getting a new squirrel gun...

you can dress for the cold... high heat & humidity from all those 10,000 lakes, coupled with voracious Mosquitos... summer sucks, litterally... I live for the spring & fall months...

hoping to have this done before the leaves drop, & try to cut down on the overly large red pine squirrel population...
 
I stopped by & checked out the progress last night... the test fitting cylinder cycles at 8 as good as the factory 6 did, with a custom index hand... buddy said he got lucky, sometimes he may need to grind 3-4 hands to get it working like it should, but he got it perfect on the 1st try... we pulled the grip frame off, & discussed the cylinder stop pin... we're thinking it's designed looser, so it requires less factory fitting of the parts... it's not too excessive, but the cylinder has "some" wiggle until the trigger is pulled... that wiggle is the cylinder stop moving side to side in the frame slot... the fix we came upon, was to add a short screw, drilling & tapping a hole in the frame, above the trigger, screwed in from the inside, that screw will contact the side of the frame for support, & will have the side that faces the cylinder stop dressed out flat, & tight on the cylinder stop hand, to reduce the wiggle, then the screw end will be dressed smooth with the frame above the trigger, & will be barely visible... this will actually strengthen the cylinder stop assembly, as well as tighten it up...

another snag... that we didn't foresee... with the smaller diameter chambers, on the full sized frame... the stock extractor rod won't fit into the chambers... the chamber location is dictated by the bore, & with the smaller chambers, the stock rod will just barely run into the sides of the smaller chambers... the rod is very robust, as it is the same one used on the 44 magnums... the next size smaller hardened rod will go in, & changing the angle ever so slightly will be all that's needed to address that issue... I don't expect anyone interested in trying this on a Single Six or Bearcat would run into this issue, & it has nothing to do with the amount of chambers, it's directly related to the larger frame size, & smaller diameter chambers...

sounds like a lot of issues, but nothing that is a deal breaker... my buddy still feels this will be one of the easiest conversions he's done lately... I'm just listing the things we run into, so anyone reading, understands why the gun smith gets what he does when doing this kind of work :)
 
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ooooh... I hate waiting for supplies...

my buddy attempted a fix at tightening the cylinder stop, & was able to get about half the slop out of the gun, but the stock cylinder latch looks to have been ground about .004" narrower than the cylinder stop notches ( in the stock cylinder ) of course the new cylinder is made, except for the chambers, & he cut the cylinder stop notches, at factory dimensions... so the new cylinder is still looser than we'd like... I just ordered a new cylinder latch, that hopefully will not be ground narrower, in an attempt to tighten it a little...

my chamber reamer is still sitting at PTG, a week after it was ordered... I had hoped to see it Friday... nope... well... then for sure on Monday... nope... a call to PTG, told me their shipping department is backed up, & it's not left the facility yet ( in Oregon ) which is at least 3 days shipping to Minnesota... likely won't have the reamer here till next Monday :mad:... I guess I can hope for Friday...

the barrel liner is installed, the Cylinder latch assembly should ship today from Brownells... I could be test firing the revolver next weekend, if the reamer would get here...
 
after my 1st call wasn't returned within several hours yesterday I called a 2nd time... apparently rattling the cages helped... the 2nd call revealed that my reamer was "stuck" in shipping... anyway I was issued a tracking number by end of day yesterday ( maybe I'll have the reamer here by Friday ) I've found the PTG reamers to be by far the best to actually use... our experience is much less chatter potential than with the Clymer reamers we've used in the past
 
25 ACP reamer arrived from Dave at PTG today :)

still was having issues with a tighter than stock lock up on this revolver... we can make it lock up tight, but then the loading gate won't open :confused: thinking it must be twisting something in the lock work... my buddy was playing with the new part over the weekend... haven't touched bases with him yet though, to see where we are with that...
 
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well... he did some fitting of the new lockwork, & the cylinder locks up tight, & the loading gate opens smoothly...

