Get the right CCW weapon

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Kraigwy - Not saying at all to give up. By no means is that implied. I am a strong believer in fighting to the finish...my point was to consider alternate methods than you possibly supplying an attacker with a lethal force to use against you.
 
Not saying at all to give up. By no means is that implied. I am a strong believer in fighting to the finish...my point was to consider alternate methods than you possibly supplying an attacker with a lethal force to use against you

DO NOT ATTEMPT TO DRAW A WEAPON IF YOU ARE WITHIN 30ft OF YOUR ATTACKER!

Conflict.

Lets look at it another way, I'm 64 years old, I have COPD, I doubt there is a bandit out there who can't out run me.

If my life is threaten'd, don't care if it's within 30 feet or not, I'll fight, I wont run.
 
Uh huh...

Ok, Darren, from a guy with a few years of wrestling and around 15 years of aikido practice... Just how long does it take you to blade your weak side toward the BG? I am guessing less than the time it takes to cover ten yards.

Blade in the weak side of the body (or pivot the strong side away - same effect but adds a little distance), strike or shove with the weak hand, while moving off the line. Works like a charm at making a disarm much more difficult.

You can draw while doing this.

It is not that hard to learn how to improve the odds.

I find your advice... interesting.
 
No offense Darren, but your posts give me the impression that you are a beginner at the novice stage.

I have to agree with that impression. Sorry, Darren, but I'm afraid you are out of your league here. There are a lot of highly-skilled shooters on this forum. You under-estimate them.
 
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1972 FBI course 1.5 seconds 5 shots of target.
2011 course 1.0 second first shot on target.
might not be as fast but I can still get it there.
 
If you are not an experienced shooter who has pratice at rapid draw and target acquisition, DO NOT ATTEMPT TO DRAW A WEAPON IF YOU ARE WITHIN 30ft OF YOUR ATTACKER! The average human can travel that distance in 1.5 seconds. that is faster than most individuals can clear a weapon and fire one unsighted shot.

"Well I guess we'll all turn in our sixguns to the bartender and start
hoeing spuds." ...... Shane

This has got to be some of the worst advice I have ever read. Having
been involved in two separate shootings in my life, both of which took
place at less than 30' I was somehow able to successfully
engage and put down both individuals. If I had taken this gentleman's
advice I would most likely be dead.
 
If I'm not mistaken, most self defense situations are within 30 feet. If the above is true, why do we bother to carry?

You could always use your handgun as a club. :o:o:o

Or just throw it at him if he is less than 30 ft away. :)
 
I make due with my adorable .32; but it's not pink...

But it should be. :cool:

There is a digi-cam pink&black AR15 at cheaperthandirt...if I ever go the AR way, it will be mine.

Taking tacti-cool to a whole different place...oh yeah. :D:D
 
3x3x3 Rule, distances...

I take issue with a few of the member's remarks but they are entitled to their opinion(s).
I stand by what I call the 3x3x3 Rule; 3 rounds in 3sec at a range of approx 3 feet.
Now, this standard applys mostly to armed citizens in a critical incident(CC license holder). Some shootings HAVE occured in different ways at longer ranges or conditions.
A few years ago, I read a gun press item that the average range for a sworn officer in the LAPD was 28 feet.
US Navy SEAL officer & CDR of SEAL-Six(AKA DevGru) Richard Marcinko, www.DickMarcinko.com , ordered his counter-terrorist SEALs to hit targets(a 3x5 card) at a range of 30ft. They used 1911a1 .45s, 9mm/M9s, SIG P226 9x19mm pistols & Smith and Wesson 4" barrel 66 .357magnum revolvers.

Massad Ayoob, noted gun writer & tactics instructor , wrote about a USAF SP(Security Police) airman who engaged a spree shooter with his M9 9mm at a documented range of 89yards.
The subject was in a USAF medical center parking lot with a AK rifle.

To me, this topic information is more about the Tueller Drill(check term) or being able to draw & fire from a holster against a violent subject with a knife or blade. That is where a person can clear 21ft in 1.5sec.

The main point is to train & prepare for a quick or violent attack.
 
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This is gettin' good!:D
 
I think we can all just chuck the guns and the CC idea and give up based on all this scientific evidence.

These cookie-cutter defense situations get a little old. Everybody's different, the situations are different and are fluid when they happen. If carrying ANY gun makes you feel better just do it, train as much as possible and keep a cool head when anything should happen. You can't contol everything but maybe you can change things a bit to your advantage.
 
The average human can travel that distance in 1.5 seconds

Hmmm... 30 feet in 1.5 seconds is 13.6 miles per hour. Have you ever tried to run 13.6 miles per hour? It's faster than you think, especially when you start from rest. A competitive sprinter runs the 100 at about 20 mph average, and the first 30 feet are the slowest.

