becuase "it was right for them even if it wasn't for those involved" Yet no one can figure out why this country is where it is.

I'm off my soap box now,
Sod Breaker
 
According to the public school anything containing or implying GOD is wrong by defualt and heaven forbid our kids hear about GOD or that there might be HELL to pay(pun intended) if they go out and commit a mass murder/suicide.
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Not all public schools have gone that route. The school my kids attend had a Christmas play that actually mentioned the name Jesus.

I am sure there are those who would rather read books about gay penguins, and thats ok with me too, if thats what most people in that district want.
 
All I know is that as a very recent graduate of the public school sytem (2006) I will never submit and kids of mine to that sae treatment The only reason I know what I do is because of a card at the CITY library. . As far as I'm concerned I taught myself.

Redworm,
Take this as you may,

It is my experience with you that anything remotely implying God and your mouth begans to foam, please explain this phenomenom.

Second You mention kids should only be taught scientific truth. How do you define this. Not that long ago sceintific truth said the world was flat and the sun revolved around it. Furthermore how do you propose we teach something that is constantly changing? one class we believe one thing and the next the opposite, simply because of the rate in which research takes place.
 
Gay penguins

Sounds like the Reverend Falwell and his BS about how the Teletubbies were alll part of the gay agenda.

The religious right still mocks the data on a species like certain shrimp where they changes from one sex to another as they mature."Although most species of caridean shrimps have separate sexes, a fair number are "sequential hermaphrodites" in which an individual is first one sex and then changes to the other at some later stage of life. Individuals are first male, then female (protandry)." http://www.ucs.louisiana.edu/~rtb6933/shrimp/hermaph.html

hermaphrodite An individual that possesses both male and female sex organs; ie it is bisexual. I'll bet this science concept really pisses off a few true believers.
 
Sounds like the Reverend Falwell and his BS about how the Teletubbies were alll part of the gay agenda.
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You got to admit it is one of the gayest shows on TV. An adult would have to be pretty gay to watch the teletubbies, and enjoy it. I would never watch it in fear of catching the "gay". :D
 
It is my experience with you that anything remotely implying God and your mouth begans to foam, please explain this phenomenom.
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Only when it's done in school because children view school as a place to learn things they assume to be true. If they are taught about religion in school then they will associate those things with truth and the simple fact is that no matter how much faith one wants to have there is no evidence to support any religion and thus should not be passed off as fact, especially not to children that haven't quite learned how to think critically and make informed decisions.
Second You mention kids should only be taught scientific truth. How do you define this. Not that long ago sceintific truth said the world was flat and the sun revolved around it. Furthermore how do you propose we teach something that is constantly changing? one class we believe one thing and the next the opposite, simply because of the rate in which research takes place.
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This is a misconception. It was never "scientific truth" that the world was flat or that it was the center of the universe. These were popular ideas that permeated the collective consciousness before there was such a thing as the scientific method. Once people began looking at the world with rational eyes they learned that the earth was not flat and that the earth was not the center of the universe.

Children should be taught that science does constantly change. That's the whole point of learning and acquiring knowledge. As our species learns more about the world around us we are better able to pass along that knowledge to the next generation for them to learn even more.

And I'm sorry but research does not take place at that speed. It takes a long time for scientific consensus to make a 180 and it does so through years of research, observation, experimentation and - one of the most important things about science - peer review. It's not just a couple of guys in lab coats making guesses and writing textbooks, it's the entire scientific community taking these theories and putting them to the test to make sure they're not a crock of bull.
 
This should be a local and state issue, not a federal or national issue. I don't see why this is a national story. No one's rights are limited by pulling this book off the shelves if that is what the parents want, and no one's education is hurt by not being able to read about unconventional penguin families in elementary school.
 
It's true that scientific consensus takes time to change. It has nothing to do with science itself but because scientists are human, flawed and often stubborn with the need to fit in with their peers. Einstein even succumbed to it by changing his formulas to allow for a steady state universe, the popular notion at the time. It's important to teach the difference between science and consensus as there is often a fine line and it can be agenda driven.

I didn't read the book but I doubt it was pulled just because of one complaint, there probably was something to it, and yes, there is a gay agenda. The gay agenda absolutely wants to make as soon as possible the impression in kids minds that it is not only acceptable but perfectly normal. They are teaching that nonsense to kids too young to even understand what sex is, early indoctrination is their best bet.

Many arguments on it turn out like this with misrepresentations and propaganda in the form of an asserted consensus. I never heard anyone take issue with creatures changing sexes and Jerry Falwell didn't speak for anyone but himself about teletubbies. I don't if there was anything to it or not. The gay agenda often misrepresents a supposed gay nature in animals by either lying or misunderstanding animal nature. Males will mate with females given the opportunity, bonding with same sex members in a group isn't sex or a sexual preference.

Most parents don't want this early indoctrination of their kids and schools have no right to subject them to it. It is agenda driven for propaganda purposes and needs to be reeled in were ever it rears its' ugly head.
 
Only when it's done in school because children view school as a place to learn things they assume to be true.
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I would say that many things that are taught in school could be viewed as
suspect and have an agenda other then religion, to put ones faith in public
schools to always teach the truth is naive. We've strayed much to far away
from the basics in public schools past 40 years.
 
children that haven't quite learned how to think critically and make informed decisions.
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children view school as a place to learn things they assume to be true
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So giving them a book about penguins and how they raised a baby penguin all by themselves tells them what?