Pilot holes are drilled, & throats reamed, so today the revolver should be done, now that I got him the reamer... :D

BTW... I processed another 1000 - 25 ACP cases over last weekend... now have about 750 R-P cases, & about 700 WIN cases ( the 2 largest lots from basic mixed headstamp range brass )
 
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I love following your projects! They are great! Keep it up, and I can't wait to see some bushytails fall to this!
 
MWM, commendable project:)

The primer falls out of 25 acp brass at ~~50kpsi. Deep extractor groove getting close to the primer pocket makes the primer pocket weak [ like a miniature 10mm or 7.62x39mm case]. With some powders the limit is more than a triple charge. With some peaky powders that is less than a triple charge. The noise and recoil are in excess of 22 WMR.

I have not done 25acp in a revolver, but expect that before loose primer pockets there will be sticky extraction [like the real limit of 357 mag].
The individual extractor of your six gun should be better than a star extractor.
 
thought since you brought this back to the top, I better throw out an update...

the reamer arrived a while back, but it's not useable... it is 25 ACP in CIP standard, not SAAMI... the dimensions are smaller ( so that a larger "in spec" factory cartridge would not have inserted into the chamber ), there was no throat, & the case mouth edge was tapered, so there was no way to headspace on the case mouth... so after going back & forth 4-5 times with PTG, they found me a SAAMI spec reamer, & will send it out this week, & send me a return label for the CIP spec reamer...

I hate delays... :mad:

I'm now at least "thinking" about a companion rifle... the Ballistics By The Inch website shows gains in velocity to around 16" with factory cartridges... by choosing a slower powder, I may get more velocity out of both the revolver, & a companion rifle... I'm a contender collector as well, & have several carbine barrels, so for less cost of this experiment I'm thinking about lining a Contender carbine barrel, & trimming to 16+ inches...

the ballistics by the inch site shows around 1000 fps with the 50 grain factory loads in 16" of barrel... aught to be very efficient...
 
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TJ's liners is where I got the .251" liner for the revolver... they sell by the inch, so I'll be contacting them, when time comes for a carbine barrel...

Loaded my 1st 25 ACP cartridges last night, just loaded a few for chambering & revolver check out...

I used the R-P cases I had... 1st thing I noticed, is they were plenty short... I loaded 2 that were .602" & 5 that were .606-.607" book says .615 is max...

so we'll likely chamber the head space on the case mouths at .610 - .612"

I loaded the 2 - 55 grain FP cast bullets my buddy cast for me ( the round nose seating stem will need replaced for this bullet if it works well in the future )... & 5 assorted 50 grain round nose bullets I pulled from old 25 ACP ammo, ranging from soft point, cupronickel, & FMJ...

the short cases got 1 FMJ, & one cast, & the longer got one cast & the balance of assortment...

I used 1.6 grains of Unique for these loads, chosen because it'll fill the case ( not compressed though ) & should offer more gas volume ( which my buddy was worried about having enough of ) 1.6 grains is the max for a 50 grain FMJ in the books...

I'm going to be looking for something ( outside the box ) with maybe a bit slower ball powder or something I could build an arbor for, for my Lil Dandy powder measure, that will meter well enough that I don't have to weigh charges, like I'm doing with the Unique right now...

my buddy found an article in a handloader magazine that used AA#2, & a big enough charge that I could likely use a powder measure... I'm looking at a few other powders as well, all of which I won't post, as I haven't tried them, & they are not published, but which will likely work better with the longer than 2" standard 25 Auto pistol length barrel... which ever I choose, this is going to be a very efficient cartridge to load, which with cast bullets, is likely going to make the primer the most expensive component

BTW... got the tracking number for the correct SAAMI 25 ACP reamer... should be here Monday or Tuesday next week...
 
Most of the published loads for 25acp seem to be Bullseye, but I have found with a 50 gr bullet, not enough Bullseye will fit. After trying many powders, Power Pistol is the best.
 
I wish the pistol powders would get back in stock... the powder my buddy recommended I try is Accurate #5, of course I have a quite large powder library, but seem to be missing powders in that burn rate area... don't have any Power Pistol either...