If the bad guy was an athlete in starting blocks pointed directly at you, and you had no warning, then the 1.5 second interval might be plausible, but it really doesn't match most scenarios - where if anything, you might have the drop on him if you are at least moderately aware of your situation. Even if the dude has me in a headlock, I think I'd take my chances and use my gun.
 
"LOL you people are funny."

No sir, you are the one who is funny. You show up and start preaching and don't want to hear any back talk.

That's funny.

John
 
Criminals typically attack those who they believe are weaker than themselves.
They don't want a real fight on their hands, they want easy money, so they prey upon the weak.

This means that the average "victim" is not going to be able to out run or out fight the average "attacker".

This is why guns are so popular for self defense....they are the great equalizer.
With a gun, a 90 year old grandmother can stop a 25 year old MMA cage fighter.

People don't get mugged from 50 feet away.
Criminals will use some kind of excuse to get close to their prey.
They might ask for directions, or ask for a light, or tell you that you dropped some money, etc...
The bottom line is this:
If you are ever attacked you most likely will be forced to draw your weapon well within 30 feet of the attacker.
 
Hmmm... 30 feet in 1.5 seconds is 13.6 miles per hour. Have you ever tried to run 13.6 miles per hour? It's faster than you think, especially when you start from rest. A competitive sprinter runs the 100 at about 20 mph average, and the first 30 feet are the slowest.

This is true ... but on the other hand, a reasonable 40yd time for a freshman highschool football player is 5 seconds ... that is 1.25 seconds per 10 yds and we aren't talking world class here ... and we aren't talking a time using starting blocks. What I do know from personal experience is that I was in a pistol class that was taught by a guy who had an assistant who was in her mid 60's. As the class came to an end, he wanted to demonstrate how dangerous a person could be if they were 25 feet away and holding a knife. He had the assistant start downrange (slightly off to the side :D ) 25 feet from the firing line. We had our guns holstered (OWB) and took turns engaging a static target that was placed about 3 yds in front of us. The drill was that when the assistant started toward the firing line, we were to draw and fire at the target before she got across the firing line. Mind you, this was the last evolution of a 16 hour, 1000+ rounds fired class, so we were all pretty well warmed-up and ready. There were only 2 of us out of 10 that actually got a shot off before she crossed the line and only one of us hit COM on the target. :eek:

There were several lessons in this drill.
1. A knife wielding perp is a very real threat at 25-30 feet!
2. The element of surprise is substantial ... if the drill were reversed and she couldn't charge until we started to draw, all 10 of us would probably have scored COM hits ... many of us more than one.

NOWHERE in the lessons learned is the craziness that was stated by the OP in that inside of 30 feet you shouldn't draw ... just because she got to the line while I was drawing doesn't mean that I can't still side-step the attack to buy the extra .5 seconds I need to deliver a good controlled pair. I'm finding myself in the (increasingly) familiar position of agreeing entirely with KraigWY in his assessment. Of course you draw ... maybe you draw fast enough to be able to fire from a static position and maybe you have to parry a thrust first, but to just stand or even run once the charge has started is suicide for all but the most athletic.

The thing about running is that you have to be able to outrun the attack at all distances to win ... you have to have a better 10 yd time, a better 40yd time, a better 100yd time and a better 1/4 mile time ... if you are on a park trail, you might have to add your 1-mile time as well. All the attacker has to do is be able to keep you in sight and beat any one of your times and he wins. It isn't fair, I know ... but it is reality.

As has been said, everyone has to have their own response with which they are comfortable. Personally, I can't see a more clear signal to draw than seeing someone charge from 30 feet with a clear intent (e.g. wielding a knife) to do me or mine harm ... but that is just me.

Saands
 
Ok there is alot of people who have misunderstood my train of thought.
I am in no saying do not try to defend yourself.
Maybe I should have expanded on the original statement of don't draw if your attacker is within 30 ft. What that means is if your attacker is closing at close range, you don't want to be in the process of drawing your weapon when he reaches you. You are in a vulnerable position when you are in the drawing process.
Either gain distance, or use both your hands to try and control the initial attack. Once you have done that the chances are better that the attacker's game plan will be thrown off, which in turns increases the likelyhood that you will be able to draw your handgun in a body to body contact situation.

Everyone took one statement and interpreted it to their own view. Which apparently was that if an attacker is close to you than give up and die.
 
Waaaay too much thinking on your part! The natural fight or flight reaction will dictate that you either try to run away, or try to defend yourself in any way possible. Assessing if the assailant is within certain ranges for various reactions on your part doesn't fit into a logical response.
 
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