I agree there is no gay agenda, but you have to admit with your own statements above that just giving them a book where they can make their own decisions is not the right thing, I mean they are impressionable.

At what point does it then become the teacher explaining homosexuality in school and saying "It is ok to be one, or you may have been born a homosexual. I mean after all, some species are homosexual we just are not sure if humans are linked that way genetically."

If you are going to be suggestive about a subject like homosexuality then you must also be fair to the opposing view.
 
The teacher's agenda should be to teach as impartially as possible. They shouldn't impose their personal views on homosexuality, religion, politics or anything else. Right and wrong belongs at home.

But I'm curious how a species survives being gay? Wouldn't at least one student question something like that?
 
and yes, there is a gay agenda.
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No, there isn't. There isn't a gay agenda any more than there's a black agenda or a blonde agenda. There isn't a singular opinion shared by the entire gay community. There is no gay agenda.

The gay agenda absolutely wants to make as soon as possible the impression in kids minds that it is not only acceptable but perfectly normal.
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Well it depends on your definition of normal but since homosexuality occurs with roughly the same frequency in our species as it occurs in most others then yes, it is normal. And why is it so wrong to teach children tolerance? Yes, they should be taught to accept that homosexuals are human beings just like them, just like white kids had to be taught that black kids were human beings just like them and that being black is perfectly normal and acceptable.

The gay agenda often misrepresents a supposed gay nature in animals by either lying or misunderstanding animal nature. Males will mate with females given the opportunity, bonding with same sex members in a group isn't sex or a sexual preference.
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It seems you're the one misunderstanding the issue. Not all males will mate with females given the opportunity and bonding with same sex members in a group can often be attributed to the sexual preference of the specific animal.
I would say that many things that are taught in school could be viewed as
suspect and have an agenda other then religion, to put ones faith in public
schools to always teach the truth is naive. We've strayed much to far away
from the basics in public schools past 40 years.
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That's why there are highly educated researchers, scientists, analysts and other professionals that get together and figure out what the proper thing to teach is. People far more qualified with a better understanding of childhood development and education than the average parent.

So giving them a book about penguins and how they raised a baby penguin all by themselves tells them what?
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That homosexuality is a natural occurrence. It's teaching kids to be tolerant of people different from them, to avoid the prejudice that is often instilled into them by parents and other sources.
I agree there is no gay agenda, but you have to admit with your own statements above that just giving them a book where they can make their own decisions is not the right thing, I mean they are impressionable.
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It's showing them that it exists in nature. It's the truth. If they then want to deny it in spite of the evidence in front of them because of what their parents have taught them, so be it. But schools should be presenting all the facts, not denying them access to knowledge.
At what point does it then become the teacher explaining homosexuality in school and saying "It is ok to be one, or you may have been born a homosexual. I mean after all, some species are homosexual we just are not sure if humans are linked that way genetically."
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well that statement would be erroneous because it is primarily a biological cause, not a "choice"

If you are going to be suggestive about a subject like homosexuality then you must also be fair to the opposing view.
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Even if the opposing view flies in the face of the facts? Even if it flies in the face of the biological aspects, of the science of the matter?

That's not even considering the fact that the opposing view is one of intolerance akin to racism.

The teacher's agenda should be to teach as impartially as possible. They shouldn't impose their personal views on homosexuality, religion, politics or anything else. Right and wrong belongs at home.
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I agree. I'm not suggesting that teachers tell kids that they should think homosexuality should be encouraged or applauded but that it does exist, it is biologically natural and that they need to accept its realism like they accept skin color.
But I'm curious how a species survives being gay? Wouldn't at least one student question something like that?
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Because the frequency of homosexuality in virtually all species is in the single digit percentages.
Kinda flies in the face of "survival of the fittest", doesn't it?
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Not at all. While it's genetic, it's not hereditary. Gay people won't necessarily have gay kids. 3-9% of the population not mating does not hamper the ability of the species to prosper.

Some would argue that it's a form of population control but either way it hasn't stopped our species from growing.
 
Second You mention kids should only be taught scientific truth. How do you define this. Not that long ago scientific truth said the world was flat and the sun revolved around it. Furthermore how do you propose we teach something that is constantly changing? one class we believe one thing and the next the opposite, simply because of the rate in which research takes place.
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This is a misconception. It was never "scientific truth" that the world was flat or that it was the center of the universe. These were popular ideas that permeated the collective consciousness before there was such a thing as the scientific method. Once people began looking at the world with rational eyes they learned that the earth was not flat and that the earth was not the center of the universe.
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Indeed. Weren't the ancient Egyptians the first to figure out the circumference of the Earth using trigonometry?

ETA: Sorry, I just looked it up. It was the ancient Greek mathematician Eratosthenes. He calculated the Earth's circumference to with a margin of error of less than 1%.

All this before the birth of Christ, no less.
 
The problem with the American public school system is the National Education Association, and the Dpeartment of Education, which was President Jimmy Carter's greatest gift to the NEA.

Do some research on the NEA and the results will shock you.

The NEA supports keeping bad teachers in place, and you will find time and time again that the worst teachers are the biggest teacher union advocates.
I know this form personal experience. Do a google search for "Uniserve Directors" and the results might be shocking as well.
I personally went head to head with two Uniserve Directors, and they only backed off when I threatened them BACK.

Teachers are forced by "accountability" politicians to teach to standardized tests, which removes common sense and thinking from the equation.
 
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