BTW... UPS tracking # indicates Wednesday morning delivery of what I hope is the correct chamber reamer :(
 
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the new "correct" reamer came today, & is already over at his house, so I may have the gun to try by this weekend...

here is a pic ( crabby cell phone pic ) of it as it sat this morning...

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also picked up between 50-60 bullets he cast for me, the custom 5 cavity bullet mold, a custom straight sizing die ( for tumble lubing ) & a custom lubrisizer die

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it was my builder buddies birthday yesterday... he spent his 74th birthday doing what he loves... working in his shop... he finished reaming the chambers, figured out the extractor issue, & called me at 7:30 pm to tell me the gun is done :) I feel honored he wanted to spend his birthday, doing whatever he wanted, & he spent it finishing up my revolver...

I'll pick it up today, & hopefully over this long weekend, I'll get to put a couple 100 rounds through it...

will have to see how far off the sights are, & if they can be adjusted enough to shoot to point of impact with the 25...

BTW... I ordered a nickel Luepold scope base & set of rings... if it looks like it's going to shoot accurately enough to warrant, it'll get a scope
 
well I had the gun out twice over the long weekend... I shot through an old part box of Winchester white box ( probably 80's vintage ) to 1st test the gun... made me a little nervous, as one was harder to extract, & I found a cracked case... next cylinder... same thing, one cracked... at this point I took a sharpie marker & marked the cylinder that the cracked case came out of... was worrying maybe one chamber was bad... however, I kept getting one cracked nearly every cylinder full, but they were in different chambers... got a couple cylinders that I didn't get one cracked... then I ran my 1st handloads through, with the cast bullets, these were R-P brass that were fired at least once... & had a maximum load of Unique... no cracked cases... then I proceeded to shoot up about 75 rounds of mixed 40's - 60's vintage rounds, just to get them shot up, no cracked cases... since I have close to 750 Winchester cases for reloading, I hope they all don't end up as brittle as the 1st factory rounds I tested...

several surprises... every bullet left the barrel, even some older ones that barely made a pop, the bullet hit my steel target ( on the old ammo I did have 3 failed primers... no fault to the gun, the black hawk puts a solid dent in them ) the bullet from this cartridge makes a resounding smack on my steel plates, in fact I only did 2 cylinders full at an actual target, to check for point of impact ( I shot in the evening after sweating off 2 shirts working around the farm, so I could barely see straight, lots of sweat in my eyes through out the day ) but I shot targets mounted to my standard steel 55 gallon drums I use for target backers... both the handloads, & factory loads shot to point of aim at 25 ft ( did not need to adjust the sights on the revolver ) & about 15 - 20% of them, went through both sides of the barrel ( more powerful than a standard 22 LR high velocity, as they rarely go through the back side of a steel drum ) also the gun was quieter than I expected... I expect the bullets are subsonic, as there is much less "crack" than with standard 22's...

I need to load up some more handloads this week, & get the chronograph out, & actually look to see what kind of velocities I'm seeing, & if I can tighten up the groups I can get out of the gun... both times I shot paper, gave me about a 4" - 8 shot group, but I'm blaming that on me, for shooting at the end of the day, after a lot of physical work... a lot of sweat in my eyes through out the day

since I'm hoping for something accurate enough to shoot squirrels out of trees, I picked up a Luepold mount & rings, that should be here this week, I have a couple silver scopes that are currently on little used Contender barrels... I'm thinking a parallax adjustable 2-7 Burris aught to do a nice job on this gun... I'll shoot the next groups at my standard 60 ft ( distance from my rifle bench, to my pistol backstop )... or it may be closer, if I do the chronograph & targets at the same time ( I have an adjustable chrony table that allows me to move it in place, & shoot targets & check velocities at the same time )
 
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As the younger crowd says (or maybe USED to say) way cool!

Thanks for keeping us updated on the project thru the actual shooting. It's been very interesting especially your description of the accuracy of the gun and the power of the cartridges.
 
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